[cfromhx02]

Originally Posted by JH95

Can this 'news paper' sink any lower? Probably not, its already at rock bottom. Pathetic excuse for a tabloid.

It's not the Paper.

Can you or any of the other excusers for trans jokes which are obviously based on transphobia sink any lower ?
Stop making excuses for ignorance and prejudice. Whoever he meant it at,
and more probability he meant it to have something to do with Luke A than he did not, it was still an anti trans joke.

Trans people and others who are decent are sick of people thinking it's ok to use them as something to call freaks or to have a laugh at.

We don't deride you and poke fun at you now do we ?

It was bigotry pure and simple.
And it's serious cos for some who carry out that just as a joke
they can physically attack even murder when they've had something to drink.

A lot of TS s have been attacked/murdered in UK and his or you yourself's bigotry cannot be let off the hook
or excused away as just a joke or it was the papers fault etc.

Ignorant people need educating if they'll care enough about others esp when they are attacked/murdered to listen.

If they don 't listen then they should be treated with disdain

and maybe Benedict should be booted off the prog to show Channel 5 is not ok with bigotry against TS s
just as has been done by CH 4 in past over racism,

but I guess he won't be as TS s are the most bigoted against group these days

and they'd be worried about losing the viewers who enjoy treating us as freaks and having a laugh at us (excusing their own bigotry not being mature enough to admit behind the scenes).

[Vanessa]

Originally Posted by cfromhx02

It's not the Paper.

Can you or any of the other excusers for trans jokes which are obviously based on transphobia sink any lower ?
Stop making excuses for ignorance and prejudice. Whoever he meant it at,
and more probability he meant it to have something to do with Luke A than he did not, it was still an anti trans joke.

Trans people and others who are decent are sick of people thinking it's ok to use them as something to call freaks or to have a laugh at.

We don't deride you and poke fun at you now do we ?

It was bigotry pure and simple.
And it's serious cos for some who carry out that just as a joke
they can physically attack even murder when they've had something to drink.

A lot of TS s have been attacked/murdered in UK and his or you yourself's bigotry cannot be let off the hook
or excused away as just a joke or it was the papers fault etc.

Ignorant people need educating if they'll care enough about others esp when they are attacked/murdered to listen.

If they don 't listen then they should be treated with disdain

and maybe Benedict should be booted off the prog to show Channel 5 is not ok with bigotry against TS s
just as has been done by CH 4 in past over racism,

but I guess he won't be as TS s are the most bigoted against group these days

and they'd be worried about losing the viewers who enjoy treating us as freaks and having a laugh at us (excusing their own bigotry not being mature enough to admit behind the scenes).

It was just a joke. I've heard far worse at my workplace!

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by cfromhx02

It's not the Paper.

Can you or any of the other excusers for trans jokes which are obviously based on transphobia sink any lower ?
Stop making excuses for ignorance and prejudice. Whoever he meant it at,
and more probability he meant it to have something to do with Luke A than he did not, it was still an anti trans joke.

Trans people and others who are decent are sick of people thinking it's ok to use them as something to call freaks or to have a laugh at.

We don't deride you and poke fun at you now do we ?

It was bigotry pure and simple.
And it's serious cos for some who carry out that just as a joke
they can physically attack even murder when they've had something to drink.

A lot of TS s have been attacked/murdered in UK and his or you yourself's bigotry cannot be let off the hook
or excused away as just a joke or it was the papers fault etc.

Ignorant people need educating if they'll care enough about others esp when they are attacked/murdered to listen.

If they don 't listen then they should be treated with disdain

and maybe Benedict should be booted off the prog to show Channel 5 is not ok with bigotry against TS s
just as has been done by CH 4 in past over racism,

but I guess he won't be as TS s are the most bigoted against group these days

and they'd be worried about losing the viewers who enjoy treating us as freaks and having a laugh at us (excusing their own bigotry not being mature enough to admit behind the scenes).

..but surely that's what Luke being in the house will do...none of us know exactly what Benedict did or in what context but surely if he was being offensive then he needs educating not thrown out of the house

[cfromhx02]

Originally Posted by Livia

Most people on here are extremely thoughtful and tolerant of all kinds of people. You would have made a far more positive impact if you'd signed on, introduced yourself and explained... but you start off by calling people names.

The responses of some notice how I just said some people

were just excuses for their own or their friends behaviour towards TS people.

It was only meant at them not decent people.

Yes maybe I should have introduced myself to decent people but my reply was meant at those who I see as just making excuses for themselves
or their friends behaviour.

I myself have been deliberately surrounded twice by large anti trans gangs.

And once on same day (apart from the two gangs separately surrounding me and hurling abuse at me) someone came up to my face as close as poss to try to force me to speak

and embarrass myself in reply to them when I couldn't pull the voice of the other gender off.

I also have another Trans acquaintance who had a petrol bomb thrown through her letter box when people found out where she lived.

Luckily she managed to notice the burning carpet, door mat in time before it caught light to any of the rest of her home.

But these are the reasons why I replied how I did.

And it was aimed at the excusers cos I've just had enough of excuses for bigots

or their friends behaviour now.And not meant at decent people.

But of course I'm the one who was wrong. It's not those who excuse calling us freaks or them or their friends laughing at us which can lead to those gangs I told you of, or the petrol bomb or attacks or murder.

Just joking and the prejudice behind it can lead to that so that's why I reacted how I did, not just because of what happened to me, but because I want to educate and protect others from being abused or attacked etc.

But of course it was me that was wrong. Not those who make excuses
(say it was the paper that was wrong) or say nothing is wrong with them
or friends joking about it.That is all that I was putting right
but of course those people won't be told that they are wrong or corrected.

[spitfire]

I love the Daily Star, it is my fave red top.

[Jake.]

Originally Posted by cfromhx02

It's not the Paper.

Can you or any of the other excusers for trans jokes which are obviously based on transphobia sink any lower ?
Stop making excuses for ignorance and prejudice. Whoever he meant it at,
and more probability he meant it to have something to do with Luke A than he did not, it was still an anti trans joke.

Trans people and others who are decent are sick of people thinking it's ok to use them as something to call freaks or to have a laugh at.

We don't deride you and poke fun at you now do we ?

It was bigotry pure and simple.
And it's serious cos for some who carry out that just as a joke
they can physically attack even murder when they've had something to drink.

A lot of TS s have been attacked/murdered in UK and his or you yourself's bigotry cannot be let off the hook
or excused away as just a joke or it was the papers fault etc.

Ignorant people need educating if they'll care enough about others esp when they are attacked/murdered to listen.

If they don 't listen then they should be treated with disdain

and maybe Benedict should be booted off the prog to show Channel 5 is not ok with bigotry against TS s
just as has been done by CH 4 in past over racism,

but I guess he won't be as TS s are the most bigoted against group these days

and they'd be worried about losing the viewers who enjoy treating us as freaks and having a laugh at us (excusing their own bigotry not being mature enough to admit behind the scenes).

So because I think the Daily Star is a piece of scum, I'm a bigot and I'm ignorant? Bloody hell, nice to meet you to.

[cfromhx02]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..but surely that's what Luke being in the house will do...none of us know exactly what Benedict did or in what context but surely if he was being offensive then he needs educating not thrown out of the house

True. And I used to agree.

I used to think people (most of the public) who know almost nothing about why someone is TS or not, needed to be educated, and myself and others have tried patiently to educate them.

But now I feel after years trying to educate some (that yes while some are decent and will listen to find out about the truth IE the brain studies etc and that we can't help but have to change our outer appearance). I've found that many don't want to listen or be educated.

So because some of the supposed just joking and the bigotry behind it leads to attacks or murder for some of us.

Those that don't want to listen or be educated need

it to be made more clear to them, maybe by seeing Benedict chucked out

and then it can be talked about on bit on the side etc why that was necessary.

IE Because some don't want to listen or be educated

and we need to make it clear that what most see as just joking has bigotry behind it and Trans people have been attacked and murdered.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by cfromhx02

True. And I used to agree.

I used to think people (most of the public) who know almost nothing about why someone is TS or not, needed to be educated, and myself and others have tried patiently to educate them.

But now I feel after years trying to educate some (that yes while some are decent and will listen to find out about the truth IE the brain studies etc and that we can't help but have to change our outer appearance). I've found that many don't want to listen or be educated.

So because some of the supposed just joking and the bigotry behind it leads to attacks or murder for some of us.

Those that don't want to listen or be educated need

it to be made more clear to them, maybe by seeing Benedict chucked out

and then it can be talked about on bit on the side etc why that was necessary.

IE Because some don't want to listen or be educated

and we need to make it clear that what most see as just joking has bigotry behind it and Trans people have been attacked and murdered.

...I don't know exactly what happened with Benedict as far as I'm aware no one has seen it but I will assume it was said/done as a joke and whilst I'm not saying that's ok I also think Benedict is not of the 'hate' category of people you are referring to..he is intelligent and imo it would be better for him to stay in the house so that Luke can help with that...
..as you say not enough people are educated on transexuality but that doesn't mean they are bigoted either and Luke being in the house and talking about himself and his life will help educate the HM's as well as the public so they realise it's not something to be joked about....
...yes I agree that some people 'hate'..anything or anyone they think of as different or that they don't understand in an way and they will never be educated...but I don't think Benedict falls into that category which imo means he shouldn't be thrown out..I just don't think that will do anything positive at all

[Halfwit]

Originally Posted by cfromhx02

True. And I used to agree.

I used to think people (most of the public) who know almost nothing about why someone is TS or not, needed to be educated, and myself and others have tried patiently to educate them.

But now I feel after years trying to educate some (that yes while some are decent and will listen to find out about the truth IE the brain studies etc and that we can't help but have to change our outer appearance). I've found that many don't want to listen or be educated.

So because some of the supposed just joking and the bigotry behind it leads to attacks or murder for some of us.

Those that don't want to listen or be educated need

it to be made more clear to them, maybe by seeing Benedict chucked out

and then it can be talked about on bit on the side etc why that was necessary.

IE Because some don't want to listen or be educated

and we need to make it clear that what most see as just joking has bigotry behind it and Trans people have been attacked and murdered.

seriously... what.the.hell.
i have mates who have done it, i have done it and believe me, neither of us had transgender people in mind when we went for this practical joke.
make it about you/transgender people, i don't really care, but spare the rest of us with your overly pc view on the world.














babies with aids!

[MrWong]

I've never known the joke to be aimed at trans people either.

[Ramsay]

thats like someone going around jumping up and down wearing glasses in the room across from me..just because i wear glasses doesnt mean that its about me

[patsylimerick]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...I don't know exactly what happened with Benedict as far as I'm aware no one has seen it but I will assume it was said/done as a joke and whilst I'm not saying that's ok I also think Benedict is not of the 'hate' category of people you are referring to..he is intelligent and imo it would be better for him to stay in the house so that Luke can help with that...
..as you say not enough people are educated on transexuality but that doesn't mean they are bigoted either and Luke being in the house and talking about himself and his life will help educate the HM's as well as the public so they realise it's not something to be joked about....
...yes I agree that some people 'hate'..anything or anyone they think of as different or that they don't understand in an way and they will never be educated...but I don't think Benedict falls into that category which imo means he shouldn't be thrown out..I just don't think that will do anything positive at all

Of course he shouldn't be thrown out! I've seen people carry out that 'joke' when I wasn't aware of what transexuality was; never found it particularly funny, but certainly wouldn't read any kind of prejudice or hatred into it. I've also seen documentaries about drag queens who do this all the time to look better in their more revealing outfits.

I seriously doubt that Benedict is in any way closed-minded. And I think it's disingenuous to accuse everyone who found the joke harmless (if also humourless) of ignorance and prejudice.

cfromhx02, I am truly sorry if the very small minority of the population who are ignorant bigots have had a significant impact on your life. But I don't think this incident was in any way meant to be offensive.

[armand.kay]

Originally Posted by cfromhx02

BS to all those who say there was nothing to it. Just bigots not wanting to admit to their prejudice.

Happens a lot in this country.

Bigotry of all forms is a lot worse in this country than most would admit too.

And usually the ones who criticize PC values ((which are usually just about treating people with decency and manners)

(traits so lacking in most many who don't know the meaning of manners and would look dumb founded at you if you talk about thinking of another's feelings)

are usually only attacking PC values to justify their right to continue to be rude and offensive to others.

Whether Benedict meant it as aimed at Luke A or not,
which he may not have,
it was still obvious to anyone who has a working brain,
obviously a joke about TS people in general,
which is not just a joke , but which shows prejudice
and bigotry behind it.

The fact that the bigotry of most others is based on ignorance does not help TS people.

Because most of these ignorant when you try to explain that TS people are forced into changing
and explain about the studies done on the more predominantly male
or female parts of the brain,
they don't want to listen,
and most prefer to continue to see as us freaks and either just use us as an object of humour
(the bigotry behind it can lead to attacks later or by others if unchecked) and of course some attack us when they get the chance.

Many trans have been attacked (usually late at night when the bigots true feelings come out cos of drink) and murdered in this country.

The fact is nearly every time TS s are on a documentary or a chat programme they are always used as something to laugh at.And for some that attitude goes further into attacking or murdering us, which is more likely after they've had a drink though some people would attack even murder sober.


That is bigotry pure and simple.Bigots should be exposed and educated not ignored or have excuses made for them.

It is important because TS people get attacked and murdered sometimes (that's where bigotry/ignorance in the form of just jokes can lead to if they go unchecked and people say oh but it was just a joke
when they don't care for another human beings feelings (yes that's correct TS s are people too they have feelings and aren't something just to be called freaks or laughed at
by the ignorant or nasty human beings just for their fun))
as generally by most they are treated as freaks and most just see them as something to joke about.

It is based on ignorance, but that helps none,
TS s are sick of hearing "it's a choice" or "it's about sex"
from the idiots who attack us and think it's ok to abuse.
Idiots "it is not i repeat not a choice"
and it is not sexual.
Many studies have shown that male to female or female to male trans gender people
have the brain of the other gender so they are forced to change
to have any chance at happiness.

Whether Benedict meant it aimed at Luke A or not.
And it's more likely he did rather than did not.
It was still either just a stupid thing to do or more likely it was an anti trans joke in general
which most of these guys who tuck their willy between their legs pissed on sat night as one poster said
mean as an anti-trans /transphobobic joke too.
Bigotry is more likely to come out (it's harder to keep secret)
when someone is not able
to control their behavior because of drink.

No excuses can be made for bigotry.

This post is so stupid! Did you read the article or not:

1) How could the joke possibly be aimed at Luke when this happened before he knew anything about him being trans.

2) almost every male (including myself)I know has put there dick between there legs as a joke at least once. When I did it transgender people did not even cross my mind .

[Kizzy]

The use of the word transphobia is a little extreme in the thread title, it was insensitive maybe even ignorant but thats it.
I'm not benedicts biggest fan however I don't think he would be so stupid to show himself as prejudiced and believe it was a joke. A bad joke and in poor taste but a joke none the less.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by armand.kay

This post is so stupid! Did you read the article or not:

1) How could the joke possibly be aimed at Luke when this happened before he knew anything about him being trans.

2) almost every male (including myself)I know has put there dick between there legs as a joke at least once. When I did it transgender people did not even cross my mind .

Hang on, I thought Luke told victoria and benedict together? If victoria knew then so did benedict....

[armand.kay]

Originally Posted by kizzy

Hang on, I thought Luke told victoria and benedict together? If victoria knew then so did benedict....

Well in the article she said he didn't know about it.

Edit: Lol my bad it said 'did know' but I read it as 'didn't know'.

[andy191]

Didn’t they regularly ask the housemates on BOTS last year if they “have ever tucked it between their legs and pretended to be a woman?”

[Monkey Slut]

Originally Posted by kizzy

Hang on, I thought Luke told victoria and benedict together? If victoria knew then so did benedict....

Victoria was there when Luke told Benedict but he had already told Victoria before that.

[Patrick]

BIG Brother is at the centre of a controversial sex-swap row after just one week on air.

I do love how they make it sound like the whole nation is in fury arguing over this and wanting the show banned etc etc

[Anthony Hatface]

Probably desperate for a party trick, though I can't imagine how he got that one onto his VT ...

[Lostie!]

If Benedict was transphobic, surely he'd have nominated Luke A. I do appreciate why Victoria found it in bad taste, but I doubt that Benedict meant any offence.

[MattyF]

It's only because Luke A. is a transexual that any sort of issue has been made out of this. Benedict would probably have done it whether Luke was on or not on the show, so it's just pointless slander on his reputation over a non-existant issue.

[fruit_cake]

the transsexual thing hasn't been mentioned since Luke told everyone in the house as far as I'm aware

[sampvt]

Help me out here guys. It seems to be ok on here (not naming names or housemates) to call people fat, queer, scum, non men, disgusting, smelly, rude, even twats and c8nts, in fact all manner of terrible words, but as soon as anyone hints at a joke made by someone well away from someoe WHO WAS NOT THE INTENDED TARGET, the PC mob come out firing on all 4 cylinders.

Do we all now have to walk around on eggshells where Luke is involved or maybe a modecum of sence should be applied. LUKE KNEW WHAT HE WAS DOING when he signed up, on the other hand the producers did not think too long and hard. They have bought themselves an accident waiting to happen. I can see Lukes plan, he will play Mr Goody two shoes till he gets attacked then he will playthe sympathy card and all the pc,s will vote for him and he wins by default. Or maybe not, who knows.

Now before everyone gets at me, no I am not transphobic, homaphobic or even photogenic, I am only stating the obvious. i am not a gay hater nor a lesbian basher nor am I a chauvanist pig. i am a 60yr old x golf professional married to the same woman for 41 yrs and raisied by straight parents that died married. Just a regular joe whos son incidentally is gay.

I will admit however to being a bb fanatic but this is my first yr on the forums as i used to think they were frequented by old men in macs and run by hooded nerds. Obviously my view has now changedall of the aforementioned are in the house, lol.

[fruit_cake]

it does seem a bit strange to me that they feel they need to 'reveal themselves' to everyone but maybe it's a difficult position to be in. I don't think I'd have known Luke wasn't a man until he said so.