[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Livia

Even after all these years I can't get my head around it... that poor child.

Hi Livia,yes if only people knew the half of it, hope you arewell

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Hi Livia,yes if only people knew the half of it, hope you arewell

Hey Kaz, I'm good thanks. Hope you are...

I thought of you when I heard this story on the news. Is there no decency left in this disgusting, self-centred, money-and-fame-hungry world?

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Hi Livia,yes if only people knew the half of it, hope you arewell

Oh the old "I know more about this than you do" comment.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Oh the old "I know more about this than you do" comment.

In this situation I think Kazanne actually does though.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

In this situation I think Kazanne actually does though.

Of course she does. And she's a mum too so she gets extra powers too.

[Twosugars]

it is hard on the family, but I'm on the side of the film makers
I doubt the film is trivial as somebody put it or that money was the main reason for making it. The subject is too grim to expect it'll be a commercial success imo. Maybe the director felt he had something to say or that it needed to be made? Idk
I think this is one of those cases that transcend a private tragedy and become a part of our common consciousness and history. And as such it is bound to register in culture and become a tale told and retold.

[Northern Monkey]

This was possibly the worst event I remember in Britain in my lifetime and thinking about it still gives me cold chills.
Couldn’t even imagine how his parents must’ve felt and still do.

Obviously the film maker was allowed to make this.BUT the total lack of respect or empathy in doing so without even asking the parents is astounding.Wtf was he/she thinking?
Was it all about the art?,Trying to make a name for themself or money?
Whatever it was doesn’t make it alright imo.
There’s some **** that you just don’t touch and to me that’s one of them.
I am usually totally against censorship and wouldn’t advocate for it but i think the filmmakers were out of line on this.

[AnnieK]

The James Bulger case marked a changing time in Britain. Before he was abducted and murdered, people left their kids outside shops (not that Denise did that even) and were a little more relaxed about things, this case changed all that and people started to fear more for their children. I don't agree with the points that you have to be a parent to understand the loss, you may feel it more keenly as you go through "what if it happened to mine" scenario but I think most people can understand the absolute devastating heartbreaking and life changing effect losing a child would have.

I'm in two minds about the film - I have read both Ralph and Denise's books and they are heartbreaking but only come from one perspective. I would be interested to see how the murderers handled the police interviews, how the police themselves handled it and to see if there was any indication if they comprehended how horrifically evil the acts they committed that day were.

I suppose the worry is that the watcher would feel some sympathy for them if they are acted by children but the fact is, that is who committed the murder and we all know their ages at the time, I doubt many would feel any sympathy now - especially with the way Venables in particular has turned out after release. In some ways if their evilness is apparent, Denise's campaign to keep him locked up may gain even more support.

So I'm on the fence on this one - although it is fundamentally wrong that the family were not consulted about the film

[The Slim Reaper]

Originally Posted by AnnieK

The James Bulger case marked a changing time in Britain. Before he was abducted and murdered, people left their kids outside shops (not that Denise did that even) and were a little more relaxed about things, this case changed all that and people started to fear more for their children. I don't agree with the points that you have to be a parent to understand the loss, you may feel it more keenly as you go through "what if it happened to mine" scenario but I think most people can understand the absolute devastating heartbreaking and life changing effect losing a child would have.

I'm in two minds about the film - I have read both Ralph and Denise's books and they are heartbreaking but only come from one perspective. I would be interested to see how the murderers handled the police interviews, how the police themselves handled it and to see if there was any indication if they comprehended how horrifically evil the acts they committed that day were.

I suppose the worry is that the watcher would feel some sympathy for them if they are acted by children but the fact is, that is who committed the murder and we all know their ages at the time, I doubt many would feel any sympathy now - especially with the way Venables in particular has turned out after release. In some ways if their evilness is apparent, Denise's campaign to keep him locked up may gain even more support.

So I'm on the fence on this one - although it is fundamentally wrong that the family were not consulted about the film

There are some good docs on YT about it. I watched one ages ago with the police and the boys' solicitors talking about all the stuff you said you're interested in finding out about. You should have a look.


Edit:

Think it was this one

Youtube video

[Braden]

I think she has every right to be upset that the film went ahead without being consulted first, but agree that the attention it's been given is primarily as a result of her reaction. On the other hand, I did sign the petition to have it removed from the shortlist and many other people did too. Her reaction was a conviction to have this film removed from the public eye and nothing more, imo. The media have pounced on it, as they do. I don't agree, at all, that she thrives off attention.

I can't imagine how much this situation has affected her life. The number of interviews, books, etc. could be due to the grief and personal blame she puts on herself. Almost like a way of constant reassurance to both herself and the public that she'll always be in a state of regret over what happened that day. It's her way of maintaining the slightest bit of closure.

[RileyH]

Some of y'all are mean wow

[RileyH]

It's her child's murder they made a film on and they didn't even consult her first? Of course she's gonna be pissed

[AnnieK]

#ibelievekaz

[Niamh.]

#metoo

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by The Slim Reaper

#justice4Kaz

Originally Posted by AnnieK

#ibelievekaz

Originally Posted by Niamh.

#metoo

[Kazanne]

When I first joined this site in 2009, I joined with an avatar of James in my profile, as I have always been a supporter of the family, as my mom is close to this case,some on here then started to question why I had a picture of a dead baby in my profile,I explained my feelings then and why ,some of the longer standing members may still remember, I took the picture down as some seem offended by it, but I have and always will be behind the Bulger family as they have been through a truly terrible time , and it's not a new thing with me I have been a supporter for years.

[AnnieK]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

When I first joined this site in 2009, I joined with an avatar of James in my profile, as I have always been a supporter of the family, as my mom is close to this case,some on here then started to question why I had a picture of a dead baby in my profile,I explained my feelings then and why ,some of the longer standing members may still remember, I took the picture down as some seem offended by it, but I have and always will be behind the Bulger family as they have been through a truly terrible time , and it's not a new thing with me I have been a supporter for years.

[Matthew.]

Yeah the family definitely should have been asked first

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

When I first joined this site in 2009, I joined with an avatar of James in my profile, as I have always been a supporter of the family, as my mom is close to this case,some on here then started to question why I had a picture of a dead baby in my profile,I explained my feelings then and why ,some of the longer standing members may still remember, I took the picture down as some seem offended by it, but I have and always will be behind the Bulger family as they have been through a truly terrible time , and it's not a new thing with me I have been a supporter for years.

I've been on the forum long enough to know full well you're a long time supporter of the family.

Again, that doesn't make your opinions more valid than anyone else's on Bulger related topics, anymore than someone who has given birth.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

I've been on the forum long enough to know full well you're a long time supporter of the family.



Again, that doesn't make your opinions more valid than anyone else's on Bulger related topics, anymore than someone who has given birth.

I dunno why you have such a chip on your shoulder about the parenting thing Marsh; it's perfectly legitimate (and logical) to say that someone who is a parent and has a child has a more experienced and informed opinion on matters related to being a parent or having children?

Why would that not be the case?

And why make comments like "it's not big or clever to pop out a child! Thick folks can have kids too!"

Like... Thick people learn to drive too. It's not big or clever to learn to drive, basically anyone can do it. But that doesn't mean that the opinion of a driver isn't better informed than a non-driver in a discussion about road etiquette. It's not that other people can't have an opinion or that their opinion might not be correct or valid, or that a driver can't be totally wrong about some topics (God knows, there are plenty of disagreements) it's just pretty obvious that there IS a difference between the opinions. Surely.

I mean you can say it about anything! Building a PC isn't hard. Look at a few YouTube videos and BillyBob with an IQ of 80 can do it but once he's done it, his advice on building one yourself is going to be better than a certified genius who has never even looked inside one?

These are probably crap examples but you can see my point. Surely.

Its ludicrous for people to say "I don't have any kids but I know just as much about how a parent feels for their children as those who do!". Like... How? And how could you possibly know if that statement is true?

I can say with some certainty - as a parent and a self confessed ex-non parent (I spend decades being one of those ) that while yes as a non-parent it's perfectly possible to empathise with the emotions that a parent feels about their offspring... It's not the same as having them. It just isn't. And you also sort of have to accept that every parent has BOTH perspectives because every parent HAS BEEN a non parent, whereas obviously, those who are not parents only have ONE perspective and can only possibly be guessing about the other.

So no its not big, it's not clever, it's not difficult to have kids, it's not a "moral victory" or any sort of achievement but it does usually result in a shift in perspective. I don't know why so many non-parents take issue with that.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I dunno why you have such a chip on your shoulder about the parenting thing Marsh; it's perfectly legitimate (and logical) to say that someone who is a parent and has a child has a more experienced and informed opinion on matters related to being a parent or having children?

Why would that not be the case?

Except... we're not discussing how to raise a child, how formula works, the best brand of nappies or the best education system.

We're discussing a murder. So, no, I won't be told my opinion isn't as valid as someone who has had a child because it's complete bollocks. We can ALL relate to losing loved ones, as Livia said you don't have to be a parent to know or understand or comprehend the loss of a child. It's universal.

But, yeah, maybe the magical superiority that enters a person once they've had sex and conceived a child means the ones murdered by their parents are right too.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Except... we're not discussing how to raise a child, how formula works, the best brand of nappies or the best education system.

We're discussing a murder. So, no, I won't be told my opinion isn't as valid as someone who has had a child because it's complete bollocks. We can ALL relate to losing loved ones, as Livia said you don't have to be a parent to know or understand or comprehend the loss of a child. It's universal.

But, yeah, maybe the magical superiority that enters a person once they've had sex and conceived a child means the ones murdered by their parents are right too.

I disagree but I fully accept that you have a different opinion; I just cannot fathom why you're salty enough about it to be unable to even debate it reasonably and without the 'tude.

Maybe becoming a parent makes one more mature in that way, too .

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

So no its not big, it's not clever, it's not difficult to have kids, it's not a "moral victory" or any sort of achievement but it does usually result in a shift in perspective. I don't know why so many non-parents take issue with that.

Has nothing to do with having kids.

A lot of parents don't have that perspective and a lot of non-parents do. Having a child simply isn't a valid argument in this case.

Next you'll be telling me age denotes maturity.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Has nothing to do with having kids.



A lot of parents don't have that perspective and a lot of non-parents do. Having a child simply isn't a valid argument in this case.



Next you'll be telling me age denotes maturity.

Again you're stating your opinions as fact; you don't (and can't possibly) know if and how your life perspectives will change if or when you have children. It's literally impossible. It can only be hypothesis?

[Amy Jade]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

When I first joined this site in 2009, I joined with an avatar of James in my profile, as I have always been a supporter of the family, as my mom is close to this case,some on here then started to question why I had a picture of a dead baby in my profile,I explained my feelings then and why ,some of the longer standing members may still remember, I took the picture down as some seem offended by it, but I have and always will be behind the Bulger family as they have been through a truly terrible time , and it's not a new thing with me I have been a supporter for years.

It's unfair you felt you had to remove it, whoever was offended is a bit silly in my opinion - if something is close to your heart it is normal to have a picture of it as an avi surely