[Grimnir]

it just said on news that 64 civilians dead

then next headline said osborne: casualty figures should be met with skepticism

so we are supposed to assume dropping BOMBS on people's heads is not gonna create that many innocent civilian casualties but when we are told innocent people die at hands of army, thats different

ok george whatever you say

[MTVN]

The Arab League's secretary general, Amr Moussa, has announced an emergency meeting of the grouping, saying that the current situation isn't what Arabs had envisaged. "What is happening in Libya differs from the aim of imposing a no-fly zone, and what we want is the protection of civilians and not the bombardment of more civilians," he said.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by Grimnir

it just said on news that 64 civilians dead

then next headline said osborne: casualty figures should be met with skepticism

so we are supposed to assume dropping BOMBS on people's heads is not gonna create that many innocent civilian casualties but when we are told innocent people die at hands of army, thats different

ok george whatever you say

Its a big IF though isnt it.

If there have been any civilian casualties, its a great shame however, if the targets were his air defence assets, it is possible that civilians were hit. As Libya does have fixed missile sites located within civilian areas.

If the arab league and the west want to overfly the country in order to set up a no fly zone around the rebel held terroritory, then they will destroy Libyan air defence assets in order not to lose their own aircraft to Libyan air defences.

As for a couple of your previous posts. The US has carried out raids in the past on Libya. The Arab League and the West are trying to protect the innocent civilians located in that rebel held territory, primarily because Gaddafi stated the intent to raze towns and and cities to the ground to rout out the rebels. (he uses the word terrorists to describe them)

[arista]

Yes some public may be killed if they are near to targets
that is normal.

[Ithinkiloveyoutoo]

Gadaffi declares threats to Mediterenean.....

**** sake why can't this man just step the **** down!!! And are all those weapons france, uk and us going to use, have been using actually going to get gadaffi or what....only civilians and other will suffer...

[Parmy]

This whole thing pisses me off.

I wonder how Britain itself would deal with an uprising by it's citizens ?

Or America in the 60's with it's anti war student protests! How many died at the hands of it's army/police force during that? What would have happened if the students kept up the protest?

Let the arab council sort it all out, it has nothing to do with us.

[arista]

[Omah]

#
2249: An administrative building inside Col Gaddafi's compound at Bab al-Aziziya in Tripoli has been "completely destroyed" by a missile, an AFP journalist reports.

[Omah]

Originally Posted by parmnion

This whole thing pisses me off.

I wonder how Britain itself would deal with an uprising by it's citizens ?

Or America in the 60's with it's anti war student protests! How many died at the hands of it's army/police force during that? What would have happened if the students kept up the protest?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings

The Kent State shootings—also known as the May 4 massacre or Kent State massacre—occurred at Kent State University in the city of Kent, Ohio, and involved the shooting of unarmed college students by members of the Ohio National Guard on Monday, May 4, 1970. The guardsmen fired 67 rounds over a period of 13 seconds, killing four students and wounding nine others, one of whom suffered permanent paralysis.

Some of the students who were shot had been protesting against the American invasion of Cambodia, which President Richard Nixon announced in a television address on April 30. Other students who were shot had been walking nearby or observing the protest from a distance.

Mary Ann Vecchio, a 14-year-old runaway, kneeling in anguish over the body of Jeffrey Miller minutes after he was shot dead by the Ohio National Guard

There was a significant national response to the shootings: hundreds of universities, colleges, and high schools closed throughout the United States due to a student strike of four million students, and the event further affected the public opinion—at an already socially contentious time—over the role of the United States in the Vietnam War.

[Omah]

#
0005: The White House has dismissed the latest ceasefire announcement by the Libyan government. A spokesman said the ceasefire declaration had immediately been violated. The UK said Col Gaddafi would be judged by his actions, not his words.

[BB_Eye]

Originally Posted by Omah

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yvonne_Fletcher



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign...kerbie_bombing



Of course, there's lots more Libtan state-sponsored terrorism and aggreaaion :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Libya

And yet it took until now for us to intervene in Libya. How things change when the prospect of a Western-friendly military coup looms.

[Omah]

Originally Posted by BB_Eye

And yet it took until now for us to intervene in Libya. How things change when the prospect of a Western-friendly military coup looms.

"plus ça change, plus c'est la męme chose"

[Omah]

#
0105: A coalition military official has confirmed that Col Gaddafi's Bab al-Aziziya compound in Tripoli was targeted by air strike on Sunday night, CNN reports. The official said the compound was targeted because it contained capabilities to exercise command and control over Libyan forces and the coalition goal is to degrade his military capabilities. Neither Col Gaddafi nor his residence was the intended target, the official added.

Shame .....

[joeysteele]

I can see us getting embroiled in another long drawn out problem here and still be left with another major problem, what if it all kicks off in Saudi Arabia too.
The Arab league as MTVN has pointed out is now qestioning the actions of the coalition forces, Russia and China are condemning the action.

I can see the UK despite its good intentins on this issue becoming more and more sidelined and isolated for getting involved here at all.

We are not the Worlds police,we have problems and commitments of our own, its time we said NO to these involvements and I believed Cameron and particularly the Lib Dems said that same thing at the election.
Clearly it seems, its getting harder to be able to believe or trust ''anything'' politicians say.

We should not be there at all.

[arista]

"We should not be there at all. "


We are not there
we are all in the Sky.

[arista]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

I can see us getting embroiled in another long drawn out problem here and still be left with another major problem, what if it all kicks off in Saudi Arabia too.
The Arab league as MTVN has pointed out is now qestioning the actions of the coalition forces, Russia and China are condemning the action.

I can see the UK despite its good intentins on this issue becoming more and more sidelined and isolated for getting involved here at all.

We are not the Worlds police,we have problems and commitments of our own, its time we said NO to these involvements and I believed Cameron and particularly the Lib Dems said that same thing at the election.
Clearly it seems, its getting harder to be able to believe or trust ''anything'' politicians say.

We should not be there at all.

Take a look at Parliament Live
Even Ed Miliband is backing this Attack.
So all 3 Conservative-Lib Dem and Labour
are United on this.


This is not World Police
it is a Air Attack only.
And if Gadiffi leaves it is over.
Of course they have said they will never leave Alive



In Yemen
that leader has asked the Saudi's
to take over.

So if Saudi Arabia is dealing with these other nations.
The Nato Group of USA, UK , France , Canada
and the Arab group (Qatar & United Arab Emirates)
are dealing with Libya.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by arista

Take a look at Parliament Live
Even Ed Miliband is backing this Attack.
So all 3 Conservative-Lib Dem and Labour
are United on this.


This is not World Police
it is a Air Attack only.
And if Gadiffi leaves it is over.
Of course they have said they will never leave Alive



In Yemen
that leader has asked the Saudi's
to take over.

So if Saudi Arabia is dealing with these other nations.
The Nato Group of USA, UK , France , Canada
and the Arab group (Qatar & United Arab Emirates)
are dealing with Libya.

I personally do not believe we should be there,on land, sea or air at all, it is an internal revolution and none of our business.

I dare bet that most of the UK is against us being there in any form at all also.

With full and due repsect to you as to your opinion,the one thing I have to say is that if the politicians are in favour of the action then that's hardly an endorsement for it since politicians get so much totally wrong anyway.

What would our response be, if people in the UK were demonstrating, sometimes violently against out government to throw it out and our govt used the police and forces to deal with them with a free hand,but then a country like Saudi or Libya came with air strikes on us?

That I am sure would be seen as an act of war against the UK and as far as I am concerned, what we are doing there is little different.I am very naive as to politics but I think we should keep our noses out of other Countries business and stop thinking we are the Worlds police,although its something we do very selectively ignoring great suffering elsewhere from regimes such as in Burma and Zimbabwe.

[joeysteele]

Also the Military leaders are stressing this is NOT a get Gaddaffi campaign so what is the real reasons and truth behind it, I know, Oil!!

[Grimnir]

Why did UK and US not intervene during Rwanda and Sudan civil wars? Hundreds of thousands of people died and UK and US did nothing.
Rwanda and Sudan were of no interest to them, no matter how many people died.

[arista]

"Zimbabwe"


Thats a Easy one
the other African nations do not want the UK going in.

[arista]

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by arista

"Zimbabwe"


Thats a Easy one
the other African nations do not want the UK going in.

Well,yes,I cannot dispute that, you are totally correct,I agree that it would be difficult to go in with no other African approval at least.

I really respect your view arista, you clearly know your stuff. The Foreign Secretary William Hague has made powerful comments on this issue as have many politicians namely Rory Stewart for Penrith and the Borders,he of course has immense knowledge of Afghanistan.

I just wish we were not involved,whether that is a right or wrong view only time will tell,I just hope this action doesn't backfire on the UK.

[Liberty4eva]

I get kind of pissed off when Obama feels he needs to get the UN's approval and ignore the US Congress. Constitutionally (not that people in Washington care anymore) a president has to get Congressional approval before launching a war. And what we are doing are acts of war. Ultimately, the US is going to get the bulk of the responsibility so if we're going to do it, why should Russia or France get a say?

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva

I get kind of pissed off when Obama feels he needs to get the UN's approval and ignore the US Congress. Constitutionally (not that people in Washington care anymore) a president has to get Congressional approval before launching a war. And what we are doing are acts of war. Ultimately, the US is going to get the bulk of the responsibility so if we're going to do it, why should Russia or France get a say?

Umm.. because they're in the UN? And that's who is taking the responsibility for this action. You're not another American who thinks the world revolves solely around you are you?

I see only 13 MP's voted against the war we're waging, anyone know who they were, cant seem to find it anywhere?

[Ithinkiloveyoutoo]

Gaddafis son dead. That's it...it's on now. Gaddafi will alert what ever terrorists he has here, in us and france to do some damage.

wasn't he responsible for the lockerbie or something?