[Semtex]

Originally Posted by hot2go

I like Bear but I really can't f-ck myself at the moment, I'm eating a cheese sandwhich . Thanks for the suggestion though, it's very touching .... Maybe next time we could share the Bear Neccessitues together, you seem like a real catch.

Excellent, I look forward to seeing where your moral compass lies in the future when we chat.

[hot2go]

Bear has not threatened anyone, Heavy D has.... Bear has not said anything offensive that warrants removal, Biggins has... Bear has never lost his temper in the company of others, Heavy D has. Bear has not violated another housemate, Marnie has.
Bear is a wind up merchant but its Heavy who made threats and its Heavy D who still holds a grudge as shown in last nights noms. Heavy D is the loose cannon in that house right now not Bear.

[hot2go]

Originally Posted by Semtex

Excellent, I look forward to seeing where your moral compass lies in the future when we chat.

What makes you think I have a moral compass and how am I meant to use when I've already been told to go f-ck myself ?..,.. I doubt we will be chatting much in the future, I'll be far too busy f-cking myself to have time to chat with you. But thanks for your interest in me.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Ammi

....but it doesn't have to be any type of insecurities/fears etc for a temper tantrum to set in either, Joey and to be at the point of 'lack of control'...my perspective is different from yours because I have seen 'Bear behaviour' in so many children and he really was displaying the behaviour of a child imo...so easy to make that comparison...and I would allow that child or those children back into a social group and with their peers only when I felt that they were calm because it would be my responsibility to do so and to decide that, not for the 'anger' to decide that..I have had many injuries and a few quite serious ones which have been done by 'I'm calm now' children...that's fine and my choice but it's my responsibility to feel confident that neither the child themselves is in any way in danger of physical harm or any of their peers are...

..yes, he could have been allowed out to have a cigarette and the other housemates locked in the bedroom or something for a few moments but ..but again, would we remove a whole classroom of children from that threat or that one person causing and responsible for it, that just seems like a no brainer to me but that's also my perspectives...I would think that they couldn't give a specific amount of time because he was still 'demanding' and erratic with his 'calm' so that time scale was being determined by himself and his own behaviour and when they felt it would be ok to allow him into his room and bed...(and that might not have actually been that long at all, we just don't know or whole conversations because we only get bite-size and condensed..)...but they fulfilled their responsibility of being the ones who felt confident themselves in there decision of when the 'calm came' enough for him to leave....

Oh gosh it is amazing how distortion of facts and fairness go out the window when people take a dislike to certain housemates.
Firstly I am not someone who cares much about Bear but I do care about fairness.

The only person that night who appeared to be nearing threatening physically another housemate was Heavy D to Bear, not vice versa.

I never said and no one said lock the others in the bedroom either.
Often in BB, housemates are ordered into the house or bedroom and to stay there for often many and often trivial reasons at times too, once they were told to do so when someone was shouting out information on the other side of the house walls for goodness sake.

All BB had to do was tell housemates to remain in the house,pull the shutters down possibly too, allowing Bear to be in the garden until the room was set up and ready.
They would have the freedom to talk, mix with each other, go to bed, the toilet,the kitchen, get food or a drink.
Hardly the same scenario they put Bear in.

There is no need whatsoever to force any human being to stay in a locked small room with no one physically present for any unspecified amount of time.
Bear had calmed down, he accepted not going back into the house but erupted when told he had to stay in the diary room behind that locked door,being given no idea how long that would take.
You may see that as fair, I don't.

Also just where did Bear make any personal physical threats during the whole incident to any other housemate at all.
Or do we now as a society judge and condemn people on what we 'think' they may do rather than what they actually do.

As I say when a housemate is not liked,it is amazing how fairness and what is right goes out the window as to anything negative applied to them.
Even when all that happened here was once alone and well away from the others he threw one object,which happened to hit a mirror and broke a bit of it.

No threats from him to any other physically during the whole incident, no standing offs and no major aggression towards any other housemate directly,unlike heavy Ds performance towards him,simply because he couldn't get from a younger female what Bear had been able to.

However Heavy is all right and Bear all wrong, sorry not in my book, not after the way BB handled this.
No one, whether I like them or not, should be forced against their will to be locked in a small room, with no definite deadline as to time for that, who has not threatened anyone physically directly.
I am actually surprised you can think that right in all honesty.

[user104658]

Hmmm... He's not in good control of his emotions obviously, and I wouldn't say he "didn't do anything wrong" (if the glass had smashed, any crew behind it could easily have been hurt, I suspect he just wasn't thinking and forgot that there are people behind the glass), but I do think the situation was handled very badly. For one, you can't trap someone in a small space and then act surprised when they kick off... it's the basic psychology of being "backed into a corner", the instinct is to lash out.

They should have let him out the other door and outside for a smoke, someone from production could have talked to him there. It's just not a good idea to trap someone .

What I do have a major issue with, like Joey, is the fact that very little was said to Heavy D when he was being deliberately aggressive and physically intimidating. That sad old American woman (I can't remember her name... I've only watched 3 episodes ) is of course right that it should be obvious why he's angry and it is. His ego and sense of entitlement. Feels like he's "laid claim" to a girl who has zero interest in him, and is now getting aggressive when he feels like that's being "challenged". Deeply, deeply pathetic is what that is. Then he jumps up and attempts to use his physical size to intimidate little Bear, who is about half his size. Again, deeply pathetic. But they barely said two words to him :/.

[Garfie]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..in the bedroom when it all kicked off as it were, the females especially looked very frightened and concerned...Heavy was called into the DR when he got out of bed and stood over Bear and in the DR, he didn't display any worrying, continued aggressive behaviour so was allowed back into the house because no 'threat' was deemed...that was easy to see..but with Bear, his aggression continued in the DR and continued..not only verbally in threatening to tear the DR apart or whatever he was raging but also in kicking the door down...he was obviously not able to be let into the house again because how would BB know that someone wouldn't get physically harmed through his behaviour, which was completely out of control and so inconsistent and erratic that even in a calm moment, could 'flip again' in suddenness and without warning...?...They absolutely had the right to keep hi in there until they had a room/bed prepared for him but they would have also wanted him to be more calm and 'stable' before he was allowed to that room and bed as well because would he just start destroying again..?...


..we've screamed and we've shouted about 'duty of care' and the welfare of the housemates with what Aubrey did and it was wrong for BB to allow Bear to drink and eat etc..they didn't consider his well-being in that and that doesn't sit well at all but this time they have considered welfare and well-being etc and we think that was wrong also..?...he was kept in the DR for his own safety and for the safety of the others as it would have only taken a split second for him to physically harm someone, either intentionally or unintentionally in destroying property and he was too erratic in his behaviour for those risks to be taken...'I'm calm now, yes let me out'..?...well no Bear, because right at this moment in time you can go from zero to beyond reason in a split second and before we could intervene to prevent harm....if we were housemates ourselves, would we really want him back in the house with us..?..would we really feel safe and 'cared for by BB' if he were let back into the house..?...because many of those bedroom faces looked quite worried and fearfilled....he displayed no signs of panic in the DR, only a loss of control with anger and aggressive emotion....they can only go on and primarily with what was being displayed and make a decision for the safety of all....

Always the voice of reason, Ammi.

[hot2go]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Oh gosh it is amazing how distortion of facts and fairness go out the window when people take a dislike to certain housemates.
Firstly I am not someone who cares much about Bear but I do care about fairness.

The only person that night who appeared to be nearing threatening physically another housemate was Heavy D to Bear, not vice versa.

I never said and no one said lock the others in the bedroom either.
Often in BB, housemates are ordered into the house or bedroom and to stay there for often many and often trivial reasons at times too, once they were told to do so when someone was shouting out information on the other side of the house walls for goodness sake.

All BB had to do was tell housemates to remain in the house,pull the shutters down possibly too, allowing Bear to be in the garden until the room was set up and ready.
They would have the freedom to talk, mix with each other, go to bed, the toilet,the kitchen, get food or a drink.
Hardly the same scenario they put Bear in.

There is no need whatsoever to force any human being to stay in a locked small room with no one physically present for any unspecified amount of time.
Bear had calmed down, he accepted not going back into the house but erupted when told he had to stay in the diary room behind that locked door,being given no idea how long that would take.
You may see that as fair, I don't.

Also just where did Bear make any personal physical threats during the whole incident to any other housemate at all.
Or do we now as a society judge and condemn people on what we 'think' they may do rather than what they actually do.

As I say when a housemate is not liked,it is amazing how fairness and what is right goes out the window as to anything negative applied to them.
Even when all that happened here was once alone and well away from the others he threw one object,which happened to hit a mirror and broke a bit of it.

No threats from him to any other physically during the whole incident, no standing offs and no major aggression towards any other housemate directly,unlike heavy Ds performance towards him,simply because he couldn't get from a younger female what Bear had been able to.

However Heavy is all right and Bear all wrong, sorry not in my book, not after the way BB handled this.
No one, whether I like them or not, should be forced against their will to be locked in a small room, with no definite deadline as to time for that, who has not threatened anyone physically directly.
I am actually surprised you can think that right in all honesty.

This is spot on IMO

[Withano]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Oh gosh it is amazing how distortion of facts and fairness go out the window when people take a dislike to certain housemates.
Firstly I am not someone who cares much about Bear but I do care about fairness.

The only person that night who appeared to be nearing threatening physically another housemate was Heavy D to Bear, not vice versa.

I never said and no one said lock the others in the bedroom either.
Often in BB, housemates are ordered into the house or bedroom and to stay there for often many and often trivial reasons at times too, once they were told to do so when someone was shouting out information on the other side of the house walls for goodness sake.

All BB had to do was tell housemates to remain in the house,pull the shutters down possibly too, allowing Bear to be in the garden until the room was set up and ready.
They would have the freedom to talk, mix with each other, go to bed, the toilet,the kitchen, get food or a drink.
Hardly the same scenario they put Bear in.

There is no need whatsoever to force any human being to stay in a locked small room with no one physically present for any unspecified amount of time.
Bear had calmed down, he accepted not going back into the house but erupted when told he had to stay in the diary room behind that locked door,being given no idea how long that would take.
You may see that as fair, I don't.

Also just where did Bear make any personal physical threats during the whole incident to any other housemate at all.
Or do we now as a society judge and condemn people on what we 'think' they may do rather than what they actually do.

As I say when a housemate is not liked,it is amazing how fairness and what is right goes out the window as to anything negative applied to them.
Even when all that happened here was once alone and well away from the others he threw one object,which happened to hit a mirror and broke a bit of it.

No threats from him to any other physically during the whole incident, no standing offs and no major aggression towards any other housemate directly,unlike heavy Ds performance towards him,simply because he couldn't get from a younger female what Bear had been able to.

However Heavy is all right and Bear all wrong, sorry not in my book, not after the way BB handled this.
No one, whether I like them or not, should be forced against their will to be locked in a small room, with no definite deadline as to time for that, who has not threatened anyone physically directly.
I am actually surprised you can think that right in all honesty.

What would you have done

Step 1 - Bear breaks a two way mirror because Renee clocked him and told him how transparent he was in his passive aggressive attack on Heavy, we can probably presume we got lucky and there wasnt anybody stood behind the two way mirror, not that Bear cared.

Step 2 - You call him to the diary room because obviously hes a danger to himself, his housemates and the production team

Step 3 - You know he cant stay in the house withh that behaviour so you need to arrange security, you need to make sure it is safe for him to walk through the camera runs to avoid a lawsuit and you need to rearrange the task room to make it in to a bedroom

Step 4 - he lashes out in anger because you wasnt fast enough

Now what? He cant go back in the house, hes a danger to the housemates, he cant run through the camera runs, hes a danger to the production team, it would be completely unfair to let a bouncer handle it, we dont know how he would react. How do you treat an immediate physical threat? Suck his dick and give him a cigarette in the hope he would immediately calm down? Or wait for him to calm down and escort him to the spare bedroom when everything is safe and ready.

Its the latter. They done all they could, everyone was kept safe that entire day so they did a job well done.

Bear was a child. A petulant diva and there was no need to pander to his command especially when he was in that state. Making Bear smile wasnt worth the physical damage he could have done to a person. I believe they completely assessed the situation, nobody left with a bruise and they easily could have done.

[Jordan.]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Oh gosh it is amazing how distortion of facts and fairness go out the window when people take a dislike to certain housemates.
Firstly I am not someone who cares much about Bear but I do care about fairness.

The only person that night who appeared to be nearing threatening physically another housemate was Heavy D to Bear, not vice versa.

I never said and no one said lock the others in the bedroom either.
Often in BB, housemates are ordered into the house or bedroom and to stay there for often many and often trivial reasons at times too, once they were told to do so when someone was shouting out information on the other side of the house walls for goodness sake.

All BB had to do was tell housemates to remain in the house,pull the shutters down possibly too, allowing Bear to be in the garden until the room was set up and ready.
They would have the freedom to talk, mix with each other, go to bed, the toilet,the kitchen, get food or a drink.
Hardly the same scenario they put Bear in.

There is no need whatsoever to force any human being to stay in a locked small room with no one physically present for any unspecified amount of time.
Bear had calmed down, he accepted not going back into the house but erupted when told he had to stay in the diary room behind that locked door,being given no idea how long that would take.
You may see that as fair, I don't.

Also just where did Bear make any personal physical threats during the whole incident to any other housemate at all.
Or do we now as a society judge and condemn people on what we 'think' they may do rather than what they actually do.

As I say when a housemate is not liked,it is amazing how fairness and what is right goes out the window as to anything negative applied to them.
Even when all that happened here was once alone and well away from the others he threw one object,which happened to hit a mirror and broke a bit of it.

No threats from him to any other physically during the whole incident, no standing offs and no major aggression towards any other housemate directly,unlike heavy Ds performance towards him,simply because he couldn't get from a younger female what Bear had been able to.

However Heavy is all right and Bear all wrong, sorry not in my book, not after the way BB handled this.
No one, whether I like them or not, should be forced against their will to be locked in a small room, with no definite deadline as to time for that, who has not threatened anyone physically directly.
I am actually surprised you can think that right in all honesty.

I personally think your take on the situation is the distorted one. It was fairly obvious to me he went seeking a reaction and fight that night, hence him walking into the room and gloating that he would be sharing a bed with Chloe and then patronising Heavy putting his foot on his bed when he got upset over. He reaped what he sowed, same goes for him being locked in the DR if he didn't start smashing up the house they wouldn't have had to exclude him. Plus having to wait 10 or so minutes whilst they set up a bedroom shouldn't be a big ask for a grown adult.

[hot2go]

Heavy wanted the girl,...Heavy thought he could just have her....Heavy treated her like dirt....then when he couldn't have her and she chose someone else Heavy turned aggressive and threatening....Like King Kong.
Any action on Bears part was a direct reaction to the agression being projected from Heavy.
The garden and the bottle is a separate incident and that is where Bear scored a home goal...because if he had just held it together a bit longer we would all be having conversations about Heavys threatening and intimidating loss of control....but the fact is very clear...the first person and only person to make threats was Heavy the night before when he turned on Bear thinking he had vandalised his bed. The person making threats in the bedroom was Heavy.
I can understand why Bear felt it so unfare that he was locked up like a criminal and Heavy got off Scott free and was tucked up in his bed.

[Garfie]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Well why didn't they' ask them.

Perhaps because he actually had not hurt anyone, chairs have been broken before in BB series.

Maybe he is a thug, however they selected him for the series, no one else.
Why should he be in a locked room however, would you like to be locked in small room, not being told when you are getting out.

He actually had not in fact hurt anyone,had he thrown the object to the pool rather than where it landed, it would have been just a talking to rather than anything else.
No one else in any event was anywhere near him when he threw it so no one was in danger and neither were they in the bedroom, he had already voluntarily himself walked away from the argument and left the bedroom to sit outside.

Hate on him all you like and then reject any fairness but those are the facts.

You are right in saying he hadn't physically hurt anyone, but his repeated unpleasant and drunken behaviour was clearly making others feels very uncomfortable and unsafe, and I think that's the point Ammi was trying to make. BB clearly said he had been warned repeatedly for such behaviour.

When someone is very drunk, has a volatile personality and is doing all he can to antagonise and provoke reactions in other, it makes for a very tense and unnerving situation- I wouldn't have wanted to have to be one of the other housemates in those circumstances and I would have been very uncomfortable had he been allowed back into the house or garden. You've looked at this from Bear's side but perhaps the other housemates were experiencing more fear than you've realised?

That has to balanced when considering Bear being locked in the diary room. What you've said yourself indicates that had Bear and Heavy D been placed together again there was every possibility of an escalation in events. Heavy D was calmer and had just wanted to sleep, whereas Bear was very drunk and intent on instigating some sort of conflict. I think this was a pattern BB had recognised, and was referring to when they reminded Bear he had been repeatedly warned. Therefore, keeping Bear separated was a logical conclusion.

Bear needs to learn to accept that actions have consequences and, if you behave inappropriately, then unfortunately those consequences are not likely to be ones you like- such as being locked in the DR whilst they are sorting out alternative accommodation, and ensuring that his calmer mood was going to last (something that is in doubt when people are very drunk and have a volatile personality).

When all's said and done, being expected to just sit, wait and calm down was not really such a big deal. Had his reaction truly been about claustrophobia rather than drunkeness, I am sure he would have raised this as a serious concern the following day, rather than just apologising, making jokes about kissing Chloe and continuing his familiar pattern of behaviour.

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by hot2go

Bear has not threatened anyone, Heavy D has.... Bear has not said anything offensive that warrants removal, Biggins has... Bear has never lost his temper in the company of others, Heavy D has. Bear has not violated another housemate, Marnie has.
Bear is a wind up merchant but its Heavy who made threats and its Heavy D who still holds a grudge as shown in last nights noms. Heavy D is the loose cannon in that house right now not Bear.

And Heavy D who's stalking a girl who's not interested in him

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Oh gosh it is amazing how distortion of facts and fairness go out the window when people take a dislike to certain housemates.
Firstly I am not someone who cares much about Bear but I do care about fairness.

The only person that night who appeared to be nearing threatening physically another housemate was Heavy D to Bear, not vice versa.

I never said and no one said lock the others in the bedroom either.
Often in BB, housemates are ordered into the house or bedroom and to stay there for often many and often trivial reasons at times too, once they were told to do so when someone was shouting out information on the other side of the house walls for goodness sake.

All BB had to do was tell housemates to remain in the house,pull the shutters down possibly too, allowing Bear to be in the garden until the room was set up and ready.
They would have the freedom to talk, mix with each other, go to bed, the toilet,the kitchen, get food or a drink.
Hardly the same scenario they put Bear in.

There is no need whatsoever to force any human being to stay in a locked small room with no one physically present for any unspecified amount of time.
Bear had calmed down, he accepted not going back into the house but erupted when told he had to stay in the diary room behind that locked door,being given no idea how long that would take.
You may see that as fair, I don't.

Also just where did Bear make any personal physical threats during the whole incident to any other housemate at all.
Or do we now as a society judge and condemn people on what we 'think' they may do rather than what they actually do.

As I say when a housemate is not liked,it is amazing how fairness and what is right goes out the window as to anything negative applied to them.
Even when all that happened here was once alone and well away from the others he threw one object,which happened to hit a mirror and broke a bit of it.

No threats from him to any other physically during the whole incident, no standing offs and no major aggression towards any other housemate directly,unlike heavy Ds performance towards him,simply because he couldn't get from a younger female what Bear had been able to.

However Heavy is all right and Bear all wrong, sorry not in my book, not after the way BB handled this.
No one, whether I like them or not, should be forced against their will to be locked in a small room, with no definite deadline as to time for that, who has not threatened anyone physically directly.
I am actually surprised you can think that right in all honesty.

Post of the series

[-Sue-]

Saying 'Bear hasn't done anything wrong' is like saying fish do not swim in water!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Garfie]

Originally Posted by Ammi

....but it doesn't have to be any type of insecurities/fears etc for a temper tantrum to set in either, Joey and to be at the point of 'lack of control'...my perspective is different from yours because I have seen 'Bear behaviour' in so many children and he really was displaying the behaviour of a child imo...so easy to make that comparison...and I would allow that child or those children back into a social group and with their peers only when I felt that they were calm because it would be my responsibility to do so and to decide that, not for the 'anger' to decide that..I have had many injuries and a few quite serious ones which have been done by 'I'm calm now' children...that's fine and my choice but it's my responsibility to feel confident that neither the child themselves is in any way in danger of physical harm or any of their peers are...

..yes, he could have been allowed out to have a cigarette and the other housemates locked in the bedroom or something for a few moments but ..but again, would we remove a whole classroom of children from that threat or that one person causing and responsible for it, that just seems like a no brainer to me but that's also my perspectives...I would think that they couldn't give a specific amount of time because he was still 'demanding' and erratic with his 'calm' so that time scale was being determined by himself and his own behaviour and when they felt it would be ok to allow him into his room and bed...(and that might not have actually been that long at all, we just don't know or whole conversations because we only get bite-size and condensed..)...but they fulfilled their responsibility of being the ones who felt confident themselves in there decision of when the 'calm came' enough for him to leave....

Brilliant post, Ammi. Now I am understanding where your good sense and opinions come from- repeated experience. I've had numerous similar experiences with teenagers where similar decisions have to be made, particularly when certain patterns of behaviour have been displayed on a number of occasions. Common sense and logic have to prevail.

[Glenn-C]

Originally Posted by hot2go

Heavy wanted the girl,...Heavy thought he could just have her....Heavy treated her like dirt....then when he couldn't have her and she chose someone else Heavy turned aggressive and threatening....Like King Kong.
Any action on Bears part was a direct reaction to the agression being projected from Heavy.
The garden and the bottle is a separate incident and that is where Bear scored a home goal...because if he had just held it together a bit longer we would all be having conversations about Heavys threatening and intimidating loss of control....but the fact is very clear...the first person and only person to make threats was Heavy the night before when he turned on Bear thinking he had vandalised his bed. The person making threats in the bedroom was Heavy.
I can understand why Bear felt it so unfare that he was locked up like a criminal and Heavy got off Scott free and was tucked up in his bed.

The only reason Bear is kissing Chloe is because he knows Heavy D fancies her, and he wants Heavy to know that what Bear wants, Bear gets and it doesn't matter if it upsets anyone

[-Sue-]

Originally Posted by Defizo

The only reason Bear is kissing Chloe is because he knows Heavy D fancies her, and he wants Heavy to know that what Bear wants, Bear gets and it doesn't matter if it upsets anyone

that and chloe is 'easy'...does she know the word 'no'???

no respect for herself...just as Bear has no respect for anyone's feelings but his own sad really

[Jordan.]

Originally Posted by Defizo

The only reason Bear is kissing Chloe is because he knows Heavy D fancies her, and he wants Heavy to know that what Bear wants, Bear gets and it doesn't matter if it upsets anyone

The truth, he likes to feed his own ego and provoke as many people as he can in the process

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Jordan.

I personally think your take on the situation is the distorted one. It was fairly obvious to me he went seeking a reaction and fight that night, hence him walking into the room and gloating that he would be sharing a bed with Chloe and then patronising Heavy putting his foot on his bed when he got upset over. He reaped what he sowed, same goes for him being locked in the DR if he didn't start smashing up the house they wouldn't have had to exclude him. Plus having to wait 10 or so minutes whilst they set up a bedroom shouldn't be a big ask for a grown adult.

Oh come off it,what he did with the rose was at best annoying but not threatening for goodness sake,.

he put his foot on the side of the bed not on the bed, he shouldn't have but he did not put his foot on the bed.

He did not push himself and get up aggressively towards heavy D either.

He was not smashing the place up, he broke a mirror by throwing an object, not deliberately smashing anything up and he went to the diary room the moment he was called.

Had the room been already in place or had he been told he would be in the diary room a certain amount of time, he may also have not exploded again.

Oh and somehow you know for sure he was only to be in the diary room for 10 minutes while they got the room ready do you, that's odd because no one else does and Bb never said a time frame.
They actually couldn't, they said as soon as was possible, yet you know it was only 10 minutes... really!.
How do you know the expectancy wasn't more like half an hour, an hour or possibly even more.

Then you get at me and tell me I see this in a distorted way, so clearly you think it right for anyone to end up being locked up for not even threatening anyone.
Also if you think his bringing the rose in as a threatening act then sorry you have lost me completely on that one.
A winding up and annoying of someone maybe, threatening, not a chance.

Seeking a reaction from someone is not threatening them either.
Also what on earth was innocent Heavy D doing watching from behind the window, almost pervert like, all that bear and Chloe were up to, yet you accuse Bear only of being the one looking for a fight.
Bear was the one who actually walked away from the argument.
What in the actual house did he smash up too,he smashed a mirror outside the house and had he been treated differently,there may have been no diary room incident either.

That is not distortion that is all fact actually although you will not see it that way at all simply because you do not like him.
I prefer to be fair and not distort facts to suit any likes or dislikes I may have.

[hot2go]

Originally Posted by -Sue-

Saying 'Bear hasn't done anything wrong' is like saying fish do not swim in water!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bear has done a lot of things wrong but that's CBB...Tiffay, Frankie Cacozza, Frenchie, Denise Welch, James Jordan are some examples....but Bear hasn't done the things wrong he's being accused of....he hasn't behaved as badly as Heavy D, Aubrey and in some people's opinion Biggins...he hasn't threatened anyone or turned aggressive with anyone...both times he's lost his cool he was alone ..and he hasn't spit in someone's food and he hasn't labelled people unstable like Siara did about him.
He's no angel and people either want to see that or they don't but IMO BB locked the wrong person in the diary room.

[hot2go]

It's clear that if people cross Bear he doesn't just lay back and take it....he goes for them...Heavy turned on him the night before and in doing so he betrayed him....Renee lied to him and laughed behind his back the night before and in doing so also betrayed him...Bear set out to upset them both the way they upset him...by kissing Chloe he killed two bird with one stone....no threats, no fights, just a kiss...clever IMO....Heavy isn't mature enough to take rejection from Chloe and he isn't mature enough to take responsibility for Bears reaction to his threats the day before. Yes Bear was winding him up, just like Heavy has been winding people up since he arrived. If Heavy chose to react with threats that makes him wrong not Bear.

[Jordan.]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Oh come off it,what he did with the rose was at best annoying but not threatening for goodness sake,.

he put his foot on the side of the bed not on the bed, he shouldn't have but he did not put his foot on the bed.

He did not push himself and get up aggressively towards heavy D either.

He was not smashing the place up, he broke a mirror by throwing an object, not deliberately smashing anything up and he went to the diary room the moment he was called.

Had the room been already in place or had he been told he would be in the diary room a certain amount of time, he may also have not exploded again.

Oh and somehow you know for sure he was only to be in the diary room for 10 minutes while they got the room ready do you, that's odd because no one else does and Bb never said a time frame.
They actually couldn't, they said as soon as was possible, yet you know it was only 10 minutes... really!.
How do you know the expectancy wasn't more like half an hour, an hour or possibly even more.

Then you get at me and tell me I see this in a distorted way, so clearly you think it right for anyone to end up being locked up for not even threatening anyone.
Also if you think his bringing the rose in as a threatening act then sorry you have lost me completely on that one.
A winding up and annoying of someone maybe, threatening, not a chance.

Seeking a reaction from someone is not threatening them either.
Also what on earth was innocent Heavy D doing watching from behind the window, almost pervert like, all that bear and Chloe were up to, yet you accuse Bear only of being the one looking for a fight.
Bear was the one who actually walked away from the argument.
What in the actual house did he smash up too,he smashed a mirror outside the house and had he been treated differently,there may have been no diary room incident either.

That is not distortion that is all fact actually although you will not see it that way at all simply because you do not like him.
I prefer to be fair and not distort facts to suit any likes or dislikes I may have.

I guess there's no reasoning with you then because you think by being the middle ground that makes your opinion the correct one

For the record I dislike both Bear and Heavy D so it's not like I'm massively biased towards one, however from what I saw Bear was the one who was in the wrong. He is winding these people up 24/7 yet you blame the person who finally reaches their breaking point with him. It's very sad.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Garfie

You are right in saying he hadn't physically hurt anyone, but his repeated unpleasant and drunken behaviour was clearly making others feels very uncomfortable and unsafe, and I think that's the point Ammi was trying to make. BB clearly said he had been warned repeatedly for such behaviour.

When someone is very drunk, has a volatile personality and is doing all he can to antagonise and provoke reactions in other, it makes for a very tense and unnerving situation- I wouldn't have wanted to have to be one of the other housemates in those circumstances and I would have been very uncomfortable had he been allowed back into the house or garden. You've looked at this from Bear's side but perhaps the other housemates were experiencing more fear than you've realised?

That has to balanced when considering Bear being locked in the diary room. What you've said yourself indicates that had Bear and Heavy D been placed together again there was every possibility of an escalation in events. Heavy D was calmer and had just wanted to sleep, whereas Bear was very drunk and intent on instigating some sort of conflict. I think this was a pattern BB had recognised, and was referring to when they reminded Bear he had been repeatedly warned. Therefore, keeping Bear separated was a logical conclusion.

Bear needs to learn to accept that actions have consequences and, if you behave inappropriately, then unfortunately those consequences are not likely to be ones you like- such as being locked in the DR whilst they are sorting out alternative accommodation, and ensuring that his calmer mood was going to last (something that is in doubt when people are very drunk and have a volatile personality).

When all's said and done, being expected to just sit, wait and calm down was not really such a big deal. Had his reaction truly been about claustrophobia rather than drunkeness, I am sure he would have raised this as a serious concern the following day, rather than just apologising, making jokes about kissing Chloe and continuing his familiar pattern of behaviour.

For unpleasant drunkenness and unpleasantness,if BB ejected all housemates that did that there would be few housemates left in most series.

It isn't about claustrophobia, it is about fairness and right for me,

No one would get me locked in a room with no one there for not doing anything physically threatening to anyone and if anyone forced me to be locked in a small room against my will, I would react extremely badly and I would have them in Court too.

He is a wind up merchant, they all know that, he is not physically threatening to anyone, so when they respond to winding up, they fuel themselves to receive more of it.

Heavy D only moaned at noise despite others sitting there talking and lights on, once Bear came in however, he made an issue of noise and got at Bear,he is as much a wind up merchant as Bear is probably.
However he was the only one to get into someone elses face in an aggressive manner,himself towards bear.

Having someone separated from others does not have to involve forcing them to be locked in a small diary room however.
No one would ever get away with doing that to me, no way and frankly I doubt anyone would really honestly accept that willingly when they had not threatened anyone directly.

They had security there, one of them could have sat with bear outside as someone else said here, until the room was ready.
No way at all that he needed to be locked up, against his will, actually only the Police should be able to do that to someone who had threatened anyone and in this instance, with the facts in place, I am as near sure as I could be that they would not have done so.
So BB should not have done so either.

Many other and more conciliatory ways they could have handled this, they chose the absolute worst ,most unacceptable and wrong way to in my view.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Jordan.

I guess there's no reasoning with you then because you think by being the middle ground that makes your opinion the correct one

For the record I dislike both Bear and Heavy D so it's not like I'm massively biased towards one, however from what I saw Bear was the one who was in the wrong. He is winding these people up 24/7 yet you blame the person who finally reaches their breaking point with him. It's very sad.

Yeah I am beyond reason,you think that, that is fine then Jordan.

[Tom4784]

He's a repulsive destructive bully and he's done plenty wrong in that house.