[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Jules2

The body dies we can all agree with that but the true essence of "us" goes on to other experiences. Karma and rebirth were taken out of the bible by those who thought they knew better. Domination was there aim, thus man hasnt always been taught these things in the Western world. If we think of it though, why should some suffer and others do not, why do the young die young? There has to be a reason.

For many, experiences of unknown quantity and orignation can confirm that yes a part of us is separate from the mortal body. Spiritual life is continuous but the body is left behind. Scientists have now opened their minds to far greater things.

We have our own truths deep inside but our trials and tribulations do make us hide. Fear often stops an unhappy wanderer, is it or isnt it, is it true nah better to stay and feel so blue.

Just have faith in yourself for within we have an enormous amount of wealth.

[Kyle]

Kirk,

While as this thread shows we have a difference of opinion on certain philosophical aspects of our existence, I fully appreciate the time you have taken to lay out your beliefs to us all.

My last post might have looked like an attack and that is not my intention. I respect your belief and I thank you for sharing it to a group of strangers.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Kyle

Kirk,

While as this thread shows we have a difference of opinion on certain philosophical aspects of our existence, I fully appreciate the time you have taken to lay out your beliefs to us all.

My last post might have looked like an attack and that is not my intention. I respect your belief and I thank you for sharing it to a group of strangers.

Thanks Kyle.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Jules2

The body dies we can all agree with that but the true essence of "us" goes on to other experiences. Karma and rebirth were taken out of the bible by those who thought they knew better. Domination was there aim, thus man hasnt always been taught these things in the Western world. If we think of it though, why should some suffer and others do not, why do the young die young? There has to be a reason.

For many, experiences of unknown quantity and orignation can confirm that yes a part of us is separate from the mortal body. Spiritual life is continuous but the body is left behind. Scientists have now opened their minds to far greater things.

We have our own truths deep inside but our trials and tribulations do make us hide. Fear often stops an unhappy wanderer, is it or isnt it, is it true nah better to stay and feel so blue.

Just have faith in yourself for within we have an enormous amount of wealth.

..great post Jules...I don't know that I believe everything there but I do believe that it's only a body which dies and it's not a body that has made that person who they are in life...that 'spirit' or essence, or whatever it is has to be somewhere, it's too powerful not to be...and that essence is what made that person everything they were in life...

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Jules2

The body dies we can all agree with that but the true essence of "us" goes on to other experiences. Karma and rebirth were taken out of the bible by those who thought they knew better. Domination was there aim, thus man hasnt always been taught these things in the Western world. If we think of it though, why should some suffer and others do not, why do the young die young? There has to be a reason.

For many, experiences of unknown quantity and orignation can confirm that yes a part of us is separate from the mortal body. Spiritual life is continuous but the body is left behind. Scientists have now opened their minds to far greater things.

We have our own truths deep inside but our trials and tribulations do make us hide. Fear often stops an unhappy wanderer, is it or isnt it, is it true nah better to stay and feel so blue.

Just have faith in yourself for within we have an enormous amount of wealth.

You are absolutely right Jules on a lot of these points - especially about the Bible being 'selectively edited' over the years.

[Kizzy]

That's real nice jules

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

reincarnation sounds so much better than the heaven/hell idea like as if you would be left to suffer for all of eternity for 70 years or w/e being a ****

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Summerland#Wicca >>>

[Jules2]

If we could only take our minds back to the very beginning when there wasnt any headings at all. We were possibly all of one mind believing in an energy which surrounded the universe. Then along comes so and so wanting to lead, thinking that he/she knew better, lets go this way. So we have a split, then along comes someone else taking away the togetherness of the beginning of the soul plus the division from the "whole".

The energy is forgotten as it is split into different personalities, each one claiming a part as their "God". What if man's god is an alien?

The universe is vast and tbh I cannot disagree totally with Zecharia Sitchin's theories, to me it gives rise to the acceptance of both evolution and creation. Very interesting.

On another note the works of Max Freedom Long explains the travels of the Huna tribes people who worked with the energies of the earth long before the arrival of the Nazarene, they were working miracles and could not understand why Jesus was so valued.

Jose Silva was a great life teacher, he taught that we do not use the full potential of our brain. I sat in two of his seminars and was greatly impressed with the meditation arts in fulfilling the effect. Now it is through meditation that we can reach and undestand a lot of things which we are querying, we can experience, we can find out our inner feelings and self. We can find our faith and know that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. For me it isnt religion as I do believe in that original energy, it is just life and discovering how to obtain the satisfaction of knowing.....

[InOne]

Not read a good old God debate on here in a while LOL. I live my life under the assumption there is no God and that works for me.

I don't think about the meaning of life to much. Might as well just get on with it.

[arista]

Originally Posted by InOne

Not read a good old God debate on here in a while LOL. I live my life under the assumption there is no God and that works for me.

I don't think about the meaning of life to much. Might as well just get on with it.

Bang On Right

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by InOne

Not read a good old God debate on here in a while LOL. I live my life under the assumption there is no God and that works for me.

I don't think about the meaning of life to much. Might as well just get on with it.

....good times eh, Joe...

[Crimson Dynamo]

20 000 children died today from disease and hunger


I wonder what was the meaning of their lives

Or indeed the 20 000 who will die tomorrow?

Maybe they needed more faith.....?

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

20 000 children died today from disease and hunger


I wonder what was the meaning of their lives

Or indeed the 20 000 who will die tomorrow?

Maybe they needed more faith.....?

I sense you're trying to make a point here but have struggled to do so.

Would you like to try again..... ?

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

I sense you're trying to make a point here but have struggled to do so.

Would you like to try again..... ?

I have every faith in your ability to dicipher my meaning brother Morsh

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

I have every faith in your ability to dicipher my meaning brother Morsh

20,000 children dying is evidence that there is no such thing as a God?

Ok, whatever you say.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

20,000 children dying is evidence that there is no such thing as a God?

Ok, whatever you say.

What baffles me is; that whenever there's a tragedy in life, some people seize upon it to either blame God, or to proffer it as evidence that there is no God.

They're not really knocking men of faith by doing so, although that's the intention. because anyone who believes in a God also accepts there's a Devil (for want of a better word). All I say is why blame God? Why not blame the Devil.

In fact, as these 'men of science' only believe in the Laws of Nature, why aren't they all cursing and shaking fists at Mother Nature?

[Jules2]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

20 000 children died today from disease and hunger


I wonder what was the meaning of their lives

Or indeed the 20 000 who will die tomorrow?

Maybe they needed more faith.....?

No LT this is where the theory of karma and reincarnation comes into play, if it is the spirit we are trying to build upon, then it may have been their choice to be in such a position. It is a hard thing to accept as it brings into play the old saying of "I am alright Jack". Mind you having said that I guess that many of us have had their trials and tribulations, it is just having the faith to know that we will come out of it one way or another. The acceptance of eternal spiritual life is the ultimate reward.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Jules2

No LT this is where the theory of karma and reincarnation comes into play, if it is the spirit we are trying to build upon, then it may have been their choice to be in such a position. It is a hard thing to accept as it brings into play the old saying of "I am alright Jack". Mind you having said that I guess that many of us have had their trials and tribulations, it is just having the faith to know that we will come out of it one way or another. The acceptance of eternal spiritual life is the ultimate reward.

I have no idea what you are going on about

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Jules2

not sure if anyone is serious or not here now, I was quite enjoying the difference of opinions but it is a lot to go into tbh. My explanation is only one amongst many but it may explain why some suffer and others do not. I tend to look upon the spiritual side as the true essence of life.

What do you mean by spiritual

?

[Jules2]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

What do you mean by spiritual

?

I believe that we are all spiritual beings held down on this planet by a vehicle which we term our body. We are basically free. If we can sit outside of all the troubles and strife we can be of assistance in the healing of the planet and each other. If we allow ourselves to go into the trouble then we are held down by the negativity of all things. It is a hard thing to do though tbh as the overall suffering is great.

There is a theory that it is the planet itself which we are meant to uplift but we have to get rid of all the dross which is holding it down and not allowing it to take its rightful place in the universe.

Once again I am only really generalising as we do not really know. We only know how we feel inside.

[kirklancaster]

Originally Posted by Jules2

not sure if anyone is serious or not here now, I was quite enjoying the difference of opinions but it is a lot to go into tbh. My explanation is only one amongst many but it may explain why some suffer and others do not. I tend to look upon the spiritual side as the true essence of life.

I'm always serious on serious subjects Jules, and I've enjoyed reading your posts. I am aware of Astral Travelling, Reincarnation and other elements you have touched on, am interested in them, and urge you to keep posting.

I've learnt new things on here from other forum members and have followed them up, then researched even more. It's even changed my mind about some things - not my faith - but subjects such as poor little Maddie Mcann's disappearance.

Keep posting Jules.

[Jules2]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

I'm always serious on serious subjects Jules, and I've enjoyed reading your posts. I am aware of Astral Travelling, Reincarnation and other elements you have touched on, am interested in them, and urge you to keep posting.

I've learnt new things on here from other forum members and have followed them up, then researched even more. It's even changed my mind about some things - not my faith - but subjects such as poor little Maddie Mcann's disappearance.

Keep posting Jules.

Aw thanks Kirk, I love a serious but lighthearted debate. I say lighthearted because we all have our own views and it is to easy to offend another.

With the Astral Travelling it is possible to go back into the past, indeed I had one beautiful experience where I came back with the possible understanding that the past, present and future are all one, we are just existing on a dimensional field.

With my own views I tend to give a little and take in the response as they can be very controversial and I think that a lot of people are afraid to say exactly how they are feeling for fear of being ridiculed.

[rubymoo]

Originally Posted by Jules2

not sure if anyone is serious or not here now, I was quite enjoying the difference of opinions but it is a lot to go into tbh. My explanation is only one amongst many but it may explain why some suffer and others do not. I tend to look upon the spiritual side as the true essence of life.

I've been serious in my posts Jules, and i think we may think along the same lines i believe there is an answer to all the suffering and it is indeed about humanity and spiritual growth, i know why my life has been, and is the way it is because of my past life, i was walking my dogs and was asking the universe "why is my life like this?" (i'd been asking that question a lot!) and i then received what i can only describe as an instant download, i was having a conversation with my spirit family and i knew how i'd been in a past life, so i wanted to experience my selfish past in this life, and do you know what....it made sense, i understand why my life is like this and the revelation helped me to love my dad unconditionally (my dad can only be described as a b*****d) but that doesn't matter, because i understand it was for spiritual growth, i know some posters are going to think this is a load of s**t, but i know the truth......my truth.

[Jules2]

Originally Posted by rubymoo

I've been serious in my posts Jules, and i think we may think along the same lines i believe there is an answer to all the suffering and it is indeed about humanity and spiritual growth, i know why my life has been, and is the way it is because of my past life, i was walking my dogs and was asking the universe "why is my life like this?" (i'd been asking that question a lot!) and i then received what i can only describe as an instant download, i was having a conversation with my spirit family and i knew how i'd been in a past life, so i wanted to experience my selfish past in this life, and do you know what....it made sense, i understand why my life is like this and the revelation helped me to love my dad unconditionally (my dad can only be described as a b*****d) but that doesn't matter, because i understand it was for spiritual growth, i know some posters are going to think this is a load of s**t, but i know the truth......my truth.

Ah Ruby I know you are serious, I said as much to two of your posts. We are on the same wavelength, this is the beauty of debate, we learn from one another as Kirk said.

I used to be well into meditation, at the moment I am a bit grounded because of family illnesses. I used to go pretty deep and followed Jose Silvas theories of levelling up the brain. One time I came back with an answer, I had asked to be taken to the centre of Truth I was given:-

T. R. U. T. H. Now as we can see the centre is U, you are the truth, we are all our own truths. Logical eh!! It made me understand that we have the answers within, we only have to seek to find and to our own selves be kind.

Another one is Church, the centre is U R we have our own answers. We can listen to others but we still have to work it out for ourselves as you have done. Take care love.