[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by ArchAngel

Yes I'd like to see these stats too.

In an official sense they don't exist Kizzy, the 0.8% was arrived at by an independent source who could only estimate that 0.8% of claims were either fraudulent or wrongly claimed.
This govt. knows that to be the case too but is happy to let the media fuel discord between citizen against citizen.
I am reminded of something a lady of near 80 told me last year, she said she had lived through loads of govts. but this one was the worst and most cruel she had ever come across.
For me it is a dangerous one too,as to its divide and conquor attitude as to the working classes and those who are most vulnerable too,trying to set one against the other

If fraud and wrong claiming of benefit was as high as some of the exaggerrated incredible figures have been stated on here, the vile Sun and Daily Mail would have their whole papers full of them, instead of having to near desperately scratch around for the odd one or two cases of same.

[Crimson Dynamo]

cameron and farage coalition

[MTVN]

No more a collaboration than Labour and the SNP/Plaid/Greens really though

[Kizzy]

I don't get what you mean MTVN sorry.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I don't get what you mean MTVN sorry.

Well you said there will have been a collaboration between the Tories and Ukip for a long time but this doesn't prove that, no more than the comments of the SNP/Plaid/Green prove that Labour have been in a collaboration with those three for a long time

The Conservatives best chance of being back in government remains in renewing the Lib Dem coalition and hoping they both do better than expected with enough seats to form a majority. The better Ukip do the less chance there will be of that happening and I can't see a Tory-Lib Dem-Ukip deal working really

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Well you said there will have been a collaboration between the Tories and Ukip for a long time but this doesn't prove that, no more than the comments of the SNP/Plaid/Green prove that Labour have been in a collaboration with those three for a long time

The Conservatives best chance of being back in government remains in renewing the Lib Dem coalition and hoping they both do better than expected with enough seats to form a majority. The better Ukip do the less chance there will be of that happening and I can't see a Tory-Lib Dem-Ukip deal working really

Jesus, hasnt clegg already screwed the lib dems enough, if he sticks for a second term his party will be completely dead in the water

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Well you said there will have been a collaboration between the Tories and Ukip for a long time but this doesn't prove that, no more than the comments of the SNP/Plaid/Green prove that Labour have been in a collaboration with those three for a long time

The Conservatives best chance of being back in government remains in renewing the Lib Dem coalition and hoping they both do better than expected with enough seats to form a majority. The better Ukip do the less chance there will be of that happening and I can't see a Tory-Lib Dem-Ukip deal working really

It doesn't prove anything no but as UKIP policies on many things as well as their MPs are eerily similar if not a little further right than the conservatives I feel this whole issue has been orchestrated to lead perfectly to this moment...
Over the last year or so the media have thrust Farage and UKIP into our morning paper and evening news at every given opportunity, every faux pas was excused, glossed over or laughed off, he was given accolades he didn't deserve (man of the year).
I find it impossible to believe that this is a coincidence, and I believe right from the get go UKIP was only ever the conservatives MK2.

[the truth]

farage is going to win millions of votes....trust me

[Nedusa]

Originally Posted by the truth

farage is going to win millions of votes....trust me

Amen to that...........

[joeysteele]

I don't think anyone has ever had much doubt that UKIP would do a deal with the Conservatives.

Nigel Farage I think genuinely expected Ed Miliband to also promise a referendum,which would have opened other doors for UKIP with Labour, Ed Miliband however has stayed true to his stance on the EU and doesn't want uncertainty for a number of years as to a referendum,which could affect businesses and investment.

So really, Nigel Farage only has Cameron,who I do also really believe that Farage actually trusts less than Miliband,to get any chance of a referendum.
So of course UKIP would do a deal with the Conservatives,however were Cameron to do a deal with UKIP,then he could find he splits the Conservative party even more.
There are Conservative MPs who want nothing whatsoever to do with UKIP and I feel sure some would not support any arrangement with UKIP and Nigel Farage.

Farage is entitled to his view on Labour and the SNP,by the same token I hope the SNP can by supporting Labour in a hung parliament bring about the exclusion of a Conservative govt; let alone one supported by UKIP.

I still don't think it will arise however,I still see the Lib Dems winning at least 17 seats,I don't see UKIP getting more than 5 really.
The Lib Dems for sure could never support a govt; that had the support too of UKIP, so it's a hard one for Nigel Farage.

Also with the prediction still at this time that Labour and the Conservatives could have around 280 seats each and the SNP something like 47 to 50,then in all fact, neither the Conservatives or Labour in that scenario could govern without the SNP on board in some way.

[Vicky.]

Maybe they should all just go into a coalition. I can see it now...

Cons: Ed I will allow your 90% tax on millionaires (MPs excluded) if you allow me to boil the unemployed and disabled in boiling lager with fag ends in it.
UKIP: Best Add in those foreigners, only way I will agree
SNP: Will make quite handy compost, I'm on board aslong as we can send the goods to Scotland instead of wasting it on these English and Welsh bastards
Greens: As long as the trees are unharmed
Lib Dem: Whatever you all want...I'm just going along with it all for a slight bit of power.

[smudgie]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Maybe they should all just go into a coalition. I can see it now...

Cons: Ed I will allow your 90% tax on millionaires (MPs excluded) if you allow me to boil the unemployed and disabled in boiling lager with fag ends in it.
UKIP: Best Add in those foreigners, only way I will agree
SNP: Will make quite handy compost, I'm on board aslong as we can send the goods to Scotland instead of wasting it on these English and Welsh bastards
Greens: As long as the trees are unharmed
Lib Dem: Whatever you all want...I'm just going along with it all for a slight bit of power.

Yep, I can see it all now.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Maybe they should all just go into a coalition. I can see it now...

Cons: Ed I will allow your 90% tax on millionaires (MPs excluded) if you allow me to boil the unemployed and disabled in boiling lager with fag ends in it.
UKIP: Best Add in those foreigners, only way I will agree
SNP: Will make quite handy compost, I'm on board aslong as we can send the goods to Scotland instead of wasting it on these English and Welsh bastards
Greens: As long as the trees are unharmed
Lib Dem: Whatever you all want...I'm just going along with it all for a slight bit of power.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry

[Kizzy]

that sound scarily doable!

[user104658]

Not sure it's really a surprise. UKIP simply = Tories that were too outwardly racist to be in a mainstream party... no?

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Not sure it's really a surprise. UKIP simply = Tories that were too outwardly racist to be in a mainstream party... no?

farage is not racist

[user104658]

Originally Posted by the truth

farage is not racist

Ok.

[Kizzy]

Who said he was?

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Who said he was?

I just said he isn't

[empire]

do we have to live in a society, that controls are opinion of words, there's one word for that is,mind control programming, people are afraid to say what they think, and we are suppose to be a free country, I mean katie hopkins tweets what she says,and people want the police to put her in a cell, people in this country think the word chink is far worse that the sickest crimes that happen in are country.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by empire

do we have to live in a society, that controls are opinion of words, there's one word for that is,mind control programming, people are afraid to say what they think, and we are suppose to be a free country, I mean katie hopkins tweets what she says,and people want the police to put her in a cell, people in this country think the word chink is far worse that the sickest crimes that happen in are country.

I don't think it's worse than the sickest crimes, I don't think anyone does, that's somewhat ridiculous hyperbole.

I do however think that using words like "chink" is casually racist, or I suppose, more accurately, I think that people who casually use words like "chink" as if it's any normal throwaway term are utter arseholes. Satire / comedy is different and has its place.

I don't believe in censorship so I wouldn't censor them or make it a legal issue, but I do fully support anyone who wants nothing to do with that sort of person, and I certainly don't think they belong anywhere near any sort of political power or influence. They are bigots. Pure and simple. Maybe not the biggest or worst in the world, but bigots nonetheless.

[Crimson Dynamo]

the years of one party winning are over. welcome to euro politics

[joeysteele]

Well that is expected that UKIP will win millions of votes,what quantity of millions is the real issue.

With just 10% of the vote,if the same numbers vote that voted in 2010, he would have something like 3,000,000 votes but no seats.

Even with 20% of the votes and around 6,000,000 votes cast,he would be hard pressed to win 7/8 seats.

The mountain he has to climb is that he needs Labour and the Conservatives way down in the lower 30s and himself on around 24% to be likely of any breakthrough as to just double figures of seats won.

That is the challenge of this electoral 'first past the post system', grossly unfair that it can be most of the time.

[user104658]

Exactly. He could get a few million votes and still have no seats at all, if those votes are spread out across the whole country.

[user104658]

I just noticed that I said "he" and not "they" and several other people have too... Which just sums up UKIP support for me. People are voting for Farage - no doubt a proficient orator - because he blares a convincing trumpet. The majority of the party's potential MPs are oozing pustule covered troglodytes.