[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by lostalex

going to extremes?

you just proved what i just said. so why do black people need to driunk from the same fountains as whites? it's the same clean water right? so why are they trying to drink from OUR fountains???

tell me why. IF you don't know why it's offensive to have separate drinking fountains, well, jesus, you don't know much.

Having a different set of rules, no matter how equivelent, doesn't change the fact that it's separate, it's no different then having separate drinking fountains.

It's not different at all though, Gay people aren't forced to get married at 'gays only' locations or places seperate from straight couples and they get access to the same things as straight couples do. Everything's the same apart from the name. It's not segregation at all and you're just using hyperbole and bad examples to force your argument across.

[Shaun]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

Constantly going to extremes does nothing for your argument Alex. Segregation and Civil partnerships are two different things and comparing them seems a little desperate on your part.

Civil Partnerships and marriage offer the same benefits, a gay couple can choose to use the same venue as a straight couple, they can use the same caterers ETC and they have the same rights as straight couples. The only difference is the name which is a pointless thing to get upset about. Civil partnerships and Segregation share nothing in common.

The word 'segregation' means to separate two groups of people. Calling straight people married and homosexuals civil partners is an, admittedly small, but still an unfair, distinction.

[Shaun]

He's making good points, just in a really rude and confrontational way, and it's this kind of attitude that's really setting the whole LGBT movement back. There seems to be this belief that gays/bis/transgenders are being really vehement and angry, but it all boils down to wanting equality. I do wish more people would remember that instead of dismissing these issues as "irrelevant to me" or whatever.

[Marsh.]

My point about being TOO passionate about a title. When that's all it is, a title, isn't the most important thing in the world suddenly equates to me thinking his rights don't matter? lol

My entire point was that gay people (in places that allow the civil partnerships) DO HAVE THE SAME BLOODY RIGHTS. It's the furore over the title I find a huge overreaction.

The anger coming from lostalex, I'm not associating with LGBT. It's the same thing he always does in every discussion he takes part in on the forum. Throws insults around instead of calming down and discussing. Making assumptions about people using the most extreme examples that have sweet FA to do with anything.

This stance I have makes me as 'evil as KKK', 'a disgusting bigot', and want black people to drink different water to white people.
HE is the most offensive, ill-mannered person I've ever come across and I've never met him. lol

I've said my peace, I'm done.

[MTVN]

Most of the arguments against it seem pretty flimsy to me, they talk about "the sanctity of marriage" but the ways in which marriage is viewed have constantly evolved throughout history, people used to often just marry for status, for money, for power, it would have to be someone from the same class, girls would be forced to marry from a young age etc. etc. a lot of social limitations that were imposed on marriage have been removed and there's no reason why allowing gays to marry can't be the next step in that evolution. It seems pretty ridiculous that Church leaders would consider it more socially acceptable for Kim Kardashian to marry and divorced within a couple of months than than for two men/women who are actually in a proper, stable relationship to marry

[Marsh.]

That's where it gets more complicated though. It isn't "the church" it's a specific religion. They all differ on their rules and rights.

Not all of them would be accepting of someone like Kim Kardashian.

[MTVN]

By the Church I meant the CoE

[Redway]

Originally Posted by Toxic

But you can't disagree with it, they were born that way. Would you disagree with a black man for being black? No, and yes it is the same.

Bigot.

As I said, it's what gay people do . I don't care but others clearly do and they deserve a view and you can't decide to hate on people just because you don't like their views.

Originally Posted by lostalex

it matters because i havn't heard you defending people's "opinions" agaist yur white str8 christian friends that do wrong things.

If i was a muslim that said "i have a right to disagree with white christians" and therefore we should take rights away from str8 white christians, would you be defending that??? i don't think so. you'd be outraged, and you wouldn't be defending their right to bigotry.

WHy arn't you defending the muslims that want sharia law then? it's just their opinions right??

would you defend a law that said all women should wear a burqa just cause some epople have an "opinion" that women should be covered up??

First of all, don't you talk to me in text speak. It's incredibly irritating and difficult to read and I'm sure there are rules on this sort of thing.

Secondly, you're missing my point. I said that if people disagree with something but still back it up with rights then where's the problem? For example, if somebody believes that being gay is wrong but also believes that they should have rights what's the problem?

See? This is what we have to put up with on this forum. You can't even have the decency to be nice. You have to be rude and confrontational. That's what we don't like about you.

The colour of someone's skin is totally unrelated in terms of correlation to this argument. You accuse me of being a hateful homophobic bigot one more time and I will make sure you'll never want to see my username again.

Finally, I'd like to know how I can be homophobic when I said

I voted 'yes' on the poll. As long as somebody's beliefs, sexuality, lifestyle, etc, doesn't harm me in any way I fail to see any problem - it's their life, not mine. I really don't see why anybody would say otherwise.

[Redway]

Just checked my private messages. He's sent me a PM calling me a bigot once more.

[Vanessa]

Originally Posted by Redway

Just checked my private messages. He's sent me a PM calling me a bigot once more.

Omg! Toxic is living up to his name!

[Redway]

Originally Posted by Vanessa

Omg! Toxic is living up to his name!

I'm on about lostalex here, Vanessa.

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by Redway

First of all, don't you talk to me in text speak. It's incredibly irritating and difficult to read

This.

[Mystic Mock]

Well I believe that if two homosexuals loved each other so much that they wanted to marry each other then I don't see the problem with them getting married.

[Toxic]

The whole "In the eyes of God marriage is between a man and a woman" argument has absolutely NO substance.

First of all, the bible says a man should not lie with another man - does that mean two straight men couldn't share a bed, or a tent? You can interpret that how ever you want, people who are anti gay purposely interpret that as meaning gay people are immoral.

Also, if we are going to follow the bible literally then people are not allowed to eat shellfish or they will be put to death and people can't wear an outfit with more than one fabric - so better get searching for some cotton shirt, trousers, socks and shoes to wear!

I find it hilarious how religious people bring up the bible to defend their bigotry/ignorance, and choose to ignore other aspects of the bible because it's an inconvenience to their lives.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Toxic

The whole "In the eyes of God marriage is between a man and a woman" argument has absolutely NO substance.

First of all, the bible says a man should not lie with another man - does that mean two straight men couldn't share a bed, or a tent? You can interpret that how ever you want, people who are anti gay purposely interpret that as meaning gay people are immoral.

Also, if we are going to follow the bible literally then people are not allowed to eat shellfish or they will be put to death and people can't wear an outfit with more than one fabric - so better get searching for some cotton shirt, trousers, socks and shoes to wear!

I find it hilarious how religious people bring up the bible to defend their bigotry/ignorance, and choose to ignore other aspects of the bible because it's an inconvenience to their lives.

The Bible does have it's inaccuracies, but I don't get why some people are homophobic just for thinking that the KKK are worse than homophobics that don't go out of there way to harm gay people which was what Lostalex was implying.

[Mystic Mock]

I've got to say why open up a thread if people can't have different opinions? Lostalex is completely overreacting and comparing it to the KKK?

[Toxic]

Originally Posted by The Mockinator

I've got to say why open up a thread if people can't have different opinions? Lostalex is completely overreacting and comparing it to the KKK?

Top be fair, Lostalex is getting so worked up because of the complete ignorance of some members.

I agree that it isn't the same as the KKK, although there are groups in the world who actively seek to abuse gay people.

The ideologies behind some people in regards to gay people are similar to those of the KKK.

[Toxic]

Yep.

Some members have been using the argument that it's alright to disagree with homosexuality - which it isn't because being gay is something people are born with, it's the same as being born with brown/blonde/ginger hair.

Other members have posted down right offensive stuff, such as saying "gay marriage is for fags" and "I think gay people are cute with their little pugs because they can't reproduce.....don't blame me, blame god".

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Toxic

Yep.

Some members have been using the argument that it's alright to disagree with homosexuality - which it isn't because being gay is something people are born with, it's the same as being born with brown/blonde/ginger hair.

Other members have posted down right offensive stuff, such as saying "gay marriage is for fags" and "I think gay people are cute with their little pugs because they can't reproduce.....don't blame me, blame god".

I haven't once seen any posts like that on this thread so don't make up stuff.

And i've known loads of people that hate gingers as they get called by some of my friends.

[Toxic]

Originally Posted by The Mockinator

I haven't once seen any posts like that on this thread so don't make up stuff.

And i've known loads of people that hate gingers as they get called by some of my friends.

Ermmmm those comments were not made up at all, they were deleted last night when I first made the thread.

[Marsh.]

Bow down to the perfection that is Toxic.

Don't open a thread asking for opinions if you think people can't disagree with it. And yet you say other people have ignorance.

[Redway]

Toxic, if you don't want our opinions then don't make this sort of thread because that's what we're here to do.

Also, don't try and defend the indefensible. lostalex's behaviour was completely unacceptable and childish.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Redway

Toxic, if you don't want our opinions then don't make this sort of thread because that's what we're here to do.

Also, don't try and defend the indefensible. lostalex's behaviour was completely unacceptable and childish.

I 100% agree with you.

And Toxic, I haven't seen one member on here being ignorant about gay people, and I know that there are groups out there hurting gay people just because they are gay, and I agree that they are just as bad as the KKK but that wasn't the point given to Lostalex, the point given to Lostalex was that some people like gay people but don't understand homosexuality which Redway was fairly pointing out.

Then we move onto Lostalex's rudeness to Niamh for only pointing out what's the difference between Marriage and Civil Partnership, tbf not everybody knows the in's and out's of Civil Partnership yet Lostalex went on a weird rampage saying it's marriage in God's eyes but not in the Governments.

[Toxic]

Originally Posted by The Mockinator

I 100% agree with you.

And Toxic, I haven't seen one member on here being ignorant about gay people, and I know that there are groups out there hurting gay people just because they are gay, and I agree that they are just as bad as the KKK but that wasn't the point given to Lostalex, the point given to Lostalex was that some people like gay people but don't understand homosexuality which Redway was fairly pointing out.

Then we move onto Lostalex's rudeness to Niamh for only pointing out what's the difference between Marriage and Civil Partnership, tbf not everybody knows the in's and out's of Civil Partnership yet Lostalex went on a weird rampage saying it's marriage in God's eyes but not in the Governments.

I just read what he said to Niamh, and I agree it was wrong, because he/she was simply asking an innocent question.

But people have been ignorant, but you can't see the comments because they got deleted.

[Toxic]

Originally Posted by 08marsh

Bow down to the perfection that is Toxic.

Don't open a thread asking for opinions if you think people can't disagree with it. And yet you say other people have ignorance.

I opened up a thread for debate, and if I disagree with what people say...I'm going to argue my view point.

This whole forum section is appropriately named 'Serious DEBATES & News Stories' - a debate is when people discuss a subject and give their own views/opinions which are bound to conflict.

What your saying is people should post their views and then have zero discussion about it afterwards, what's the point in that?