FAQ |
Members List |
Calendar |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Serious Debates & News Debate and discussion about political, moral, philosophical, celebrity and news topics. |
Reply |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
29-10-2017, 02:48 PM | #51 | ||
|
|||
-
|
Quote:
Here is the only accurate description of what happened if trying to use loose terms rather than specific motivations: "Some individuals attacked some other individuals while they were doing some stuff specific to them, because those individuals happened to take personal issue with those things". That's it, that is the entire story. |
||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 02:51 PM | #52 | ||
|
|||
0_o
|
But its still important that the message gets out about what this law change will actually be. Rather than the fluffy 'its for trans rights' version the activists put out. When its nothing at all to do with trans rights and infact is detrimental to a lot of transsexual people :S
So maybe People telling the truth about a law change physically attacked by people who do not give a crap about the rights of others and don't want the truth to get out about what the law change actually means for most people?
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 29-10-2017 at 02:53 PM. |
||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 02:56 PM | #53 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
Having worked in the club scene, the transsexuals I've known have been very gender-critical, to a point of unfairness. They like to point out that they are a woman with a cherry on top whilst others aren't. I've yet to meet a misogynist transexual or transvestite. They normally adore everything that is considered female and feminine. There are transvestite pervs but transvestite pervs tend to like men, not women. Stunners was full of transvestite pervs and it was full of men who considered themselves straight but wanted a quick shag with something that looked relatively female. Crossdressers tend to be straight. They just like the feel of female clothes on their bodies but tend to have straight girlfriends and wives who are cool with that.
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 03:03 PM | #54 | |||
|
||||
0_o
|
Quote:
The transsexual cause (and also intersex is appropriated a lot in the arguments) has basically been hijacked by a bunch of idiots with their own agenda. BUT noone is challenging this Transpeople who challenge it are shouted down by the very same 'activists' who claim to be fighting for them. they are called truscum and denounced by their own communities ffs. Women who challenge it are shouted down and threatened with rape and violence (indeed some actually are attacked). Men who challenge it are just ignored...but the men who challenge it are fewer as it hasn't personally affected them yet. Its all a mess. yet these activists are actually consulting with the government, and schools. The same group who attacked (and defended the attackers) the 60 year old (trans health for london or whatever the hell they call themselves) are the ones 'advising Maria Miller on this ridiculous new law. Bonkers. And I am glad the gender critical voices seem to be getting more common. As as soon as people think a little deeper into it, they see it all for the bull**** it is. Quote:
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 29-10-2017 at 03:35 PM. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 03:11 PM | #55 | ||
|
|||
0_o
|
Kind of offtopic, but I think there are as many 'genders' as there are people on this earth. As gender is just personality and dress sense when it comes down to it.
Of course some people have sex dysphoria, but this is not really anything to do with 'gender', its a dislike of their body parts. Like any other dysphoria. If this is eased by surgeries and such, then good for them. All evidence shows though that after surgery, suicide risk actually rises, so I don't think its the 'miracle cure' that some seem to think it is. Either way though,. if adults want to have surgery its up to them. What I dislike most about this whole thing, is the targeting of children. Convincing the likes of 'tomboys' that they actually are boys and setting them on the route to sterilization and lifetime medical intervention. Its just wrong. A kids brain isn't even fully developed ffs. And also, kids with 'gender dysphoria' if just left alone to develop properly, 80%+ of them grow out of it, and most simply become gay adults. This 'transing' kids thing is blatantly homophobic. Its modern day eugenics. Yet has widespread support from people who do not actually think into it. Madness. Total madness. Just let kids be kids, and let them wear or play with whatever they like. Dress sense and toy choice have nothing to do with their sex To pretend they do, is ****ing dangerous and stupid.
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 29-10-2017 at 03:13 PM. |
||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 04:15 PM | #56 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
I've also hung out in gay bars but generally, I find gay men much more fun and friendly than gay women. Gay women generally find me being bi, offensive and for some reason, threatening, even though I've never considered coming on to a lesbian. Gay women are probably my least selective group to be amongst because they seem to be so intent on protecting themselves from the outside world, that they to have difficulty chilling out.
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 04:23 PM | #57 | |||
|
||||
0_o
|
Quote:
When 'transwomen' (or straight men who like wearing dresses, not genuine transsexuals) are coming onto lesbians...it seems they do not take no for an answer...and the women find that intimidating. Hell in one case, the person 'passed' as female and actually did not reveal that they were a 'person with a penis' until they had the lesbian alone at her house. That completely wrong. This person physically assaulted the lesbian, when the lesbian said that she did not shag people with penises as she was gay. The argument was, you were attracted to me until you realized I was trans, bigot! And they did not appear to understand that lesbians just do not suck dick. Apparently another part of the argument was that lesbians use dildos, so this was no different. Which is very homophobic tbh. Lesbians really are bearing the brunt of this 'movement' IMO. And when they speak out, they are branded 'transphobic' as 'transwomen are women'. Bizzare. Sexualities are transphobic because people are attracted to a certain sex and apparently sex doesn't matter at all, 'gender identity' does. Both homophobic and (I don't think this is really a thing but for the sake of argument) heterophobic. Quote:
Gay men are much more accepted by society than lesbians are. Read up on the 'cotton ceiling' for how these 'transwomen' (note, not transsexuals) who are attracted to females view lesbians. Its sick. https://terfisaslur.com/cotton-ceiling/ http://sjwiki.org/wiki/Cotton_ceiling [T]he cotton ceiling [is] us[ed] to challenge cis lesbians’ tendency to support trans causes generally but draw the line at sleeping with trans women or including trans lesbians in their sexual communities.[5]
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 29-10-2017 at 04:43 PM. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 05:39 PM | #58 | |||
|
||||
POW! BLAM!
|
Which aspects of gender roles are societal, rather than being driven by biology/neurology?
|
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 05:51 PM | #59 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
Quote:
I would also say that transsexuals and transvestites are attacked a lot, especially physically. If you look at suicide rates of transexuals, its a lot higher than the average gay person. One things for sure from this thread... you and I haven't led sheltered lives
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 07:09 PM | #60 | ||
|
|||
-
|
Quote:
I'm genuinely a bit surprised that you're suggesting that broad stereotypes are in any way an accurate depiction of the average gay male or female . |
||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 07:34 PM | #61 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 07:35 PM | #62 | ||
|
|||
0_o
|
Quote:
Do you think that people with vaginas tend to wear dresses and play with dolls for biological reasons, or because society tells them thats 'how to girl' and pushes it on them from birth? I would argue that sex is biology. And that sex cannot be changed. Yes there are biological differences between sexes. Bit none of this is anything to do with 'gender' or 'trans' and no trans person can really 'feel like a woman/man' as they are not a woman/man so cannot know how a woman/man feels. And that most women/men do not feel 'like women/men' they just feel like themselves. Basically in short, sex is a biological reality, not a feeling inside someones head. And gender is entirely social. And no matter what your sex, you are free to do whatever the hell you like with your hairdo, makeup clothes and whatnot. But changing these things does not mean you have actually changed sex (an a hell of a lot of transsexuals agree with this too) and to pretend that this does mean you have changed sex is detrimental to everyone. What parts of gender roles do you think are down to biology/neurology?
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 29-10-2017 at 07:53 PM. |
||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 07:41 PM | #63 | ||
|
|||
0_o
|
Quote:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4882090/ Makes sense that suicide rates are higher among a population that has more mental health issues tbh So surely...the answer to this is not surgery(after which, suicide rate actually goes up) and pretending that they actually are the sex they want to be? The solution is therapy...or that should be the start at the very least. But therapy is 'gatekeeping' and transactivists fight against this also. Mental. A disproportionate amount of FTM trans people have been sexually abused. This also needs looking into and researched. I think its obvious that someome who has been abused might find life as the opposite sex quite appealing, if they think they would be safer that way. Also a lot of people who are trans have autism or conditions like that..the link is getting cleaer and clearer. Something else that needs looked into and not just written off as 'transphobic nonsense' Many many people who have undergone hormones and/or surgery regret it and want to 'change back'. This is important research but research thats NOT ALLOWED to be done. Seriously. Looking into that is also deemed transphobic...and instead we have to pretend that detransitioners do not exist.
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 29-10-2017 at 08:02 PM. |
||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 07:59 PM | #64 | ||
|
|||
-
|
That's exactly how stereotypes are created and furthered, though. Predicting and assuming that someone will be "how you expect them to be" based on your past experiences of "other people of that sort". The idea that "Gay men are so much fun!" but "Lesbians aren't fun to be around" is just as damaging as saying something like "You're Asian, so you must be really clever!" or "I wouldn't hang around black men... Black men tend to be so aggressive".
It's the very definition of pigeonholing and "judging a book by its cover", and I've always thought of you as the sort of person who is more likely to take each individual as they come rather than "lumping into" easily digestible personality archetypes? In MY experience of gay men - and I have some very good gay friends - they would find the sentence "Gay men are so much fun to have as friends" to be patronising, sweeping, shallow and impersonal. |
||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 08:53 PM | #65 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 09:01 PM | #66 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
There is nothing patronizing about suggesting someone is fun to be around. Our middle son is gay and he doesn't find it patronizing knowing he makes us laugh and that we find his company fun. If that's shallow, so be it, I can live with that.
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 09:35 PM | #67 | ||
|
|||
0_o
|
Quote:
But ignoring that, saying trans people suffer mental health problems disproportionately to the rest of the population, based on the only study we have available...surely is not a problem? Saying more studies need to go into it, is not a problem? Saying its very important for research to be done on detransitioners, is not a problem either. As this is very important as it affects a lot of people, and will affect even more when this generation of 'trans kids' grows up and start suing the NHS and their parents. Yet research into this very subject was blocked due to transactivists and 'political correctness'...it as deemed not neccesary because of negative publicity it would create for the university. Mental...again. https://www.theguardian.com/educatio...ersal-research or http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7965281.html - proof of my last paragraph
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 29-10-2017 at 09:38 PM. |
||
Reply With Quote |
29-10-2017, 10:42 PM | #68 | ||
|
|||
-
|
Quote:
|
||
Reply With Quote |
30-10-2017, 06:16 AM | #69 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
30-10-2017, 06:31 AM | #70 | ||
|
|||
-
|
|
||
Reply With Quote |
30-10-2017, 07:33 AM | #71 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
30-10-2017, 07:38 AM | #72 | |||
|
||||
POW! BLAM!
|
Quote:
Males and females are biologically and neurologically different, and these differences are what inform the differences in the roles males and females generally take in society. Males have about 7% more grey matter in their brains, and in the cerebellum men have more connections between hemispheres, which means an increased ability to translate perception, and for motorskill and ability. Along with the on average higher bone density and muscle mass, this makes males better suited for physical work, and which is why back in our primitive days, men were the hunters. Meanwhile, females have about 10% more white matter in their brains, and more connections between frontal lobes, which translates to greater empathy, social skills, and nurturing behaviours. This is why women are better suited for staying at home and raising the kids, while men go out and earn the daily bread. And then there's hormones to consider. Higher testosterone in males drives behaviours such as competitiveness, higher sex drive, more aggression, and providing resources to attract potential mates. Females have more estrogen, which fuels the instincts to nurture and emphasize. Which could explain why courses and careers geared around helping others (nursing, child care, etc.) We even could touch briefly on the makeup thing, as being attractive helps females attract a mate who can provide children and resources. At the end of the day, we are animals, and we are the products of biology. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
30-10-2017, 08:18 AM | #73 | |||
|
||||
Senior Member
|
Prenatal Exposure to Anticonvulsants and Psychosexual Development
https://link.springer.com/article/10...:1018789521375 Typical female 2nd–4th finger length (24D) ratios in male-to-female transsexuals—possible implications for prenatal androgen exposure http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...06453005001770
__________________
No longer on this site. |
|||
Reply With Quote |
30-10-2017, 01:03 PM | #74 | ||||
|
|||||
0_o
|
Quote:
Trangenders without dysphoria simply enjoy dressing a certain way and simply saying they are women. Which is utter bollocks tbh, people like this are just femine males, or masculine females. Quote:
For example, you mention women being better suited for nurturing and caring professions. A male who choses a caring profession, does not become a woman. He is just a man who likes caring. There is so much crossover in our brains...that sexed bodies are pretty much the only proper difference between males and females. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...-compassionate Quote:
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 30-10-2017 at 01:28 PM. |
||||
Reply With Quote |
30-10-2017, 01:17 PM | #75 | ||
|
|||
0_o
|
Quote:
Just read this piece by Miranda Yardley which explains a lot of my views on this topic pretty well. Before denouncing her as a terf or 'transphobic'...Miranda is actually a transsexual...and a lot of transsexual people agree with what she says. http://mirandayardley.com/en/finding...gender-rights/ Miranda was also present in the speakers corner incident (the 60 year old being attacked by transactivists) and the activists were telling her she was transphobic too. They did not like it when she told them transmysoginy was a made up word Idiots.
__________________
Quote:
Last edited by Vicky.; 30-10-2017 at 01:19 PM. |
||
Reply With Quote |
Reply |
|
|