The mentally ill are more in danger from us than we are from them

[DanaC]

Whatever is or is not wrong with Callum, the constant equating of mental illness with danger to others is out of order.

Statistically, there are likely to be several people using this forum who are currently being treated, or have been treated at some time, for some form of mental illness.

It is a complete but worryingly common misconception that the mentally ill, or those with mental (or learning) disabilities, are a danger to the rest of us. Not only is this an unfair perception of mental illness but it has the negative effect of increasing people's fear of and therefore aggression towards those who do suffer.

When people say they think Callum is schizophrenic and then follow that up with a comment about bodies under the patio it plays into a very nasty paradigm in our society. People with schizophrenia are far more likely than people without to be physically and verbally abused, attacked and even murdered. The perception of them as dangerous leads to increased isolation and social exclusion and increases their already statistically high risk of being harmed or killed by other, even as it increases the likelihood of them dropping away from help and into self harm.

These may just be jokes, but they add to the general noise and social perception of some of the most vulnerable people in our society as the most dangerous.

[chuff me dizzy]

Its now getting out of hand ..how many thread about Callum being mentally ill are going to be allowed on here ?

[smudgie]

Its now getting out of hand ..how many thread about Callum being mentally ill are going to be allowed on here ?

You really do have to wonder don't you....

[Withano]

Why can't everyone just get used to the fact that Callum is gonna kill us all?

[Tozzie]

oh dear, I wasn't trying to brand him that way, I was genuinly worried, but think of me as you wish. I am not so immature as to try sway peoples votes to get Dexter to win, its a TV show for goodness sake. If Dexter wins, thats good, if he doesn't it won't be the end of the world, I'll still think he was my number one anyway. I'm sorry if I offended you, it appears I did by my concern.

[MatthewS]

Whatever is or is not wrong with Callum, the constant equating of mental illness with danger to others is out of order.

Statistically, there are likely to be several people using this forum who are currently being treated, or have been treated at some time, for some form of mental illness.

It is a complete but worryingly common misconception that the mentally ill, or those with mental (or learning) disabilities, are a danger to the rest of us. Not only is this an unfair perception of mental illness but it has the negative effect of increasing people's fear of and therefore aggression towards those who do suffer.

When people say they think Callum is schizophrenic and then follow that up with a comment about bodies under the patio it plays into a very nasty paradigm in our society. People with schizophrenia are far more likely than people without to be physically and verbally abused, attacked and even murdered. The perception of them as dangerous leads to increased isolation and social exclusion and increases their already statistically high risk of being harmed or killed by other, even as it increases the likelihood of them dropping away from help and into self harm.

These may just be jokes, but they add to the general noise and social perception of some of the most vulnerable people in our society as the most dangerous.

I find this topic generally quite interesting. Care to give some figures that show mentally ill people are less likely to commit criminal offences then the mentally stable?

[Jake.]

Its now getting out of hand ..how many thread about Callum being mentally ill are going to be allowed on here ?

:joker:

[MatthewS]

It's true that's it's getting a bit overwhelming, theirs like 5 on the main page already lol

[boomoo]

Its now getting out of hand ..how many thread about Callum being mentally ill are going to be allowed on here ?

I agree. I cannot remember when people on the forums went so far damaging housemates characters.

Jackie has a lot to answer for and the so called BB psychologists who set this rabbit running.

[Johnnyuk123]

oh dear, I wasn't trying to brand him that way, I was genuinly worried, but think of me as you wish. I am not so immature as to try sway peoples votes to get Dexter to win, its a TV show for goodness sake. If Dexter wins, thats good, if he doesn't it won't be the end of the world, I'll still think he was my number one anyway. I'm sorry if I offended you, it appears I did by my concern.

Just ignore them. You've not done anything wrong.

[smeagol]

Whatever is or is not wrong with Callum, the constant equating of mental illness with danger to others is out of order.

Statistically, there are likely to be several people using this forum who are currently being treated, or have been treated at some time, for some form of mental illness.

It is a complete but worryingly common misconception that the mentally ill, or those with mental (or learning) disabilities, are a danger to the rest of us. Not only is this an unfair perception of mental illness but it has the negative effect of increasing people's fear of and therefore aggression towards those who do suffer.

When people say they think Callum is schizophrenic and then follow that up with a comment about bodies under the patio it plays into a very nasty paradigm in our society. People with schizophrenia are far more likely than people without to be physically and verbally abused, attacked and even murdered. The perception of them as dangerous leads to increased isolation and social exclusion and increases their already statistically high risk of being harmed or killed by other, even as it increases the likelihood of them dropping away from help and into self harm.

These may just be jokes, but they add to the general noise and social perception of some of the most vulnerable people in our society as the most dangerous.

:shocked:

[Withano]

I think people are genuinely concerned for him, his odd irrational behaviour is getting worse and his mentality seems to be deteriorating too. Its not trolling by making reasonable assumptions.

[Apple202]

Its now getting out of hand ..how many thread about Callum being mentally ill are going to be allowed on here ?

preach

[DanaC]

oh dear, I wasn't trying to brand him that way, I was genuinly worried, but think of me as you wish. I am not so immature as to try sway peoples votes to get Dexter to win, its a TV show for goodness sake. If Dexter wins, thats good, if he doesn't it won't be the end of the world, I'll still think he was my number one anyway. I'm sorry if I offended you, it appears I did by my concern.


Wasn't referring to your posts m'dear. It isn't the discussing of callum's mental state that I have a problem with per se. It's the constant jokes about bodies under the patio that play on the idea that someone with a mental illness or instability is dangerous. It's when someone says yes, they think he is mentally ill, and therefore he is dangerous. It's the routine conflation of 'psychotic' with 'psychopathic'.

It's done in humour mostly, but we live in a world where a person with severe learning disabilities, or with a mental illness like schizophrenia is likely to face serious and violent abuse or attack because of their mental state.

[Im_Juz_ChiLLin]

Wasn't referring to your posts m'dear. It isn't the discussing of callum's mental state that I have a problem with per se. It's the constant jokes about bodies under the patio that play on the idea that someone with a mental illness or instability is dangerous. It's when someone says yes, they think he is mentally ill, and therefore he is dangerous. It's the routine conflation of 'psychotic' with 'psychopathic'.

It's done in humour mostly, but we live in a world where a person with severe learning disabilities, or with a mental illness like schizophrenia is likely to face serious and violent abuse or attack because of their mental state.

huh where are your facts for such statements?

[DanaC]

I find this topic generally quite interesting. Care to give some figures that show mentally ill people are less likely to commit criminal offences then the mentally stable?

I didn't say less likely to commit criminal offences. It's the equating of mental illness with violence that is off-kilter.

EDINBURGH, Scotland — Although violent episodes are commonly perpetrated against the mentally ill, many of these individuals do not report the events to the police for fear of not being taken seriously — or believed, new research suggests.

A study from the United Kingdom showed that patients with severe mental illness (SMI) were 3 to 7 times more likely to be victims of violent crime and twice as likely to be victims of household crimes, such as burglaries, compared with the general population.

However, one third of the study participants with SMI did not report any of the crimes to a formal agency of any type.

"They found similar rates of violence against those with severe mental illness in the States. And this has also been found in Europe, Malaysia, and others. It really is international," said Dr. Khalifeh.

"We think the public health impact of these people being victims is greater than the public health impact of them being aggressors. And we need to make that clearer."

Results showed that the patients with SMI were significantly more likely to be the victim of violent crime than were their healthy peers. In addition, 20.2% of the women with SMI vs 2.7% of the women without SMI had violent crimes perpetrated against them (adjusted odds ratio [AOR], 6.9; 95% confidence interval [CI], 2.9 - 15.0).

For the men, 19.2 of those with SMI and 4.7% of those without were victims of this type of crime (AOR, 3.2; 95% CI, 1.6 - 6.8).

All participants with SI were also at a higher risk for household crime than were their healthy peers (21.6% vs 8.8%; AOR, 1.9; 95% CI, 1.2 - 2.8). There were no differences in household crimes between the sexes.

"We looked at both burglaries and people who are invited into your home and then walk away with your property," explained Dr. Khalifeh.

"Although they were at high risk for burglaries, people with mental illness were at a much higher risk for this latter occurrence. It was very much an exploitative experience. A lot of patients would say, 'I knew inviting that person home was a risk, but I was so isolated that I felt I had to take my chances,' " she said.

Not only are they more likely to be victims because of their mental state, they are also less likely to be able to successfully access the judicial system or gain redress for the same reason:

In fact, 35% of those with SMI did not disclose their victimization from any crime to the police or to healthcare professionals. Reasons given for this included not wanting to face disbelief or being blamed, and fear of being stigmatized.

Among the quotes gathered from these victimized participants, one woman reported that the police told her "they wouldn't take my case to court because I was a mental health person" and an unreliable witness.

"In India, I think stigma is even more magnetized than in the States, as it is in many countries as well. The problem is that people all over often say that mentally ill patients are violent," said Dr. Jana.

"But statistics in my country show that 10 times more violence is committed by people who are not mentally ill. And those who are mentally ill are more often the victims than the perpetrators. I cannot stress enough that that information needs to be pushed even more — that violence is not synonymous with mental illness," he said.

From here: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/807387


Also some interesting stuff here:

http://depts.washington.edu/mhreport/facts_violence.php

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1525086/

[MatthewS]

Fair play, I don't doubt the evidence, makes sense.

[DanaC]

huh where are your facts for such statements?

Attacks on the learning disabled are a serious problem in this (and I assume many other) country. As a local councillor I was regularly approached for help by parents/carers of learning disabled adults who were facing persistent and aggressive antisocial behaviour, sometimes to a very frightening level from neighbours and other local residents. Not just youngsters, mind you, full-gron adults too, who felt fully justified in hurling appalling abuse at these vulnerable people whenever they stepped out of their front door.

If you think bullying, namecalling and haranguing ends when they leave school think again. bricks through windows, dogmess through letterboxes etc. Shocking stuff, really.


Every so often a case is so terrible and the results so tragic that they hit the news:


http://www.theguardian.com/society/2007/jul/31/socialcare.comment

n a particularly disturbing murder case involving a man with profound learning difficulties, a teenage girl and two men tortured 38-year-old Steven Hoskin before forcing him to his death from a 100ft viaduct in St Austell, Cornwall.

Yesterday, they were jailed for murder and manslaughter. As well as drugging him with 70 paracetamol tablets, burning him with cigarettes and forcing him to walk around on a dog lead, the offenders made Mr Hoskin confess to being a paedophile before killing him. The evidence in this case suggests that had Mr Hoskin not been a disabled person, his murder would never have taken place.


Disturbingly, this case is not a one-off but a stark example of the many shocking crimes faced by disabled people, based on society's fears and prejudices about their impairments. In recent weeks, three other similar crimes involving disabled victims have been reported, indicating that disablist crime is a growing trend in our society.

One incident in Gloucestershire involved a man with learning difficulties being locked in a garden shed, beaten, burned and humiliated - before he was finally murdered. Another victim with learning difficulties in south Wales was strangled and beaten with a stick in an isolated spot. In Northampton, a man was tipped out of his wheelchair and kicked while on the ground, causing a head injury. He died the next day.

A recent poll of disabled people carried out by Scope indicated that as many as 47% said they had either experienced physical abuse themselves or witnessed physical abuse of a disabled companion.

[MatthewS]

I don't think anyone is advocating bullying or abuse towards the disabled or mentally challenged...

The threads are quite specific to callum and even then, while I fully get its going too far in some circumstances, I really don't think anyone is advocating that he gets stoned or abused when out of the house...

[DanaC]

Oh I know. And the odd jokey comment about him being a serial killer isn;t going to do any harm. But the last couple of days it's become a fairly constant theme that whenever anyone ta;ks about mental illness they then throw in a comment tthat suggests that makes him dangerous.


he might be dangerous for all I know...but the equation has become a little too complete for my liking that's all.


Anyway: that's my seriousness done for the night:p Move along please, nothing to see here :)

[Im_Juz_ChiLLin]

Callum says he will murder anyone who pushes Charlie whilst holding a knife....

[MatthewS]

Yeah it's certainly not as black and white as that. Mental illness of course doesn't necessarily mean someone will be violent and dangerous.

It's certainly case related. For example, someone with multiple personality disorder and schizophrenia, who also happens to have an aggressive nature, absolutely could be problematic. Whereas someone with a passive demeanor and ADHD or Autism wouldn't fit the bill.

[DanaC]

Callum says he will murder anyone who pushes Charlie whilst holding a knife....

I Didn't say I don't think Callum's dangerous. I have no idea if he is or isnt.

[DanaC]

Yeah it's certainly not as black and white as that. Mental illness of course doesn't necessarily mean someone will be violent and dangerous.

It's certainly case related. For example, someone with multiple personality disorder and schizophrenia, who also happens to have an aggressive nature, absolutely could be problematic. Whereas someone with a passive demeanor and ADHD or Autism wouldn't fit the bill.


Good point.


I'm going to stop picking posters up on it though, I think. I don't want to be a party pooper and I know people are just having fun and making jokes. That's kind of partly why I did this thread really. I just wanted it said. I wanted it out there and understood. Doesn't mean people shouldn't find these jokes funny, just wanted to make sure that underneath all that banter, there was some understanding of the reality.

[Livia]

The comments towards Callum, like them or hate them, are I think more to do with the kind of mentally ill people you may find serving time in Broadmoor. I don't think the comments are serious and I don't think anyone's suggested he has learning difficulties. The comments - way off target though they may be - shouldn't be the cause for an overreaction.

[DanaC]

Fair enough :)

[Kizzy]

Is it possible to have an overreaction to an overreaction though?
The extremes of emotion towards callum and all HM's are really distasteful and is cringier than callum could ever hope to be.

[DanaC]

I worded the title of this thread very badly, actually. There isn't actually a 'them' and 'us'.

[Kyle]

Whatever is or is not wrong with Callum, the constant equating of mental illness with danger to others is out of order.

Statistically, there are likely to be several people using this forum who are currently being treated, or have been treated at some time, for some form of mental illness.

It is a complete but worryingly common misconception that the mentally ill, or those with mental (or learning) disabilities, are a danger to the rest of us. Not only is this an unfair perception of mental illness but it has the negative effect of increasing people's fear of and therefore aggression towards those who do suffer.

When people say they think Callum is schizophrenic and then follow that up with a comment about bodies under the patio it plays into a very nasty paradigm in our society. People with schizophrenia are far more likely than people without to be physically and verbally abused, attacked and even murdered. The perception of them as dangerous leads to increased isolation and social exclusion and increases their already statistically high risk of being harmed or killed by other, even as it increases the likelihood of them dropping away from help and into self harm.

These may just be jokes, but they add to the general noise and social perception of some of the most vulnerable people in our society as the most dangerous.

Yes, I am currently one of them.

I agree with your post 100%

[anne666]

There is a lot of ignorance in society regarding mental illness. No ones fault. How many people unless involved in some way have much education in the subject. I agree the confusion between psychotic and psychopathic behaviour is widespread. My humble opinion is that at the least he perhaps has a degree of personality disorder (narcissism) coupled with emotional immaturity and lack of self confidence and respect. He certainly has real control issues because of these factors. A lot of posts are tongue in cheek but I agree that the general impression given is ignorance and intolerance of the mentally ill.

[Benjamin]

Why can't everyone just get used to the fact that Callum is gonna kill us all?

As expected another ridiculous comment from a ridiculous member.

[anne666]

As expected another ridiculous comment from a ridiculous member.

This.

[Withano]

As expected another ridiculous comment from a ridiculous member.

This.

How come everybody else on this thread can read sarcasm. Work on it guys, you embarrassed yourself.