[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

So the Catholic v Protestant thing is simply a cover?

No need for the sarcasm Kizzy

The Irish in NI are mainly catholic because Ireland is mainly a Catholic country and the "British" in the Northern Ireland are mainly Protestant because Britain is a mainly protestant country. The catholics in NI are not trying to convert the Protestants or force their religious wills on the Protestants and vice versa so it's not a religious war imo, they were never fighting in the name of religion, it was always a nationality and civil rights issue not a religious one. It's Protestant V's catholics because like I said Irish are more often Catholics and British are more often Protestant

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

No need for the sarcasm Kizzy

The Irish in NI are mainly catholic because Ireland is mainly a Catholic country and the "British" in the Northern Ireland are mainly Protestant because Britain is a mainly protestant country. The catholics in NI are not trying to convert the Protestants or force their religious wills on the Protestants so it's not a religious war imo, they were never fighting in the name of religion, it was always a nationality and civil rights issue not a religious one. It's Protestant V's catholics because like I said Irish are more often Catholics and British are more often Protestant

That's how i saw it aswell.Although i did work with an Irish lad who hated protestants.He'd call them "Dem ****'n steel rods" "Da ****'n prods".

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

No need for the sarcasm Kizzy

The Irish in NI are mainly catholic because Ireland is mainly a Catholic country and the "British" in the Northern Ireland are mainly Protestant because Britain is a mainly protestant country. The catholics in NI are not trying to convert the Protestants or force their religious wills on the Protestants so it's not a religious war imo, they were never fighting in the name of religion, it was always a nationality and civil rights issue not a religious one. It's Protestant V's catholics because like I said Irish are more often Catholics and British are more often Protestant

I wasn't being sarcastic, England wasn't mainly a Protestant country until the reformation, which was a very religious thing.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

So the Catholic v Protestant thing is simply a cover?

The issue spills over into Scotland quite a bit and I would say, certainly here at least, that it is 90% "Tribal" and has nothing to do with the actual religion. It centers heavily around Rangers/Celtic, if anything. If you asked anyone "involved" in the ... bickering ... then they would certainly say it's about Catholics and Protestants (although they would use less polite terms) but if you dig a little deeper, most of them don't follow anything religious at all. I'd say it's often more simple than being about ANY religious or political ideology of any kind... it's simply "two sides" who have been at each other's throats for centuries and pass the inherited mutual prejudice along family lines. It's not "about" anything. They hate each other 'cos they hate each other.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The issue spills over into Scotland quite a bit and I would say, certainly here at least, that it is 90% "Tribal" and has nothing to do with the actual religion. It centers heavily around Rangers/Celtic, if anything. If you asked anyone "involved" in the ... bickering ... then they would certainly say it's about Catholics and Protestants (although they would use less polite terms) but if you dig a little deeper, most of them don't follow anything religious at all. I'd say it's often more simple than being about ANY religious or political ideology of any kind... it's simply "two sides" who have been at each other's throats for centuries and pass the inherited mutual prejudice along family lines. It's not "about" anything. They hate each other 'cos they hate each other.

I don't think you can say its "not about anything" many families will have had people killed by both sides during the troubles, and going back further by the the black and tans, and going back further by the English letting people literally die during the famine.. yes for some people it might be about nothing but only if they have no family history. It is time to put it aside, and move forward that said though some people are still very angry about what happened during the troubles as evidenced by the Martin McGuinness thread and are not ready to put it aside and it is easy for me to say because I didn't lose anyone in the troubles, my Grand Uncle was killed by the black and tans and is remembered on a monument in my home town and I still remember my grandmother his sister telling me stories about it. I expect by the time the generations who were involved in the troubles die out and as long as there is no repeat, then in two generations time people might be ready to move on?

[jet]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

The issue spills over into Scotland quite a bit and I would say, certainly here at least, that it is 90% "Tribal" and has nothing to do with the actual religion. It centers heavily around Rangers/Celtic, if anything. If you asked anyone "involved" in the ... bickering ... then they would certainly say it's about Catholics and Protestants (although they would use less polite terms) but if you dig a little deeper, most of them don't follow anything religious at all. I'd say it's often more simple than being about ANY religious or political ideology of any kind... it's simply "two sides" who have been at each other's throats for centuries and pass the inherited mutual prejudice along family lines. It's not "about" anything. They hate each other 'cos they hate each other.

That's close to it TS. I was born in and have lived most of my life in N Ireland, in and around Belfast (I'm living in Dublin at the moment) and those 'sides' are a traditional thing. It just 'is'. When I was growing up most of us didn't know 'why'. We Catholics had some idea, we were taught a little Irish history in school but the Protestants had no idea, they only learned about British history. However, both sides got along just fine. Catholics would take their kids along to the see the Orangemen Parade on the 12th of July, it was a great day out. The troubles changed all that.
It was the 'hardliners' on both sides who created the Troubles. Civil rights? As a Catholic I never felt hard done by. I had the same civil rights as the Prods did. It was more of a social problem back then. Many Catholics standard of living wasn't as good as Protestants, but truth be told, that was because many had big families, many with more than 8 children, some with as many as 15 (there were 4 of us) while the Protestants usually had no more than 2 or 3, so they were stretched.
The size of Catholic families caused problems right across the board; in education, in housing, in employment etc. There were separate schools for each religion (many Catholics and Protestants lived in separate areas) in some cases employers hired according to religion too. There just weren't council houses big enough or enough jobs to go around. This created some poverty in certain areas in the bigger cities although there was always 'social security' for those in dire need. No - one was ever in any danger of starving, far from it in fact. Everyone, regardless of religion got free milk and free vitamins for every child up to 5 years old back then.
Then there is the United Ireland question. Again, it is the hardliners who caused the trouble here. The UK subsidise N. Ireland to the tune of 2 billion every year. The standard of living here is very good...so the devil you know and all that. The Republican government doesn't want us, and they could ill afford us. If they had us, their residents would pay for us with much higher taxes.The British don't really want us either. We're pesky.
In my experience, the average Catholic doesn't really want a U Ireland, they have it too good with all the free health care and dental care and free prescriptions and social security benefits. The average Protestant obviously doesn't want it but aren't that fond of the British and don't call themselves British. Most of them identify as Northern Irish. In an ideal world, with a great economy of our own, I'd say both sides would vote to be an independent country...no UK, no Republic.
....and the average Catholics and Protestants really don't hate each other. Even during the troubles, most people from both sides managed to keep long standing friendships intact and were disgusted with the violence.
It was the hardliners and those who they brainwashed/recruited that caused the mayhem and destruction.
And I'm proud to say that it has been noted many times over that N.Ireland is one of the friendliest ever places in Europe to visit. And it's beautiful too. The average Catholic and Protestant are still getting along just fine. Come and see for yourself.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Integration? Weren't we discussing Ireland on another thread?...Great example of Christian integration there. :/

Hilarious as we were just saying how all religions integrate with one another.


Oh wait, nobody did.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Hilarious as we were just saying how all religions integrate with one another.


Oh wait, nobody did.

I felt the tone was Christians integrate better than other religions, I don't believe they do. I was highlighting this, hope this explains my view to your satisfaction.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I felt the tone was Christians integrate better than other religions, I don't believe they do. I was highlighting this, hope this explains my view to your satisfaction.

Who suggested that though?

Nobody did.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Who suggested that though?

Nobody did.

I didn't say anybody suggested it, I said THE TONE suggested other religions were less willing to integrate.

[Kizzy]

Isn't chicken curry our national dish?

[Denver]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Isn't chicken curry our national dish?

I dont think we actually have one

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Adam.

I dont think we actually have one

True, as England has no culture.

Scotland has Haggis, Ireland has potatoes, England has... Doner Kebabs?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

True, as England has no culture.

Scotland has Haggis, Ireland has potatoes, England has... Doner Kebabs?

Potatoes and Guinness

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Potatoes and Guinness

I love that in Scotland, no one actually LIKES Guinness, but on St Patricks day everyone just ... drinks it anyway and suffers. Out of sheer respect. "I am not enjoying this AT ALL but it's St Paddys so..."

[DemolitionRed]

Jet... Thanks. I really enjoyed your insightful post.

[jet]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

Jet... Thanks. I really enjoyed your insightful post.

Thank you.

So much nonsense is written about N.Ireland. Catholics and Protestants here are always aware of our 'differences' historically, but in reality the majority got/get along and never wanted the Troubles thrust upon us...and there were the terrorist organisations who lined their pockets and added to the citizens misery with protection rackets and drug dealing on top of all the bombings and shootings....

[Northern Monkey]

Our national dish is Chicken Tikka McFlurry with mushy peas

[Northern Monkey]

And Yorkshire puddings

[Marsh.]

Our national dish is bangers and mash.

[Marsh.]

Or the English breakfast idk.

[Denver]

We have so many but non that is top

[Denver]

Although maybe the Sunday roast

[Withano]

TS was right all along, its a kebab.

[Denver]

A kebab is Turkish/Greek/Bulgarian/Pakistani so it isnt