[user104658]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

the thread was started for all to comment and not a trans people only comment thread as it is something that affects all hospital patients

I believe ethanjames is referring to the fact that some members have taken it upon themselves to express the views of female-to-male transexuals, e.g. by stating that it's "only male-to-female transexuals who have a problem" and that F-to-M's are compliant and won't complain about being on female wards.

[ethanjames]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I believe ethanjames is referring to the fact that some members have taken it upon themselves to express the views of female-to-male transexuals, e.g. by stating that it's "only male-to-female transexuals who have a problem" and that F-to-M's are compliant and won't complain about being on female wards.

this is what i meant! if that wasnt brought up i probably wouldnt comment!

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by ethanjames

this is what i meant! if that wasnt brought up i probably wouldnt comment!

But you should comment on subjects that you have a real opinion on because so think being trans is something you choose to do.

[ethanjames]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

the thread was started for all to comment and not a trans people only comment thread as it is something that affects all hospital patients

where did i say people couldnt comment? people have just been commenting on what trans ftm people think but arent actually trans themselves. thought i should clear the air.

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by ethanjames

hi! a lot of people in this thread are speaking on my behalf as a trans ftm person who is pre op (though i have been on testosterone for a few months now!) and though i cannot speak for all trans people i would feel much more comfortable in a male ward than a female since that is what i identify as. most wards are mixed though from what i can remember so i don't quite see the issue here... but if there has to be gendered wards i think that if the person has some sort of proof they identify as that gender whether that is doctor diagnosed gender dysphoria or whatnot i dont see the problem whatsoever! you could always ask for a private ward if you are that concerned about trans people.

Hello, welcome to the forum.

[bots]

So many people are missing the point here. Hospitals are full of people at their most vulnerable. The system should not be setup to allow those vulnerable people to be at the mercy of someone pretending to be something they are not, in order to take advantage. That is the crux of the issue, all the rest is noise and people sabre rattling for their own agenda.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

The system should not be setup to allow those vulnerable people to be at the mercy of someone pretending to be something they are not, in order to take advantage.

It's an imagined risk, the idea that hordes of male predators will be declaring themselves women in order to get onto a female hospital ward and prey on sick people is panic-logic. And if that did happen and those patients would be at risk, then the problem is much bigger than who is and isn't admitted to each ward, as visiting hours are near unlimited these days and so people who want to prey on people in hospital can literally just walk in off the street. Wards are busy and full of patients, staff and visitors and should be safe for everyone. If they're not then there's a much bigger security issue than "covert perverts" pretending to be women .

It's the exact same panic-logic that applies to the female bathroom debate. "If men can self ID as women then they will be able to walk into female public bathrooms and attack people!" ... as though there's currently a mystical forcefield that keeps penises out of women's bathrooms. Not to scare everyone but hey... guess what... if an attacker wants to get you in a women's bathroom right now, he can just walk right in. He doesn't need to declare "I am a woman" to the door to make it open. Unbelievable, isn't it?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

Hello, welcome to the forum.

He isn't a new member

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

He isn't a new member

I know and I don’t welcome new members.

[ethanjames]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

Hello, welcome to the forum.

not new but hi

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by ethanjames

not new but hi

Your situation is different,you are in transition, what we are talking about here is someone self iding and who has made no moves to transition at all

[ethanjames]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Your situation is different,you are in transition, what we are talking about here is someone self iding and who has made no moves to transition at all

prior me being on testosterone id still take the same stance of wanting to be in the male area. i went to an all male school for years and barely anything happened. dont see how this is much different.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by ethanjames

hi! a lot of people in this thread are speaking on my behalf as a trans ftm person who is pre op (though i have been on testosterone for a few months now!) and though i cannot speak for all trans people i would feel much more comfortable in a male ward than a female since that is what i identify as. most wards are mixed though from what i can remember so i don't quite see the issue here... but if there has to be gendered wards i think that if the person has some sort of proof they identify as that gender whether that is doctor diagnosed gender dysphoria or whatnot i dont see the problem whatsoever! you could always ask for a private ward if you are that concerned about trans people.

Hey Ethan, I think it's just this self ID stuff that people are a bit more wary of (although I agree about hospital wards, I'm not even sure if they're segregated by sex here, I know I've been in mixed day wards)

[ethanjames]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Hey Ethan, I think it's just this self ID stuff that people are a bit more wary of (although I agree about hospital wards, I'm not even sure if they're segregated by sex here, I know I've been in mixed day wards)

i think if this was a discussion about prisons or something it would be a different discussion but i genuinely cannot see the issue with hospitals. i do understand the worry about self identifying though.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by ethanjames

i think if this was a discussion about prisons or something it would be a different discussion but i genuinely cannot see the issue with hospitals. i do understand the worry about self identifying though.

Yeah agree with that tbf

[user104658]

Originally Posted by ethanjames

i think if this was a discussion about prisons or something it would be a different discussion but i genuinely cannot see the issue with hospitals. i do understand the worry about self identifying though.

I agree; when it comes to prisons, women's refuge centres, etc. then there's a bigger debate to be had but the logic with hospitals / public bathrooms etc. is completely disjointed... I genuinely think it's based far more on people's "that ain't right!" gut reaction and very little objective rational thought has gone into considering the actual risk if there even is one. The reasoning for why it shouldn't be allowed is consistently just assumptions, worries and imaginings... not a trace of reasoned logic or statistical fact. "They might" this, "what if" that.

[ethanjames]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I agree; when it comes to prisons, women's refuge centres, etc. then there's a bigger debate to be had but the logic with hospitals / public bathrooms etc. is completely disjointed... I genuinely think it's based far more on people's "that ain't right!" gut reaction and very little objective rational thought has gone into considering the actual risk if there even is one. The reasoning for why it shouldn't be allowed is consistently just assumptions, worries and imaginings... not a trace of reasoned logic or statistical fact. "They might" this, "what if" that.

completely agree!

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I agree; when it comes to prisons, women's refuge centres, etc. then there's a bigger debate to be had but the logic with hospitals / public bathrooms etc. is completely disjointed... I genuinely think it's based far more on people's "that ain't right!" gut reaction and very little objective rational thought has gone into considering the actual risk if there even is one. The reasoning for why it shouldn't be allowed is consistently just assumptions, worries and imaginings... not a trace of reasoned logic or statistical fact. "They might" this, "what if" that.

Would you put your child on an adult ward for an overnight stay?

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by ethanjames

hi! a lot of people in this thread are speaking on my behalf as a trans ftm person who is pre op (though i have been on testosterone for a few months now!) and though i cannot speak for all trans people i would feel much more comfortable in a male ward than a female since that is what i identify as. most wards are mixed though from what i can remember so i don't quite see the issue here... but if there has to be gendered wards i think that if the person has some sort of proof they identify as that gender whether that is doctor diagnosed gender dysphoria or whatnot i dont see the problem whatsoever! you could always ask for a private ward if you are that concerned about trans people.

A lot of opinions have been posted. Not one has been posted on behalf of a transperson.

[ethanjames]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

A lot of opinions have been posted. Not one has been posted on behalf of a transperson.

many people in this thread said that trans men wouldnt want to be in a mens ward for their own safety and they basically spoke on behalf of us.

[thesheriff443]

It’s like a vegetarian being afraid of someone who eats meat, well they eat meat so they might eat me.

Better not take the chance.

[ethanjames]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

It’s like a vegetarian being afraid of someone who eats meat, well they eat meat so they might eat me.

Better not take the chance.

[Livia]

Most people in hospital wards, I think I'm fright in saying, will be older people, the elderly and frail. **** them, eh? What do they matter.

No penises on female only wards. The only exception should be, in my opinion, is for transwomen who are in the process but have not yet had surgery.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

Most people in hospital wards, I think I'm fright in saying, will be older people, the elderly and frail. **** them, eh? What do they matter.

The elderly and frail will be on geriatric wards so this argument is moot; it's about gender not people self-IDing as a pensioner.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The elderly and frail will be on geriatric wards so this argument is moot; it's about gender not people self-IDing as a pensioner.

Firstly, this argument is NOT moot until you've seen my local hospital, and hospitals across the country.

No one's talking about people self-IDing as pensioners. Not sure how you could have reached that conclusion from what I said.

It's obvious you are not able to discuss this with me TS.