[Niamh.]

Honestly I think people are deliberately misrepresenting what Cherie (and TS) have said, it isn't about Ann or defending her and saying she shouldn't be called out for being a bigot ........because she is, what she said is offensive and divisive. The issue is the use of sexist(and ageist) insults which are insulting to women in general, it's not ok to use racist or homophobic insults against people just because they're assholes so why doesn't the same apply about sexist slurs? It's about the use of sexist words in general as a way to insult anyone.

********I AM NOT DEFENDING ANN OR ANY OF HER VIEWS

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Honestly I think people are deliberately misrepresenting what Cherie (and TS) have said, it isn't about Ann or defending her and saying she shouldn't be called out for being a bigot ........because she is, what she said is offensive and divisive. The issue is the use of sexist(and ageist) insults which are insulting to women in general, it's not ok to use racist or homophobic insults against people just because they're assholes so why doesn't the same apply about sexist slurs? It's about the use of sexist words in general as a way to insult anyone.

********I AM NOT DEFENDING ANN OR ANY OF HER VIEWS

Thank you Niamh, a level of intelligence and critical thinking applied is always welcome

[DouglasS]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Honestly I think people are deliberately misrepresenting what Cherie (and TS) have said, it isn't about Ann or defending her and saying she shouldn't be called out for being a bigot ........because she is, what she said is offensive and divisive. The issue is the use of sexist(and ageist) insults which are insulting to women in general, it's not ok to use racist or homophobic insults against people just because they're assholes so why doesn't the same apply about sexist slurs? It's about the use of sexist words in general as a way to insult anyone.

********I AM NOT DEFENDING ANN OR ANY OF HER VIEWS

Exactly. I really struggle to follow some of the logic people have posted.

Cherie saying resorting to slurs / offensive insults to other groups of people is not the best way to go about things = not understanding the point or being homophobic According to some??

It’s the exact same logic as saying I am against animal cruelty and so that means I disagree with trans rights... (Aka no logic between the two points at all)

There is LITERALLY no logic in some posters posts in here, they have tried to put words into cheries mouth (and when called out merely state they are just posting or it’s a different battle... well no, if you’re posting nonsense expect to be called out is my view)

[Nicky91]

True Niamh


being sexist, ageist isn't good either



btw something about Ann here (source wikipedia)

Religious views
Widdecombe became an Anglican in her 30s, after a period of being an agnostic following her departure from religious schooling. Widdecombe is now a practising Roman Catholic; she converted in 1993 after leaving the Church of England. Her reasons for leaving the latter were many, as she explained to reporters from the New Statesman:

I left the Church of England because there was a huge bundle of straw. The ordination of women was the last straw, but it was only one of many. For years I had been disillusioned by the Church of England's compromising on everything. The Catholic Church doesn't care if something is unpopular.
In October 2006, she pledged to boycott British Airways for suspending a worker who refused to hide her cross. The matter was resolved when the company reversed the suspension.

In 2010, Widdecombe turned down the offer to be Britain's next ambassador to the Holy See, being prevented from accepting by suffering a detached retina. She was made a Dame of the Order of St. Gregory the Great by Pope Benedict XVI for services to politics and public life on 31 January 2013.


this does show she is very devoted to her religion, so yeah i apologize for calling her attention seeking and a troll in this thread, because i do now believe these are really her views, opinions (maybe outdated which is why i obviously disagree with them) but people like Ann are still allowed to have those views, and we have a right to disagree with them either (but i agree sexist, ageist insults are a no go for anyone)

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Nicky91

True Niamh


being sexist, ageist isn't good either



btw something about Ann here (source wikipedia)

Religious views
Widdecombe became an Anglican in her 30s, after a period of being an agnostic following her departure from religious schooling. Widdecombe is now a practising Roman Catholic; she converted in 1993 after leaving the Church of England. Her reasons for leaving the latter were many, as she explained to reporters from the New Statesman:

I left the Church of England because there was a huge bundle of straw. The ordination of women was the last straw, but it was only one of many. For years I had been disillusioned by the Church of England's compromising on everything. The Catholic Church doesn't care if something is unpopular.
In October 2006, she pledged to boycott British Airways for suspending a worker who refused to hide her cross. The matter was resolved when the company reversed the suspension.

In 2010, Widdecombe turned down the offer to be Britain's next ambassador to the Holy See, being prevented from accepting by suffering a detached retina. She was made a Dame of the Order of St. Gregory the Great by Pope Benedict XVI for services to politics and public life on 31 January 2013.


this does show she is very devoted to her religion, so yeah i apologize for calling her attention seeking and a troll in this thread, because i do now believe these are really her views, opinions (maybe outdated which is why i obviously disagree with them) but people like Ann are still allowed to have those views, and we have a right to disagree with them either (but i agree sexist, ageist insults are a no go for anyone)

I know loads of people devoted to their religion who are nothing like Widdecombe.
She stands for the whole opposite of Christianity.
Anyone claiming to be a real Christian should equally be offended by her representation of it as they ought to be of her hateful thoughts and words.

[Liam-]

Yeah, I’m not going to lose sleep over someone who would be quite happy to see all of my rights stripped away, because of the gender I’m attracted to, being called some nasty names, it’s time to normalise minorities not having to tolerate bigotry because ‘everyone is allowed an opinion’, we’re expected to just be nice and grateful we don’t get put in prison anymore

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Liam-

Yeah, I’m not going to lose sleep over someone who would be quite happy to see all of my rights stripped away, because of the gender I’m attracted to, being called some nasty names, it’s time to normalise minorities not having to tolerate bigotry because ‘everyone is allowed an opinion’, we’re expected to just be nice and grateful we don’t get put in prison anymore

Pretty much, the constant false equivalence annoys me endlessly. Insulting someone isn't akin to trying to impede and strip people of their rights.

I'm not gonna clutch my pearls over a bigot getting dragged.

[Nicky91]

also lol, when Ann is in the minority here, since a lot of people look forward to seeing Nicola & Katya

and it is the second time she aims for Katya, after that one time she wanted her and Seann banned from the show after that kiss

[Nicky91]

what is the correct way of debating then?

cuz i'm pretty much confused now either


i understand sexist, ageist and other slurs are wrong, but what is the correct way then?

[joeysteele]

Well I rarely refer to her sex.
I call her Widdecombe or an individual.

She warrants the venom she gets for the venom she spouts out.

However, I'll ensure I don't refer to the sex of the individual Widdecombe again.

However Widdecombe can get veiled defence for saying 2 females shouldn't be allowed to dance together on a TV show, and that in a general sense Widdecombe says, families don't want to see that either.

For goodness sake.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Well I rarely refer to her sex.
I call her Widdecombe or an individual.

She warrants the venom she gets for the venom she spouts out.

However, I'll ensure I don't refer to the sex of the individual Widdecombe again.

Originally Posted by joeysteele

However Widdecombe can get veiled defence for saying 2 females shouldn't be allowed to dance together on a TV show, and that in a general sense Widdecombe says, families don't want to see that either.

For goodness sake.

Certainly wasn't my intention to defend her, out-rightly or veiled. I am most definitely condemning her comments and disagree with them wholeheartedly

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Certainly wasn't my intention to defend her, out-rightly or veiled. I am most definitely condemning her comments and disagree with them wholeheartedly

At no point did it come across as you defending her comments Niamh, rest assured