[Livia]

Imagine if it had been suggested in 1944 that Netherlands give up 20% of its territory to Germany.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Livia

Imagine if it had been suggested in 1944 that Netherlands give up 20% of its territory to Germany.

Great point Livia


Back then, they would say No

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Livia

Imagine if it had been suggested in 1944 that Netherlands give up 20% of its territory to Germany.

Unfortunately I don't think there's any prospect of Russia being defeated in a years time though. There is a prospect of Ukraine losing more territory

[Livia]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Unfortunately I don't think there's any prospect of Russia being defeated in a years time though. There is a prospect of Ukraine losing more territory

Yeah, it was really a dig at Red Nicky.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Livia

Yeah, it was really a dig at Red Nicky.

Ahhh, I get it!

[Sticks]

Ukraine is just another Russian province.

Russia should also demand that Zelensky be handed over to be tried for high treason.

It seems now. that Trump believes that Putin has been in the right all along and has sided with his old pal.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Sticks

Ukraine is just another Russian province.

Russia should also demand that Zelensky be handed over to be tried for high treason.

It seems now. that Trump believes that Putin has been in the right all along and has sided with his old pal.

Sticks you are so Wrong

Ukraine was part of Russia : NO MORE

[Sticks]

Originally Posted by arista

Sticks you are so Wrong

Ukraine was part of Russia : NO MORE

It still is

Their declaration of independence and others saying they are independent is meaningless

I declare you Arista are king of Jupiter

I declare I am king of Saturn

Would everyone here on this board please acknowledge our kingships, which are just as valid as anyone saying that Ukraine is independent rather than just being a province of Mother Russia.

[joeysteele]

This seems like it could be called many things but a deal FOR Ukraine it certainly is not.
It's more like a partial surrender to Putin and Russia.

Trump is pathetic.

[bots]

pride has to be swallowed to end a war and sometimes the path to that place defies normal logic.

There is an underlying problem though, if putin comes out of the war with more land, it will just embolden the russian leadership to take further action. We know what Putin's goal is. He hasn't changed from that position since he started the war. We can defeat Russia by making it bankrupt, thats the only way the west is going to win this

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by bots

pride has to be swallowed to end a war and sometimes the path to that place defies normal logic.

There is an underlying problem though, if putin comes out of the war with more land, it will just embolden the russian leadership to take further action. We know what Putin's goal is. He hasn't changed from that position since he started the war. We can defeat Russia by making it bankrupt, thats the only way the west is going to win this

doubt majority of the russian people care about gaining land though, way too many russian civilians lost their lives already, and i very much doubt Putin will be president of russia for much longer, he also isn't getting younger, and who knows what Putin's own family must be thinking about all this, i don't think his daughters would want to see their dad ending up assassinated at some point (which could happen tbh)

[emseateng2014]

how and when will the war between the 2 former ussr countries end

only time will tell

[arista]

[arista]

[arista]

"It still is"

No, Sticks
they are not part of Evil Russia anymore

[arista]

Yesterday
A reporter told President Trump
that Zelensky does not like the deal.

Trump said well, I guess they can keep on fighting?

(Of course, without USA weapon funding)

[Nicky91]

Youtube video

and elsewhere more trouble for Russia, coming from their once allies Belarus, whom also btw freed 31 more Ukrainian prisoners, they were granted pardon by president Lukashenko


Lukashenko is doing this, in hopes sanctions from the west will be lifted against his Belarus, but tbh i don't think this either is going down well for Putin and his few remaining loyalists in the government in Moscow

[Nicky91]

good on Luka anyway for seeing the light, better late than never, although this is more an ego move than anything else, basically a ''we don't owe russia anything, time we start thinking about ourselves'' sort of backstabber move

[arista]

Now, Trump is telling PM Starmer,
He must agree with his new deal with Russia-Ukraine

Or President Trump will halt intelligence sharing

[Gusto Brunt]

Originally Posted by arista

Now, Trump is telling PM Starmer,
He must agree with his new deal with Russia-Ukraine

Or President Trump will halt intelligence sharing

It's a bad 'deal' though isn't it. More like a surrender.

I cannot believe how bad it is. Even I think it's terrible and should not be accepted and I hate war!

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Gusto Brunt

It's a bad 'deal' though isn't it. More like a surrender.

I cannot believe how bad it is. Even I think it's terrible and should not be accepted and I hate war!

how is it like surrender?


as if Russia are the winning side here, i mean Lavrov is no longer on Putin's side, even Belarus are lowkey abandoning the ship



and as if Ukraine are innocents in this conflict, they too murdered russian civilians, many hundreds of them 600+

[Gusto Brunt]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

how is it like surrender?


as if Russia are the winning side here, i mean Lavrov is no longer on Putin's side, even Belarus are lowkey abandoning the ship



and as if Ukraine are innocents in this conflict, they too murdered russian civilians, many hundreds of them 600+

Ukraine is being told to give away land not yet seized by Russia and to give up most of their weapons and never join NATA. That's not a good 'deal' to me. What about the hundreds of thousands of Ukrianians who've died in battle. For nothing if they accept the 'deal' which is all for Russia.

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Gusto Brunt

Ukraine is being told to give away land not yet seized by Russia and to give up most of their weapons and never join NATA. That's not a good 'deal' to me. What about the hundreds of thousands of Ukrianians who've died in battle. For nothing if they accept the 'deal' which is all for Russia.

oh well, i can see Trump also working towards better USA-Russia relations, Trump is so great at people's skills with other strong leaders like himself, we saw that already with Kim Jong-Un and Benjamin Netanyahu

[bots]

i think europe needs to get it's act together and go it alone without the usa. We cannot rely on the usa going forward, so it's time to step up and take care of ourselves.

[arista]

Originally Posted by bots

i think europe needs to get it's act together and go it alone without the usa. We cannot rely on the usa going forward, so it's time to step up and take care of ourselves.

Yes, that could start this next week
after Trump's Thursday Deadline.