[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

But Brillo... Do you genuinely believe that all or most Muslim men are sexist? Do you see a Muslim man and immediately assume that he is sexist? More importantly - as per the school thread - do you see people with a middle eastern opinion, assume that they are Muslim, and THEN assume sexist motives? Also... Do you think that it's ONLY Muslims who are sexist? Because I know a lot of extremely sexist old pigs (work hazard) and 90% of them are white and British born. Yes, one of the worst is a Muslim guy, who doesn't even like to be served by female staff - BUT - there are at least a dozen other Muslim customers or customers "with the appearance of someone who may be Muslim" who are polite, respectful, chatty and cheerful. You just can't go around judging a whole group of people based on the most extreme examples? Because like I said, there are still plenty of disrespectful, aggressively sexist British men around but you wouldn't judge all British men based on their behaviour.

That's the difference and that's what makes it - shudder to use the term - pretty racist. You make sweeping assumptions about individuals based on what they look like, or where they are from. That's the issue here.

I think you've decided that people don't care about sexism in Muslim communities or that it isn't a problem. Yes, it is a problem. Yes, it should definitely be addressed and not ignored, but if anything your valid points get completely lost as soon as you start making these generalisations... Am I guilty of ruining some of your threads? Probably, yeah, but nowhere near as many as you ruin yourself by losing the focus of the issue and making it about "all" or "most" of a group.

I'll answer your question about sexism if I may. I wouldn't say all men are sexist or all men in any one religion. What I will say is that most religion teaches and promotes sexism. Men of faith are often raised to see women as inferior. For me that is a huge issue.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by jaxie

I'll answer your question about sexism if I may. I wouldn't say all men are sexist or all men in any one religion. What I will say is that most religion teaches and promotes sexism. Men of faith are often raised to see women as inferior. For me that is a huge issue.

I agree with you but religion is so ingrained in people it really needs to evolve and change by itself, you can't just force people into thinking differently(even the ones who are being treated badly). Christianity is alot older than Islam and that had to evolve on it's own as well, in other words the ones in it have to change it by wanting to change it

[DemolitionRed]

I don't dislike Brillo. The only posters I dislike on here are the two liners who come in with a pokey stick and have very little to say. I think Brillo is passionate about her beliefs and she takes time and patience to write about the things that trouble her. The discussions with Brillo are bound to be highly energetic because of the subject matter. Just as Brillo expresses herself about emotive subjects, people will reply with equal emotion.

If that's seen as bullying, then I'm in the wrong place.

[user104658]

Oh FFS Kazanne, crawling out of the woodwork to gang up with people... to complain about people ganging up. You couldn't make this **** up.

I've had plenty to say about Brillo but actually, I have to be fair to her, as much as I dislike her thoughts and opinions, at least she actually HAS her own thoughts and opinions.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Oh FFS Kazanne, crawling out of the woodwork to gang up with people... to complain about people ganging up. You couldn't make this **** up.

I've had plenty to say about Brillo but actually, I have to be fair to her, as much as I dislike her thoughts and opinions, at least she actually HAS her own thoughts and opinions.

I rest my case ,insult me all you like,I know what I see,brillo has never from what I have seen been obnoxious or insulting to anyone,how she keeps her restraint I dont know,she's a better woman than I,plus did anyone mention you ? , no one has crawled out from the woodwork,I just am not on here 24/7,I have a life, but I have seen enough to see that some people are overly harsh on brillo.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

I rest my case ,insult me all you like,I know what I see,brillo has never from what I have seen been obnoxious or insulting to anyone,how she keeps her restraint I dont know,she's a better woman than I,plus did anyone mention you ? , no one has crawled out from the woodwork,I just am not on here 24/7,I have a life, but I have seen enough to see that some people are overly harsh on brillo.

I agree Kaz. God forbid anyone should not be a Corbyn supporter, or at least on the Left. Look at all those who are not left-leaning who have found it necessary to leave this place. I have lost three friends on this forum because they obviously cannot be friends with someone who is not of the same political persuasion as they are - luckily that's not the case actually in parliament. It's supposed to be about debate. It USED to be about debate. Not it's about smart-arse comments and ganging up, and all the denials in the world isn't going to change that when the evidence is there. The hostility is palpable on here now. And what a waste of time it would be to report anyone.

Anyhoo... I too am not on here a lot anymore. I prefer the company of adults and there are far fewer here than there used to be. Everyone's always right on this forum so what's the point of debating with anyone?

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Livia

I agree Kaz. God forbid anyone should not be a Corbyn supporter, or at least on the Left. Look at all those who are not left-leaning who have found it necessary to leave this place. I have lost three friends on this forum because they obviously cannot be friends with someone who is not of the same political persuasion as they are - luckily that's not the case actually in parliament. It's supposed to be about debate. It USED to be about debate. Not it's about smart-arse comments and ganging up, and all the denials in the world isn't going to change that when the evidence is there. The hostility is palpable on here now. And what a waste of time it would be to report anyone.

Anyhoo... I too am not on here a lot anymore. I prefer the company of adults and there are far fewer here than there used to be. Everyone's always right on this forum so what's the point of debating with anyone?

Ah,Livia a voice of reason,I do find TIBB of late very childish,can't seem to find an adult to debate with properly, the few that do come here leave or are pushed out the door, and I agree it is hostile,I dont always post but I do look at the forum and anyone with a brain cell can see what happens everytimee brillo posts,I wonder sometimes if TIBB actually wants new posters tbh . Lovely to see you post again though as always.

[DemolitionRed]

At least Brillo gives this forum something to get its teeth into. Expression is the spice of life when it comes to having a serious debate.

[Cherry Christmas]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

At least Brillo gives this forum something to get its teeth into. Expression is the spice of life when it comes to having a serious debate.

Agree, not so long ago the much missed Kirk was doing this and left due to constant belittling, be careful what you wish for is a good adage to fall back on, on this occasion, if posters are weary of another poster I really don't know why they can't just ignore them, seems simple enough to me.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Agree, not so long ago the much missed Kirk was doing this and left due to constant belittling, be careful what you wish for is a good adage to fall back on, on this occasion, if posters are weary of another poster I really don't know why they can't just ignore them, seems simple enough to me.

Exactly Cherie.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Agree, not so long ago the much missed Kirk was doing this and left due to constant belittling, be careful what you wish for is a good adage to fall back on, on this occasion, if posters are weary of another poster I really don't know why they can't just ignore them, seems simple enough to me.

Kirks a big man, he can give it out and take it but sometimes he was over-exuberant in his response and got infractions and even temporary bans. That's what drove him away. I think Kirk would laugh if he heard anyone suggest he was bullied by other posters.

[Cherry Christmas]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Kirks a big man, he can give it out and take it but sometimes he was over-exuberant in his response and got infractions and even temporary bans. That's what drove him away. I think Kirk would laugh if he heard anyone suggest he was bullied by other posters.

he got frustrated with being banned when others weren't, you don't know what Kirk would laugh at or not with all due respect.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Can I just remind people that this is Serious Debates...the whole point is really to disagree/agree with people, chances are there will be people who you disagree with alot, how is that "ganging up" People who haven't posted here in a long time though suddenly appearing to back up someone however seems a little like that to me............how ironic

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Can I just remind people that this is Serious Debates...the whole point is really to disagree/agree with people, chances are there will be people who you disagree with alot, how is that "ganging up" People who haven't posted here in a long time though suddenly appearing to back up someone however seems a little like that to me............how ironic

I'll remember that the next time I am baited and get infracted when I bite back.

As for posters who don't post so regularly, maybe due to the persistent goading of those with non-PC views, the fact that they do speak up when they feel something is unacceptable just demonstrates strong feelings and a strong sense of injustice to me whether or you agree with their sentiments.

Most people would consider that a desirable quality.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I'll remember that the next time I am baited and get infracted when I bite back.

As for posters who don't post so regularly, maybe due to the persistent goading of those with non-PC views, the fact that they do speak up when they feel something is unacceptable just demonstrates strong feelings and a strong sense of injustice to me whether or you agree with their sentiments.

Non PC in your world though just seems to equal racist. So you want to be free to say racist stuff without being called out on it? That doesn't seem very balanced to me. Why shouldn't people be allowed say they think your views are racist, why is "PC" only a one way street?

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Non PC in your world though just seems to equal racist. So you want to be free to say racist stuff without being called out on it? That doesn't seem very balanced to me. Why shouldn't people be allowed say they think your views are racist, why is "PC" only a one way street?

People generally started using PC in response to the constant racist goading by some posters on here. People aren't saints - what do you expect. Do you believe it is ok to for people to call people racist but not ok for others to respond with PC terminology. Can't have it both ways.

Funny how people usually don't like a taste of their own medicine and get all hot under the collar when on the receiving end for a change.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

People generally started using PC in response to the constant racist goading by some posters on here. People aren't saints - what do you expect. Do you believe it is ok to for people to call people racist but not ok for others to respond with PC terminology. Can't have it both ways.

Funny how people usually don't like a taste of their own medicine and get all hot under the collar when on the receiving end for a change.

You're the one complaining about being on the receiving end though

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I'll remember that the next time I am baited and get infracted when I bite back.

As for posters who don't post so regularly, maybe due to the persistent goading of those with non-PC views, the fact that they do speak up when they feel something is unacceptable just demonstrates strong feelings and a strong sense of injustice to me whether or you agree with their sentiments.

Most people would consider that a desirable quality.

Whether I agree or disagree with this is not the point though, the point is it seems very hypocritical to come online to accuse people of ganging up when that's exactly what they're also doing

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Whether I agree or disagree with this is not the point though, the point is it seems very hypocritical to come online to accuse people of ganging up when that's exactly what they're also doing

I am not ganging up on anyone,I am saying what I see its happens a lot where brillo posts,maybe it's people with the SAME opinions and not 'gangs' just a thought.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

I am not ganging up on anyone,I am saying what I see its happens a lot where brillo posts,maybe it's people with the SAME opinions and not 'gangs' just a thought.

Well yes but that works both ways Kazanne .................

[DemolitionRed]

I've used different forum groups for years before getting bored and moving on. That's what people generally do. Making this place out to be some sort of war zone where bullying is rife and people get hounded away is ridiculous.
This serious forums group is soft and fluffy compared to some I've been on.

[Cherry Christmas]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

I've used different forum groups for years before getting bored and moving on. That's what people generally do. Making this place out to be some sort of war zone where bullying is rife and people get hounded away is ridiculous.
This serious forums group is soft and fluffy compared to some I've been on.

says the women with "no longer on this site" on her sig, didn't you flounce off because your inaccurate blog was removed?

[Josy]

To be perfectly honest theres a lot of supposed adults that frequent this section that have a give it out but cant take it way of posting, theres a massive amount if hypocrisy going on specifically in this thread some accusing others of things that they themselves are also guilty of and for those accusing this one and that one of hostility and nastiness ive actually at times witnessed them behaving in the exact same way towards others.

This section of the forum will have heated debates and harsher replies, if members cant handle having thier opinions questioned and sometimes very strong ones at that then this isnt the place for them.

[Cherry Christmas]

Originally Posted by Josy

To be perfectly honest theres a lot of supposed adults that frequent this section that have a give it out but cant take it way of posting, theres a massive amount if hypocrisy going on specifically in this thread some accusing others of things that they themselves are also guilty of and for those accusing this one and that one of hostility and nastiness ive actually at times witnessed them behaving in the exact same way towards others.

This section of the forum will have heated debates and harsher replies, if members cant handle having thier opinions questioned and sometimes very strong ones at that then this isnt the place for them.

that's fine Josy but if one person is infracted for giving it out while another isn't its hardly a level playing field, and let's face it getting infracted is usually down to a member hammering the report button rather than a mod picking up on any offence, would you agree or not?

[Josy]

Originally Posted by Cherie

that's fine Josy but if one person is infracted for giving it out while another isn't its hardly a level playing field, and let's face it getting infracted is usually down to a member hammering the report button rather than a mod picking up on any offence, would you agree or not?

Cherie not one member on this forum knows if anyone else has been infracted or not so this scenario isnt realistic and tbh is just used as a deflection tactic a lot of the time when people are infracted and cant handle the fact that they broke a rule and were punished for doing so, a lot of the time posts that are infracted arent down to reports for a specific post its down to us having to read through the threads from the very start and see where it all kicked off, who started it, who took it too far and so on.