[Daniel-X]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

and that reply is your idea of a debate?

No I just can't take your reply serious enough to bother debating with it

[Scarlett.]

This forum is obsessed with religion bashing, lol.

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by lostalex

we take the piss out of religion because it's ridiculous. there is nothing respectable about a religion that has spent thousands of years oppressing people, spreading racism, sexism and homophobia. we take that kind of oppression very seriously in the SERIOUS DEBATE section of the forum.

If you want to have a thread to just say nice things about religion, go to general chat, and i promise i won't bother you. You won't see me post there at all.

Can I just say something?

I have friends who are strongly religious - christians who pray every day&night, muslims who wear the hijab and pray throughout the day, a hindu friend who is a really lovely person..

NONE of these people have ever suggested to me that being gay is wrong. They love and embrace me for who I am, as I do them. Funnily enough, most of the homophobic remarks I have thrown at me in life come from atheists.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Daniel-X

No I just can't take your reply serious enough to bother debating with it

No Daniel you cant debate it that is why you are getting angry, and frankly I know you cant defend your beliefs as they have no evidential basis other than a bible and that is insufficient and has been for a long, long time.

[Jack_]

Organised religion? No. One's personal and private faith? Yes.

I have nothing against religious people and can absolutely see the benefits it provides individuals with a sense of comfort and belonging - it is not for me and I struggle to ever believe any of it - but if it makes you happy, that's your prerogative.

However when religion is involved in the state, has influence upon politics, is rooted in law, causes international conflicts, terrorism...I have a problem.

Religion should be a personal, private and individualistic choice of faith. Nothing more, nothing less.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by Daniel-X

You keep persisting that this is the part of the forum for debates. I'm sorry but the first paragraph you posted saying that there is nothing respectable about my religion is so ****ing ignorant.

My religion is not ridiculous YOU are!

this is the debates section. We debate IDEAS and IDEALOGIES. I have not said anything personally attacking you or anyone else., just attacking the absolutely EVIL ideas of your religions.

This part of the forum is about debating the ideologies, and religions are all based on hateful exclusionary evil ideologies, IMO.

[VanessaFeltz.]

Some people have so much hate in them to the point they attack other users for no reason... really sad.

[Daniel-X]

You can't make everything so black and white also and throw everybody in the same boat. I think you are forgetting that some Christians like myself don't take the bible word for word but some do.

Not everything is so plain and simple

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

Can I just say something?

I have friends who are strongly religious - christians who pray every day&night, muslims who wear the hijab and pray throughout the day, a hindu friend who is a really lovely person..

NONE of these people have ever suggested to me that being gay is wrong. They love and embrace me for who I am, as I do them. Funnily enough, most of the homophobic remarks I have thrown at me in life come from atheists.

He is talking about the views and teachings about homosexuals in the koran and bible. they dont make good reading.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by MelihV

Some people have so much hate in them to the point they attack other users for no reason... really sad.

I haven't seen anyone attack another user. All of the attacks have been on ideologies and belief systems.
I have seen some users try to shut down the debate when it wasn't going in their way though.

Censorship is another part of most religions, so it's not surprising that it's the religious people trying to get the thread shut down to censor the ideas they don't like.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Daniel-X

You can't make everything so black and white also and throw everybody in the same boat. I think you are forgetting that some Christians like myself don't take the bible word for word but some do.

Not everything is so plain and simple

Have you actually read the bible?

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

He is talking about the views and teachings about homosexuals in the koran and bible. they dont make good reading.

Matthew 7 - "7 Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."

Koran (idk what verse this is) - "O you who believe, let not a people ridicule [another] people; perhaps they may be better than them; nor let women ridicule [other] women; perhaps they may be better than them. And do not insult one another and do not call each other by [offensive] nicknames. Wretched is the name of disobedience after [one's] faith. And whoever does not repent - then it is those who are the wrongdoers."

also "Is not Allah the wiset of Judges?"
At-Tin 95 Verse 8

[Daniel-X]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Have you actually read the bible?

Yes I have, I have one in my bedroom and regularly we look at them in school o help us with our work Guess what? I go to a Catholic school I guess maybe that is evil also and I should move schools...

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by JoshBB

Matthew 7 - "7 Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."

Koran (idk what verse this is) - "O you who believe, let not a people ridicule [another] people; perhaps they may be better than them; nor let women ridicule [other] women; perhaps they may be better than them. And do not insult one another and do not call each other by [offensive] nicknames. Wretched is the name of disobedience after [one's] faith. And whoever does not repent - then it is those who are the wrongdoers."

also "Is not Allah the wiset of Judges?"
At-Tin 95 Verse 8

Josh anyone can quote lines of any large book to suit there means but if you are trying to say that Islam and Christianity are gay friendly then I am afraid you are making an error


Did you not see what happened to the senior Vatican priest who came out this week?


He was immediately sacked


what does that tell you?

[Jack_]

Oh, and faith schools should absolutely not exist.

Almost, but not quite as bad as private schools.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Daniel-X

Yes I have, I have one in my bedroom and regularly we look at them in school o help us with our work Guess what? I go to a Catholic school I guess maybe that is evil also and I should move schools...

Reading snippets is not what I mean. Have you read all of the OT for example and then all of the NT - I have,have you?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

Correct me if i'm wrong but that was 500 years ago?
It does'nt quite fit with the thread title 'Should any religion be taken seriously in the year 2015?'

You are confused truly, the premise of religion is that you should follow a book/books constructed millennia ago is it not?
It's as apt now as it was then, used as a tool of social control by the powers that be and little more.

[JoshBB]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Josh anyone can quote lines of any large book to suit there means but if you are trying to say that Islam and Christianity are gay friendly then I am afraid you are making an error


Did you not see what happened to the senior Vatican priest who came out this week?


He was immediately sacked


what does that tell you?

It tells me that the people who sacked him don't know their own book. It explicitly says that you shouldn't judge people because it is not your place and we're not all perfect.

Also, I haven't researched the Koran enough, but I know for a fact that there is a possibility of mistranslation with the Bible from Hebrew to English.. the trouble is that the word they translated to gay could also mean pedophile/rapist which is why it's difficult to know what they were meaning. But paired up with the 'do not judge' quote, you do the thinking..

[Daniel-X]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Reading snippets is not what I mean. Have you read all of the OT for example and then all of the NT - I have,have you?

No I haven't but I know the majority of the teachings in the bible?

Do I need to know it word for word to have a valid opinion?

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Reading snippets is not what I mean. Have you read all of the OT for example and then all of the NT - I have,have you?

I HAVE, and it's the OT is completely full of sheet. It makes no sense physically, it's clear that whoever wrote it had no concept of science or physics, there are too many examples of BS to even list, and it's full of racism, sexism homophobia and just general violent HATE.

The OT of the Bible is a disgusting hateful text that should be condemned by any sane person.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Organised religion? No. One's personal and private faith? Yes.

I have nothing against religious people and can absolutely see the benefits it provides individuals with a sense of comfort and belonging - it is not for me and I struggle to ever believe any of it - but if it makes you happy, that's your prerogative.

However when religion is involved in the state, has influence upon politics, is rooted in law, causes international conflicts, terrorism...I have a problem.

Religion should be a personal, private and individualistic choice of faith. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Daniel-X]

@lostalex all your arguments are based on EXTREMIST forms of religion also so I don't even know why I am arguing because 99% of people who believe in their religion probably are not extremists and to reiterate my former point not everything is so black and white and you can't tarnish everyone with the same brush.

[Daniel-X]

Originally Posted by lostalex

I HAVE, and it's the OT is completely full of sheet. It makes no sense physically, it's clear that whoever wrote it had no concept of science or physics, there are too many examples of BS to even list, and it's full of racism, sexism homophobia and just general violent HATE.

The OT of the Bible is a disgusting hateful text that should be condemned by any sane person.

Apparentley this isn't offensive...

[VanessaFeltz.]

Originally Posted by lostalex

I haven't seen anyone attack another user. All of the attacks have been on ideologies and belief systems.
I have seen some users try to shut down the debate when it wasn't going in their way though.

Censorship is another part of most religions, so it's not surprising that it's the religious people trying to get the thread shut down to censor the ideas they don't like.

Yes you did. You attacked me based on the people my country when we were talking about whole another subject where i was explaining my point of view without attacking you said in my country there are women who get beat for no reason to use that against me like i approve whats happening here.

And now you are attacking to another user who did not disrespecting you even though we actually have very similar views on this one, i am going to defend them because you are actually spreading hate about this topic when you have every right to hate religions due to what is happening to us minorities (I hate religion as well but i dont have to bash it) but you dont have a right to bash people.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Daniel-X

No I haven't but I know the majority of the teachings in the bible?

Do I need to know it word for word to have a valid opinion?

I think you should read it is you want to understand the over-arching messages. The OT is not the NT.


But can I ask are you happy that 2000 years ago (in the middle east) people could recall events from 100 years ago from when they lived and be trusted to write them down accurately - that people could be trusted to accurately record events based solely on hearsay?