[stonedape]

all marriages are on the decrease, especially with increased education.

and to starry, I would much rather a child be with two sane homosexual men than two insane religious former addicts that happen to be straight like David & Whoever. Or two straight people that get in fights constantly and divorce with kids. My point is that your mental and physical ability should be the #1 criteria, not gender. I just dont get the genitalia obsession, like it matters in reality.

[starry]

It isn't just about genitals that is a ridiculous simplification. Although I suppose some transsexuals may look at it like that.

And yes of course you can have bad parents of whatever type, but that is just trying to confuse the issue with some other unconnected particulars. You might have some homosexual couple who are religious addicts of some type too I suppose.

[stonedape]

Unconnected particulars? How about totally connected particulars? We're talking about what makes a bad parent or a parent of "less priority", and I'm saying sanity has much more to do with raising kids than anything else. And the strength of your marriage vows. Of course many homosexual couples should NOT have children, just like many straight couples. These are not far off abstractions...my examples were excessive religiosity and divorce, very common traits that I find more practically harmful to a child than being around untraditional gender roles.

[starry]

Originally Posted by stonedape

Unconnected particulars? How about totally connected particulars? We're talking about what makes a bad parent or a parent of "less priority", and I'm saying sanity has much more to do with raising kids than anything else. And the strength of your marriage vows. Of course many homosexual couples should NOT have children, just like many straight couples. These are not far off abstractions...my examples were excessive religiosity and divorce, very common traits that I find more practically harmful to a child than being around untraditional gender roles.

There may be other things that could be potentially more harmful (or less harmful), really it depends on the individual situation. But that's still a completely different issue.

And it's not about simply gender 'roles'. Men and women are different, some genes are different, the brains are different in some ways. The fact is - whether you like it or not - every child is born with a mother and a father.

[ChristmasNeeve]

well he's sure as hell going to have lost alot of public support there!

[Christmas Dynasnow]

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

well he's sure as hell going to have lost alot of public support there!

who?

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

who?

Well, seeing as this Thread is about Dave, who do you think?????

[BJ]

I'm celebrating my 41st wedding anniversary today so I obviously agree with marriage. I believe civil services are right for all sorts of reasons and hope that in future gays will be allowed to marry if they want to.

Dave has his Christian beliefs, to which he equally entitled and it's just that he didn't want to cause conflict by saying any more. Actually, I think, the same as he didn't chose Govan to be up for eviction because he thought it would make him unpopular

[karezza]

Homosexuality is antiChristian. David is entitled to his views.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by karezza

Homosexuality is antiChristian. David is entitled to his views.

of course he is but it's still going to make him unpopular with alot of the viewing public!

[Robertocarlo]

Originally Posted by karezza

Homosexuality is antiChristian. David is entitled to his views.

Yes, and it wasn't so long ago (the 19th century and before) that Christians justified slavery and their apalling of people based on their colour?

Fortunately, we live in more enlightened times so eventually the Church will realise that Gays and Lesbians are born that way and it isn't about a lifestyle choice, far from it, then there will be the same apologies for the horrendous way in which Gays and Lesbians have been treated just the same as the way black people were treated, ALL justified by some obscure passages in the Bible.

[MojoNixon]

Originally Posted by Robertocarlo

Yes, and it wasn't so long ago (the 19th century and before) that Christians justified slavery and their apalling of people based on their colour?

Fortunately, we live in more enlightened times so eventually the Church will realise that Gays and Lesbians are born that way and it isn't about a lifestyle choice, far from it, then there will be the same apologies for the horrendous way in which Gays and Lesbians have been treated just the same as the way black people were treated, ALL justified by some obscure passages in the Bible.

Like muslims too?

[monx]

Unfortunately organised judeo-christian, muslim and various other religions are all based on holy books written centuries ago.

The morality taught in these books are based on a society where there was no secular law and the masses needed to be controlled, the way they did this was by promising a heavenly afterlife as long as you followed the rules whilst you are alive.

Society has (in some ways) progressed and same sex relationships are more acceptable to the majority of people. There have been some concessions in civil law to the validity of those relationships but still the religions stick to outdated and unfair doctrines that have little or nothing to do with modern life.

Being homosexual is not a life choice, there is no choice in the matter you either are or are not. The only thing that is near a choice, is to live your life to the full or live a lie and conform.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and whilst Dave says he loves everyone and has no problem with gays he just wont marry them, I find that even if he felt comfortable doing it the scriptures around which he has built his physical and spiritual life around see it as an abomination. He is in a very difficult position and I dont dislike him for being truthful.

I just wish people who seek enlightenment actually find it!

[Angus]

Originally Posted by monx

Unfortunately organised judeo-christian, muslim and various other religions are all based on holy books written centuries ago.

The morality taught in these books are based on a society where there was no secular law and the masses needed to be controlled, the way they did this was by promising a heavenly afterlife as long as you followed the rules whilst you are alive.

Society has (in some ways) progressed and same sex relationships are more acceptable to the majority of people. There have been some concessions in civil law to the validity of those relationships but still the religions stick to outdated and unfair doctrines that have little or nothing to do with modern life.

Being homosexual is not a life choice, there is no choice in the matter you either are or are not. The only thing that is near a choice, is to live your life to the full or live a lie and conform.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and whilst Dave says he loves everyone and has no problem with gays he just wont marry them, I find that even if he felt comfortable doing it the scriptures around which he has built his physical and spiritual life around see it as an abomination. He is in a very difficult position and I dont dislike him for being truthful.

I just wish people who seek enlightenment actually find it!

I totally agree with you, but there are countless millions who follow a religion and it is, after all, their choice. I choose not to, but I don't make a point of denigrating other people's beliefs, nor do I expect them to compromise their religious beliefs to accommodate my secular ones.

[Angus]

Originally Posted by monx

Unfortunately organised judeo-christian, muslim and various other religions are all based on holy books written centuries ago.

The morality taught in these books are based on a society where there was no secular law and the masses needed to be controlled, the way they did this was by promising a heavenly afterlife as long as you followed the rules whilst you are alive.

Society has (in some ways) progressed and same sex relationships are more acceptable to the majority of people. There have been some concessions in civil law to the validity of those relationships but still the religions stick to outdated and unfair doctrines that have little or nothing to do with modern life.

Being homosexual is not a life choice, there is no choice in the matter you either are or are not. The only thing that is near a choice, is to live your life to the full or live a lie and conform.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and whilst Dave says he loves everyone and has no problem with gays he just wont marry them, I find that even if he felt comfortable doing it the scriptures around which he has built his physical and spiritual life around see it as an abomination. He is in a very difficult position and I dont dislike him for being truthful.

I just wish people who seek enlightenment actually find it!

I totally agree with you, but there are countless millions who follow a religion and it is, after all, their choice. I choose not to, but I don't make a point of denigrating other people's beliefs, nor do I expect them to compromise their religious beliefs to accommodate my secular ones.

[Chuckyegg]

Being straight is no more or less natural that being gay - it's just more common.

It's incredibly patronising to have someone feel sorry for your sexuality - but the fact that he is being told to do so (by whoever wrote the bible) kind of balances it back again.

[MojoNixon]

Originally Posted by Chuckyegg

Being straight isn't natural - it's just very common.

It's incredibly patronising to have someone feel sorry for your sexuality - but the fact that he is being told to do so (by whoever wrote the bible) kind of balances it back again.

So if you hetero, you are sick? And if you wanna suck and hump someones tailpipe (same gender that is), it is normal? Ok...i did not know i was wrong.

[Chuckyegg]

Originally Posted by MojoNixon

So if you hetero, you are sick? And if you wanna suck and hump someones tailpipe (same gender that is), it is normal? Ok...i did not know i was wrong.

er....what?

Ok, I simplified my previous comment for the hard of learning.

[jimbobster]

Originally Posted by Chuckyegg

Being straight isn't natural - it's just very common.

It's incredibly patronising to have someone feel sorry for your sexuality - but the fact that he is being told to do so (by whoever wrote the bible) kind of balances it back again.

what kind of wierd world do you live in, God never made Adam and Steve or Eve and Eva lmfao, you need a man and woman to have intercourse to have a child and thats what you call natural. If the whole world was gay humans would be exstincted like dinosuars lol. At the end of the day we all know being gay is wrong but sum do it, but its not our duty to judge them as they will have to face the Creator one day and will have to answer for their actions on Earth and as far as i care they can do what they want aslong as they dont put it in my face or influence my children.

peace

above are my personal voiews just like evryone is entitled to a view.

[Chuckyegg]

Originally Posted by jimbobster

what kind of wierd world do you live in, God never made Adam and Steve or Eve and Eva lmfao, you need a man and woman to have intercourse to have a child and thats what you call natural. If the whole world was gay humans would be exstincted like dinosuars lol. At the end of the day we all know being gay is wrong but sum do it, but its not our duty to judge them as they will have to face the Creator one day and will have to answer for their actions on Earth and as far as i care they can do what they want aslong as they dont put it in my face or influence my children.

peace

above are my personal voiews just like evryone is entitled to a view.

A straight couple created me.

I don't think I need advice on what's normal from someone who thinks Adam and Eve were real.

I've blocked you.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by jimbobster

what kind of wierd world do you live in, God never made Adam and Steve or Eve and Eva lmfao, you need a man and woman to have intercourse to have a child and thats what you call natural. If the whole world was gay humans would be exstincted like dinosuars lol. At the end of the day we all know being gay is wrong but sum do it, but its not our duty to judge them as they will have to face the Creator one day and will have to answer for their actions on Earth and as far as i care they can do what they want aslong as they dont put it in my face or influence my children.

peace

above are my personal voiews just like evryone is entitled to a view.

You believe in Adam and Eve?

[Christmas Dynasnow]

there are men and there are women


sexual proclivity is a personal thing. men and women mate to make more men and women

that is the natural order that has evolved

no one knows why a small minority of humans prefer their own kind sexually, it may be the way they are brought up.

[jimbobster]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

there are men and there are women


sexual proclivity is a personal thing. men and women mate to make more men and women

that is the natural order that has evolved

no one knows why a small minority of humans prefer their own kind sexually, it may be the way they are brought up.

maybe a chemical imbalance in the brain?? who knows but its wierd to me

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

there are men and there are women


sexual proclivity is a personal thing. men and women mate to make more men and women

that is the natural order that has evolved

no one knows why a small minority of humans prefer their own kind sexually, it may be the way they are brought up.

The world is very well populated, infact over populated so being Gay is probably a good thing for the planet!

[Chuckyegg]

Gays, along with religious folk and those unable to concieve are all playing thier part in the population control. It's the same in the animal kingdom. Though admittedly, there are not many Swan Nuns.