[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by James

I think life is better now than it was.

Not if your my daughters generation who at 22 was saddled with more debt than most people my age accrue in a lifetime just for higher education.

[MTVN]

It's swings and roundabouts really. Yes we have to pay for university but many more people now have the opportunity to go than when it was free, 50% now go whereas it used to only be 10%. Yes we'll probably have to work longer than our parents but we're also likely to lead longer and healthier lives. Yes lots of people now use foodbanks but go back twenty/thirty years and that option would not even have been there for those that were struggling.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by MTVN

It's swings and roundabouts really. Yes we have to pay for university but many more people now have the opportunity to go than when it was free, 50% now go whereas it used to only be 10%. Yes we'll probably have to work longer than our parents but we're also likely to lead longer and healthier lives. Yes lots of people now use foodbanks but go back twenty/thirty years and that option would not even have been there for those that were struggling.

Who's we, did you pay to go to uni?

It wasn't the dark ages 20-30 yrs ago, people of my generation live as long as is humanly possible too :/

The reason they weren't there is there was no call for them, unless there was some dire emergency! There have always been agencies for those in need but at the scale they are now and affecting so many UK wide? Unprecedented! It's shameful

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Who's we, did you pay to go to uni?

Yes

How old do you think I am

[jet]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Not if your my daughters generation who at 22 was saddled with more debt than most people my age accrue in a lifetime just for higher education.

Well, the thinking is if you get the higher education you also get a well paid job at the end of it which is the whole point of paying for that privilege. Then you pay it back gradually when you are employed and can afford to. Sounds fair enough to me. Student loans also include accommodation, food and utility bills - nobody can expect to get all that for free.
Too many students are accepted for and take degrees in subjects which have no specific demand in the workplace/too many after just one job.
These days, uni's accept people they wouldn't have years ago and it's not fair on the students; entry levels should be much higher and fees reduced - imo only the very brightest and those who will be most in demand to fill certain jobs should be accepted.
Not saying your daughter isn't in that category of course!

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by jet

Well, the thinking is if you get the higher education you also get a well paid job at the end of it which is the whole point of paying for that privilege. Then you pay it back gradually when you are employed and can afford to. Sounds fair enough to me. Student loans also include accommodation, food and utility bills - nobody can expect to get all that for free.
Too many students are accepted for and take degrees in subjects which have no specific demand in the workplace/too many after just one job.
These days, uni's accept people they wouldn't have years ago and it's not fair on the students; entry levels should be much higher and fees reduced - imo only the very brightest and those who will be most in demand to fill certain jobs should be accepted.
Not saying your daughter isn't in that category of course!

I think it's how expensive these fees are that's causing the controversy, not everyone can afford to pay such fees which means probably some of the brightest young people in the UK could fail to get a chance at Uni just because they're from an exceptionally poor background, is that right to you?

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

I think it's how expensive these fees are that's causing the controversy, not everyone can afford to pay such fees which means probably some of the brightest young people in the UK could fail to get a chance at Uni just because they're from an exceptionally poor background, is that right to you?

No they won’t. They will simply have to pay back their fees once they get a well paid job like every other uni student.

[jet]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

I think it's how expensive these fees are that's causing the controversy, not everyone can afford to pay such fees which means probably some of the brightest young people in the UK could fail to get a chance at Uni just because they're from an exceptionally poor background, is that right to you?

They only pay back their fees gradually when they get a job, and then only an affordable percentage of their wages. If they don't have a job, they don't pay until they do. That's how it is in N. Ireland anyway. Is it different in the UK?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jet

Well, the thinking is if you get the higher education you also get a well paid job at the end of it which is the whole point of paying for that privilege. Then you pay it back gradually when you are employed and can afford to. Sounds fair enough to me. Student loans also include accommodation, food and utility bills - nobody can expect to get all that for free.
Too many students are accepted for and take degrees in subjects which have no specific demand in the workplace/too many after just one job.
These days, uni's accept people they wouldn't have years ago and it's not fair on the students; entry levels should be much higher and fees reduced - imo only the very brightest and those who will be most in demand to fill certain jobs should be accepted.
Not saying your daughter isn't in that category of course!

Then the thinking is flawed, the lecturers delivering the courses do not get these fees, when tuition was trebled their salary didn't multiply.. Tutors were protesting alongside students in 2010 they knew the changes were only to line the pockets of private interest.

I'm referring specifically to tuition fees. Food and accommodation have always been extra.

All unis have entry criteria, they haven't lowered standards, if it's an AAA course then 3 A grade ( or modern equivalent) A levels are required still. ( my daughter filled this criteria)

I have no issue to be fair with charging for some degrees if I'm honest, it's the vocational such as nursing or engineering, or subjects like maths, English or the sciences that should be free for all.

[user104658]

Is this genuinely a newspaper article about a Tumblr post? Holy **** Someone email the sun and tell them to Google "Zootopia Rule 34 Tumblr". I want to see THAT front page. Haaa.

[Mystic Mock]

There's always going to be struggles, that's life.

But do I think that the past generations that have been running this country have made some things worse for the Millennials? Sadly I do have to say yes. Especially when we look at stuff such as Council Houses being bought up by Landlords all because of that Margaret Thatcher policy that she made when she was in charge.

[James]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/576242...t-rant-tumblr/

When will these youngsters get it through their heads that few people have things handed on a plate. All generations struggle. But this latest fad of blaming previous generations does seem to suggest a refusal by some of the millenial generation to take responsibility for their life choices and instead pass the buck. Are they the generation that have had too much too soon and now expect it all without waiting and saving? Do parents need a rethink?

The comments section made an interesting read.

Another thing is that this is these kinds of opinions exist mainly on social media (and clickbaity articles) - millennials blaming the older generation, and millennials being labeled 'snowflakes'. I don't think that it reflects how people think and behave in the real world. Most people just get on with their lives and try and make the best of whatever is dealt to them.

The writer of the Tumblr post has probably read some clickbait opinion piece on his generation, and reacted with the post.

It's just a rhetorical battle.

[thesheriff443]

Some people are lucky to have an option of higher education, some people go straight to a low paid job struggle their whole and die without enough to pay for their own funeral.

Lif is hard deal with it!.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

Some people are lucky to have an option of higher education, some people go straight to a low paid job struggle their whole and die without enough to pay for their own funeral.

Lif is hard deal with it!.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

Some people are lucky to have an option of higher education, some people go straight to a low paid job struggle their whole and die without enough to pay for their own funeral.

Lif is hard deal with it!.

You see these kinds of posts sound like envy to me at the fact that Millennials have it "easier" on certain things than past generations.

I sense that some people want Millennials to be in loads of debt and struggling to enjoy their day to day lives and hobbies and basically be a slave to the Government on how much money they have to fork out to Uni fees. I know that not many people will agree with me on this but I don't get why some people don't want Millennials to have what the yesteryear generations had in their younger days.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

You see these kinds of posts sound like envy to me at the fact that Millennials have it "easier" on certain things than past generations.

I sense that some people want Millennials to be in loads of debt and struggling to enjoy their day to day lives and hobbies and basically be a slave to the Government on how much money they have to fork out to Uni fees. I know that not many people will agree with me on this but I don't get why some people don't want Millennials to have what the yesteryear generations had in their younger days.

I wondered when someone would try to undermine by throwing in such words as ‘envy’ or ‘jealousy’. It could be that - but it could also be based on pragmatics and the simple fact that people with degrees wil usually earn considerably more than the average wage. Why do you think most go to uni in the first place. It is always about money and lifestyle.

Of course they should pay their debts - they got free education for 18 years - why should they be entitled to more!

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I wondered when someone would try to undermine by throwing in such words as ‘envy’ or ‘jealousy’. It could be that - but it could also be based on pragmatics and the simple fact that people with degrees wil usually earn considerably more than the average wage. Why do you think most go to uni in the first place. It is always about money and lifestyle.

Of course they should pay their debts - they got free education for 18 years - why should they be entitled to more!

I'm not against them paying a fee, it's how steep the fee is that's crossing the line, I'm sure I've read a case where someone paid £1K worth of Uni fees, that's insane considering Education should not be that expensive.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

I'm not against them paying a fee, it's how steep the fee is that's crossing the line, I'm sure I've read a case where someone paid £1K worth of Uni fees, that's insane considering Education should not be that expensive.

I’m all for further education and earning a good salary but I feel that at that point, as people will generally benefit considerably from it, they should expect to pay for the privilidge - and it is a privilidge, as another poster said, not everyone will be in the position to do so. But the fact that some don’t even seem to get that and simply see it as an entitlement speaks volumes to me.

Personally I think education is generally expensive but perhaps; if they don’t already, they could link the cost of specific courses to the average earning potential in their particular areas so some courses are more expensive than others. But basically if people want to be high earners they need to pay for the education that will help provide that in my opinion.

[jet]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

You see these kinds of posts sound like envy to me at the fact that Millennials have it "easier" on certain things than past generations.

I sense that some people want Millennials to be in loads of debt and struggling to enjoy their day to day lives and hobbies and basically be a slave to the Government on how much money they have to fork out to Uni fees. I know that not many people will agree with me on this but I don't get why some people don't want Millennials to have what the yesteryear generations had in their younger days.

Back then there were far fewer numbers accepted for uni, and those that were had to pay for accommodation, utilities etc without the benefit of loans, which meant some just couldn't afford to go at all.