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Old 19-05-2017, 05:40 AM   #1
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Default Preventing Islam becoming a state religion

https://www.rt.com/news/368755-slova...-religion-law/

I don't know about anyone else but I didn't know that once a religion has a certain amount of followers in a country it can become a state religon receiving state subsidies. Do people really want such a religion becoming a state religion in Britain?

Or is it already a state registered religion in Britain - I have no idea.

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Old 19-05-2017, 09:42 AM   #2
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Personally I'm against all religions being a state anything, has no place there imo
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Old 19-05-2017, 10:31 AM   #3
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Personally I'm against all religions being a state anything, has no place there imo
Same.

But as long as state and religion aren't separate then at least it should be fair and Islam treated like any other major religion, isn't it just about representing the people that live here?
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Old 19-05-2017, 10:35 AM   #4
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Same.

But as long as state and religion aren't separate then at least it should be fair and Islam treated like any other major religion, isn't it just about representing the people that live here?
I'm not going to get overly upset about religions not having rights tbqh, especially one that treats women like second class citizens
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Old 19-05-2017, 10:43 AM   #5
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I'm in favour of equality so in that sense, I think it should be, if other religions are. I don't buy into the rhetoric than one religion is any "worse" than any other religion.

However, I do personally believe that religion and politics should be completely separate, and to go a step further, I would rather that people wake up to the con of organised religion full stop.
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Old 19-05-2017, 10:49 AM   #6
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No no and no. No religion that has the concept of violence at it's core, or that advocates death to anyone who wants to leave that religion, to gays and basically anyone who doesn't have the same mind set, is anethma to any civilised society.
I'm speaking of islam now and if islam becomes a state religion, then sharia law will be an accepted part of our society and I refuse to accept any laws that has an 'etiquette of beating women'. A policy that sees nothing wrong in marriage and sexual relations with under age females and a mind set that is medieval and has no place in western society.
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Old 19-05-2017, 10:50 AM   #7
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I'm in favour of equality so in that sense, I think it should be, if other religions are. I don't buy into the rhetoric than one religion is any "worse" than any other religion.

However, I do personally believe that religion and politics should be completely separate, and to go a step further, I would rather that people wake up to the con of organised religion full stop.
Exactly, it's so blatantly a way to have power over people and control

With regards to the BIB in the first paragraph as a woman I think that's a silly thing to say when you look at how women are treated in some religions although that probably has more to do with culture than the actual religion I think
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Old 19-05-2017, 10:54 AM   #8
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The UK is not a religious country so no
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Old 19-05-2017, 10:59 AM   #9
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The UK is not a religious country so no
isn't the Queen like the head of the Church or something? But i know what you mean, all that crap is out dated and should be totally separate
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Old 19-05-2017, 11:01 AM   #10
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I'm not going to get overly upset about religions not having rights tbqh, especially one that treats women like second class citizens
I'm not too fussed about it either really, I just think that fairness should be applied to things like this. If we have freedom of religion and people choose to follow it. And I think generally that integration is one of the best ways of phasing out out-dated views like treating women as second class citizens, it's not something that's a core aspect of Islam as far as I know, and I think generally that over time most people adapt to the society they're a part of over what religious text they follow, it's the more instinctive thing to do.
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Old 19-05-2017, 11:05 AM   #11
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I'm not too fussed about it either really, I just think that fairness should be applied to things like this. If we have freedom of religion and people choose to follow it. And I think generally that integration is one of the best ways of phasing out out-dated views like treating women as second class citizens, it's not something that's a core aspect of Islam as far as I know, and I think generally that over time most people adapt to the society they're a part of over what religious text they follow, it's the more instinctive thing to do.
Yeah, I corrected myself in another post above actually, It probably is a cultural thing in alot of cases rather than the religion itself I suppose. I still wouldn't be campaigning for religious rights though as I'm totally against the whole idea of organised religions and religions being funded by the state.
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Old 19-05-2017, 11:31 AM   #12
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I was brought up a Christian while Britain was a Christian country but now that is all about gone I am loathe to want another religious following in Britian. While Christianity is dying out Islam religion is expanding, if my religion is going to be gone I don't want another religion taking over. It seems some people of Britain think we should celebrate Islam yet not Christianity, whats that about?
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Old 19-05-2017, 11:33 AM   #13
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Exactly, it's so blatantly a way to have power over people and control

With regards to the BIB in the first paragraph as a woman I think that's a silly thing to say when you look at how women are treated in some religions although that probably has more to do with culture than the actual religion I think
I think we're pretty quick to forget, though, that Christians / Westerners didn't treat women (or homosexuals, or ethnic minorities) all that differently less than a century ago... and really no differently at all 150 years ago (the whole thing, from rights, to how much flesh women were allowed to show). The entire world doesn't, and never has, progressed at a uniform rate. We move on, and then are outraged when the rest of the world - which has not had the same time nor opportunity to culturally develop - is not on exactly the same page at exactly the same time.

And that's without even going into the horrible reality that we currently seem to be majorly back-sliding.
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Old 19-05-2017, 11:41 AM   #14
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I was brought up a Christian while Britain was a Christian country but now that is all about gone I am loathe to want another religious following in Britian. While Christianity is dying out Islam religion is expanding, if my religion is going to be gone I don't want another religion taking over. It seems some people of Britain think we should celebrate Islam yet not Christianity, whats that about?
This is simply not the case, the idea that Islam is "wiping out" Christianity is hysterical Daily Mail nonsense. Christianity is in decline, yes, but the most rapidly expanding category of religious belief is in NO WAY Islam (which still only sits at around 5% of the population) but is, in fact, and I'm very happy to say; atheism / agnosticism / non-religion / anti-religion.

And this category is spread across all religious traditions. Plenty of ex-Muslim nonreligious people as well as ex-Christian.
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Old 19-05-2017, 11:41 AM   #15
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I think we're pretty quick to forget, though, that Christians / Westerners didn't treat women (or homosexuals, or ethnic minorities) all that differently less than a century ago... and really no differently at all 150 years ago (the whole thing, from rights, to how much flesh women were allowed to show). The entire world doesn't, and never has, progressed at a uniform rate. We move on, and then are outraged when the rest of the world - which has not had the same time nor opportunity to culturally develop - is not on exactly the same page at exactly the same time.

And that's without even going into the horrible reality that we currently seem to be majorly back-sliding.
Oh no I haven't forgotten that about Christianity believe me but I'm talking about the present, we don't need another religion coming in and trying to drag us back there. Also, I'm certainly not one to defend Christianity ever, Ireland is still dealing with the after effects of what the Catholic church did to people in the not so distant past particularly women and children. The point is, we should be trying to get religions away from having any influence on state and schools not encouraging the state to start funding more religions who are even less forward thinking than the ones we had
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Old 19-05-2017, 11:48 AM   #16
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Oh no I haven't forgotten that about Christianity believe me but I'm talking about the present, we don't need another religion coming in and trying to drag us back there. Also, I'm certainly not one to defend Christianity ever, Ireland is still dealing with the after effects of what the Catholic church did to people in the not so distant past particularly women and children. The point is, we should be trying to get religions away from having any influence on state and schools not encouraging the state to start funding more religions who are even less forward thinking than the ones we had
The idea that an influx of Muslims is going to drag us backwards is just (unlikely) hypothesis, though. A bit of a distraction when we are currently, obviously and demonstrably, being dragged backwards by an uprising of 50+ year old white people who want to reverse the clock to the mid 20th century when women, to be honest, still weren't being treated particularly well and life was a nightmare for any sort of minority or non-conformist.

It just bewilders me that people are so busy looking to the middle east in absolute horror thinking that an influx of "strange cultures" from thousands of miles away are going to "change our way of life", and our media is so busy reporting on just that, that the very real, current and threatening revival of European fascism much closer to home is going almost completely un-noticed. Subtly in countries like ours (including Ireland and Scotland, sadly) but also quite openly and obviously in Eastern Europe. People are just ignoring it. The "never again" mantra from WWII has been proven to be almost hilarious levels of hot air. No one seems to give a **** that it's happening again.
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Old 19-05-2017, 11:58 AM   #17
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The idea that an influx of Muslims is going to drag us backwards is just (unlikely) hypothesis, though. A bit of a distraction when we are currently, obviously and demonstrably, being dragged backwards by an uprising of 50+ year old white people who want to reverse the clock to the mid 20th century when women, to be honest, still weren't being treated particularly well and life was a nightmare for any sort of minority or non-conformist.

It just bewilders me that people are so busy looking to the middle east in absolute horror thinking that an influx of "strange cultures" from thousands of miles away are going to "change our way of life", and our media is so busy reporting on just that, that the very real, current and threatening revival of European fascism much closer to home is going almost completely un-noticed. Subtly in countries like ours (including Ireland and Scotland, sadly) but also quite openly and obviously in Eastern Europe. People are just ignoring it. The "never again" mantra from WWII has been proven to be almost hilarious levels of hot air. No one seems to give a **** that it's happening again.
I do understand what you're saying and I agree with you but I also agree with myself in that I will never demand that any religion get rights to state funds etc it's probably a bit different in the UK because religion didn't have as much of a strangle hold within the law but here we're still trying to get that s**t out of state and school so trying to get another religion recognised would be damaging to this objective imo

But at the same time I do agree with what you're saying too
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Old 19-05-2017, 12:21 PM   #18
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Personally I'm against all religions being a state anything, has no place there imo
Agree 100%.
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Old 19-05-2017, 12:24 PM   #19
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The idea that an influx of Muslims is going to drag us backwards is just (unlikely) hypothesis, though. A bit of a distraction when we are currently, obviously and demonstrably, being dragged backwards by an uprising of 50+ year old white people who want to reverse the clock to the mid 20th century when women, to be honest, still weren't being treated particularly well and life was a nightmare for any sort of minority or non-conformist.

It just bewilders me that people are so busy looking to the middle east in absolute horror thinking that an influx of "strange cultures" from thousands of miles away are going to "change our way of life", and our media is so busy reporting on just that, that the very real, current and threatening revival of European fascism much closer to home is going almost completely un-noticed. Subtly in countries like ours (including Ireland and Scotland, sadly) but also quite openly and obviously in Eastern Europe. People are just ignoring it. The "never again" mantra from WWII has been proven to be almost hilarious levels of hot air. No one seems to give a **** that it's happening again.
It bewilders me that the oppression of women and girls on that scale is so acceptable to some people in the name of a fantasy deity that men decide to speak for.
How do you manage to confuse that with racism?
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Old 19-05-2017, 12:26 PM   #20
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Britain is still seen as a Christian country.

A study by Pew Research that was done in 2010 which also predicted percentages in 2050 looked like this:

Christians: 2010: 64%, 2050: 45%

Muslims: 2010: 5%, 2050: 11%

Hindus: 2010: 1.4%, 2050: 2%

Jews: 2010: 0.5%, 2050: 0.3%

Buddhists: 2010: 0.4%, 2050: 0.9%

Folk religions: 2010: 0.1%, 2050: 0.3%

No religion: 2010: 28%, 2050: 39%
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Old 19-05-2017, 12:36 PM   #21
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It bewilders me that the oppression of women and girls on that scale is so acceptable to some people in the name of a fantasy deity that men decide to speak for.
How do you manage to confuse that with racism?
I don't think anyone is defending men who oppress women. What they are defending are womens rights. If we make false blanket statements that all Muslim women are oppressed and therefore we should ban the burka, we are unintentionally oppressing the women who are not abused and who choose to wear that garment.

Muslims are guilty of carrying out more FGM than any other religion but along the African continent, Christians also carry out this practice along with none religious tribes who see it as tradition; so if we want to fight such barbarities we can't just concentrate on Muslim populations.
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Old 19-05-2017, 12:42 PM   #22
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I don't think anyone is defending men who oppress women. What they are defending are womens rights. If we make false blanket statements that all Muslim women are oppressed and therefore we should ban the burka, we are unintentionally oppressing the women who are not abused and who choose to wear that garment.

Muslims are guilty of carrying out more FGM than any other religion but along the African continent, Christians also carry out this practice along with none religious tribes who see it as tradition; so if we want to fight such barbarities we can't just concentrate on Muslim populations.
Where did I say only one religion had issues?

There are no women's rights in the Muslim faith.
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Old 19-05-2017, 12:56 PM   #23
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You do realise this is not the UK?....

'Islamization starts with a kebab' :/

'According to the last census, Islam has some 2,000 followers in Slovakia, Reuters reported, adding that there are no recognized mosques in the central European country. '

pointless and reactionary.
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Old 19-05-2017, 01:34 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DemolitionRed View Post
Britain is still seen as a Christian country.

A study by Pew Research that was done in 2010 which also predicted percentages in 2050 looked like this:

Christians: 2010: 64%, 2050: 45%

Muslims: 2010: 5%, 2050: 11%

Hindus: 2010: 1.4%, 2050: 2%

Jews: 2010: 0.5%, 2050: 0.3%

Buddhists: 2010: 0.4%, 2050: 0.9%

Folk religions: 2010: 0.1%, 2050: 0.3%

No religion: 2010: 28%, 2050: 39%
These figures are 2010
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Old 19-05-2017, 01:35 PM   #25
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Where did I say only one religion had issues?

There are no women's rights in the Muslim faith.
Really! where did you hear this?
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