[Niall]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

18 months is a ****ing joke though

And on release she should be sterilised to stop this happening to another innocent child. Unfortunately that would be against the womans human rights though...noone cares about the human rights of kids it seems.

Thats far too extreme Vicky.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Niall

Thats far too extreme Vicky.

I dont see how it is tbh

She will come out of prison (hopefully the children she already has have been took into care or something) and can just have more kids to abuse.

[Samuel.]

Originally Posted by Niall

Thats far too extreme Vicky.

Why though?

You would trust her with another baby?

[Niall]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I dont see how it is tbh

She will come out of prison (hopefully the children she already has have been took into care or something) and can just have more kids to abuse.

Because if you start sterilising people like that, then its just the start of slippery slope. Infringing human rights like that should never be considered.

Keep her in prison for life maybe, but to sterilise someone? That's something the Nazis did!

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Samuel.

Why though?

You would trust her with another baby?

This is it. Its too extreme to stop her having any more kids.

But its fine to take the chance of her doing this to another child.

I said the same about Baby Ps parents too. Some people simply dont deserve to have children. if thats affecting their 'human rights' so be it, the child has the right not to be abused.

[Niall]

Originally Posted by Samuel.

Why though?

You would trust her with another baby?

I know why in my head but I just find it really hard to put it into words.

I wouldn't trust her with another baby but forcibly altering someone else's body without their consent just crosses a line for me. I could never agree with anything like that no matter the magnitude of a person's crime.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

This is it. Its too extreme to stop her having any more kids.

But its fine to take the chance of her doing this to another child.

I said the same about Baby Ps parents too. Some people simply dont deserve to have children. if thats affecting their 'human rights' so be it, the child has the right not to be abused.

Exactly.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Niall

Because if you start sterilising people like that, then its just the start of slippery slope. Infringing human rights like that should never be considered.

Keep her in prison for life maybe, but to sterilise someone? That's something the Nazis did!

Do you not consider the children to have any rights then?

I would consider a baby knowingly being born into violence like that an infringement of the childs human rights.

[Niall]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Do you not consider the children to have any rights then?

I didn't say that. Of course the child has rights, but I fail to see what you're trying to say. That every child who is wronged by an adult has a right to have them sterilised?

[MTVN]

I agree with Niall, I don't think we should ever give someone the power to decide who's fit to be a parent and who isn't, and forcibly sterilise the latter, that's never ended well historically and the sort of power that is very open to abuse

[daniel-lewis-1985]

Originally Posted by Niall

I didn't say that. Of course the child has rights, but I fail to see what you're trying to say. That every child who is wronged by an adult has a right to have them sterilised?

No just in extreme curcumstances such as this.

[Niall]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Do you not consider the children to have any rights then?

I would consider a baby knowingly being born into violence like that an infringement of the childs human rights.

Didn't see this edit.

But yeah I suppose thats true, but just because the child's human rights are infringed doesn't mean the adult's rights should be voided. Criminals are humans too and they deserve to be treated with a decent amount of respect, no matter how heinous their crimes.

[joeysteele]

I go with Vicky on this one, this woman shouldn't be anywhere near children, some people crave having children and cannot but they would give total devotion and love to them if they had any.
This woman will I am sure in prison once it is known what she is in for,get some really rough treatment,it's sad to think there are better morals from some of the worst criminals behind bars than there are from some parents and adults with responsibility towards babies and children.

I agree with Vicky, it's a pity the law doesn't cater for making sure she doesn't have any more of her own. Totally disgusting behaviour and wholly unacceptable treatment of that baby in this incident.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Niall

I didn't say that. Of course the child has rights, but I fail to see what you're trying to say. That every child who is wronged by an adult has a right to have them sterilised?

Depends how you define wronged really. Not an occasional smack..though I dont agree with smacking kids at all...but when its purely for the pleasure of the adult dealing the pain, and they seem to enjoy doing it, and its to extremes such as this, yes.

People get banned from keeping pets for less. And I see a child as a bit more important than a pet.

[Niall]

Originally Posted by MTVN

I agree with Niall, I don't think we should ever give someone the power to decide who's fit to be a parent and who isn't, and forcibly sterilise the latter, that's never ended well historically and the sort of power that is very open to abuse

Exactly.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

im actually surprised the forced sterilization thing hasnt happened yet in certain countries

[Mrluvaluva]

Originally Posted by Niall

Because if you start sterilising people like that, then its just the start of slippery slope. Infringing human rights like that should never be considered.

Keep her in prison for life maybe, but to sterilise someone? That's something the Nazis did!

I agree with Vicky. Parents like that do not deserve to have children, and should not be allowed to have any more of their own. It's not a god given right to have a child, it's a privilege for most people. There are people out there who would dearly love to have a child, while people like this bitch do not appreciate what they have, and think they can do what the hell they want.

Why should she be able to have more children? She could never be trusted again as far as I am concerned. Would you ever trust her with yours?

[Niall]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Depends how you define wronged really. Not an occasional smack..though I dont agree with smacking kids at all...but when its purely for the pleasure of the adult dealing the pain, and they seem to enjoy doing it, and its to extremes such as this, yes.

People get banned from keeping pets for less. And I see a child as a bit more important than a pet.

There's a difference between a ban and a surgical operation though. You could easily ban someone from having kids and monitor them to make sure they're abiding by such restrictions.

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

bc of niall~

what are your views on this

[Mrluvaluva]

Originally Posted by Scott

im actually surprised the forced sterilization thing hasnt happened yet in certain countries

It does happen (not just in cases like this). And not always with their knowledge.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Niall

There's a difference between a ban and a surgical operation though. You could easily ban someone from having kids and monitor them to make sure they're abiding by such restrictions.

The ONLY way to do that would be to lock them up for life.

Which I would also be happy with. Unfortunately we dont do that and give them paltry sentences like 18 months.

[Mrluvaluva]

Originally Posted by MTVN

I agree with Niall, I don't think we should ever give someone the power to decide who's fit to be a parent and who isn't, and forcibly sterilise the latter, that's never ended well historically and the sort of power that is very open to abuse

Would you allow a convicted paedophile the right to have children?

[Niall]

Originally Posted by Scott

im actually surprised the forced sterilization thing hasnt happened yet in certain countries

It has. The Nazis used to sterilise disabled people (and gays I think?) because they thought they thought they were genetic dead ends.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Mrluvaluva

I agree with Vicky. Parents like that do not deserve to have children, and should not be allowed to have any more of their own. It's not a god given right to have a child, it's a privilege for most people. There are people out there who would dearly love to have a child, while people like this bitch do not appreciate what they have, and think they can do what the hell they want.

Why should she be able to have more children? She could never be trusted again as far as I am concerned. Would you ever trust her with yours?

How is it not an inherent right to have children when it's something that happens 100% naturally?

[Vicky.]

I would be all for this only in cases where it can be proven beyond all reasonable doubt that the parent is unfit and the child would suffer because of it.