[DemolitionRed]

I don't condone anything in the video. I don't condone the women holding that poster in that transgenders face and I certainly don't condone violence but then this crowd was but a small handful of people and isn't reflective of society as a whole, including transgender men and women amongst us.

I've spent a portion of my life in France where, although male and female public toilets have little fem and masculine signs on the door, nobody takes much notice. A woman doesn't bat an eyelid if there's a man using the female loos and vice-versa. In the UK its very different but for me personally, it doesn't bother me.

If a trans woman can't use a female toilet, even though she looks fully female, where is she to go? and if she can't use a female toilet, does that mean female to males trans can't use male toilets?

The rapist in the prison thing is a concern; whatever were they thinking. Perhaps we do need to have transgender facilities in prison. Putting a female to male transgender in a male prison would be foolish and putting a sex offending male in a female prison is just stupid, but in the most part, transgender prison segregation would be for the transgenders safety.

The problem isn't transgender in my opinion. When I worked in the clubbing world in London, we often used to end up at a place called Stunners. When everything was packed away at 5am in the morning, we'd stop off at Alice's cafe (attached to Stunners) in Cable street to get a Bacon sandwich. This place was always buzzing with very dolled up transvestites who dressed up to the nines on a Saturday night but mostly dressed as blokes and did blokey jobs through the week. Many were married and used this promiscuous place as a secret pass time. Whilst I have nothing against a persons kink (providing its consensual and legal), I don't for a minute think 'shehe's' should have the same privileges transgenders have. Transgenderism isn't a kink, its a chosen lifestyle and something we should look at with the seriousness it deserves. The problem is, there are a lot of 'shehe' hobbyists and when we are using public female facilities and a female who looks obviously manish uses them, we don't know if she's a true transgender (I don't regard an operation as proof) or someone who just fancied dressing up as a female today. When I watched that video, a lot of the 'supposed transgender women' looked like men. I think its much more likely the majority were a very vocal bunch of transvestites. From my experience in the bowels of Londons clubbing scene, transvestites can be just as aggressive as the next man because they still have all those male hormones ripping through their veins. Transexuals tend to be quietly spoken and inobtrusive and don't generally like bringing attention to themselves.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

If a trans woman can't use a female toilet, even though she looks fully female, where is she to go? and if she can't use a female toilet, does that mean female to males trans can't use male toilets?

This is not whats being proposed though, and certainly is not what the 'terfs' are fighting against either. Its obvious males, who do absolutely nothing to themselves except declare 'I am a woman', who are fighting for legal access to female areas. And this is whats causing the disconnect

The rapist in the prison thing is a concern; whatever were they thinking. Perhaps we do need to have transgender facilities in prison. Putting a female to male transgender in a male prison would be foolish and putting a sex offending male in a female prison is just stupid, but in the most part, transgender prison segregation would be for the transgenders safety.

Yup. Makes most sense, but transactivists say this is 'othering'. Which in a way it is but still...safety first surely. Having the same issue in sports fairly recently too. Many many men wishing to compete against women as they are apparently 'trans'. Unfair, but allowed in some cases. And then they have the gall to use Semenya as an example of why it should be allowed. Semenya is intersex, not trans. Its different, and should be too.

The problem isn't transgender in my opinion. When I worked in the clubbing world in London, we often used to end up at a place called Stunners. When everything was packed away at 5am in the morning, we'd stop off at Alice's cafe (attached to Stunners) in Cable street to get a Bacon sandwich. This place was always buzzing with very dolled up transvestites who dressed up to the nines on a Saturday night but mostly dressed as blokes and did blokey jobs through the week. Many were married and used this promiscuous place as a secret pass time. Whilst I have nothing against a persons kink (providing its consensual and legal), I don't for a minute think 'shehe's' should have the same privileges transgenders have. Transgenderism isn't a kink, its a chosen lifestyle and something we should look at with the seriousness it deserves. The problem is, there are a lot of 'shehe' hobbyists and when we are using public female facilities and a female who looks obviously manish uses them, we don't know if she's a true transgender (I don't regard an operation as proof) or someone who just fancied dressing up as a female today. When I watched that video, a lot of the 'supposed transgender women' looked like men. I think its much more likely the majority were a very vocal bunch of transvestites. From my experience in the bowels of Londons clubbing scene, transvestites can be just as aggressive as the next man because they still have all those male hormones ripping through their veins. Transexuals tend to be quietly spoken and inobtrusive and don't generally like bringing attention to themselves.

Yes yes yes tbh. Tranvestites are not transgender and should NOT be having access to female areas, it shouldn't even be considered. The 'trans umbrella' now is so ****ing wide that even I am classed as transgender ffs, simply because I don't conform to every female stereotype and don't believe I even HAVE a 'gender identity'. Which in turn makes me a-gender or gender-queer. Which makes me trans. And this is according to stonewalls own definition. Bat****.

Currently you need a diagnosis of sex dysphoria and to have been living as your chosen sex (following stereotypes really...problematic in itself) fir 2 years to legally change sex. Whats being proposed is that this is taken away completely and you can just declare yourself the opposite sex and thus gain protections associated with that sex. Its dangerous for females, and for transsexual women alike. Transwomen (who 'pass) currently use female spaces to avoid males that they are scared of. This new law basically means, the very males they are scared of can just follow them in, by stating that they are also a woman. Anyone challenging this obvious man will be committing a hate crime. It makes a mockery of a serious illness, it does not take into account the reasons for sex segregation to start with..it just has not been thought through at all and there is endless support for it as people do not quite know what they are supporting. Its kind of scary