[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

No child ever deserves to be hit with a leather strap then

Well, seeing as I happened to be talking about myself, and me getting the strap and why I got it : I think I'm mabye, just maybe, in a better position to say whether I felt it was abuse or violent - and I didn't. Indeed, it was very much seen as a badge of honour half the time by the other pupils.

Originally Posted by kizzy

Yes psychological abuse works best anyway...We actually did find you on the doorstep, the hedgehogs left you because you were a very naughty baby.

OMG. You might have something there - I was told that I came from my mummy's tummy.

Do you think that meant she ATE me then vomitted me back up.

[In the Drunk Tank]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Well, seeing as I happened to be talking about myself, and me getting the strap and why I got it : I think I'm mabye, just maybe, in a better position to say whether I felt it was abuse or violent - and I didn't. Indeed, it was very much seen as a badge of honour half the time by the other pupils.

Sounds like it wasn't a very effective punishment then

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Sounds like it wasn't a very effective punishment then

Oh it was effective - when you were told that you had to go to 'one specific teacher'..... everyone else suddenly had this "You're on your own here..." Since there was always ONE teacher who didn't give a little light tap - that's when you KNEW the game was a bogey!

So yes, it WAS effective MTVN.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Well, seeing as I happened to be talking about myself, and me getting the strap and why I got it : I think I'm mabye, just maybe, in a better position to say whether I felt it was abuse or violent - and I didn't. Indeed, it was very much seen as a badge of honour half the time by the other pupils.




OMG. You might have something there - I was told that I came from my mummy's tummy.

Do you think that meant she ATE me then vomitted me back up.

Wow... I never heard of girls getting that punishment, I used to piss my pants if my dad shouted...He never smacked me.
Mum did, but it took a lot to get her so riled ...

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by kizzy

Wow... I never heard of girls getting that punishment, I used to piss my pants if my dad shouted...He never smacked me.
Mum did, but it took a lot to get her so riled ...

Us Scots are tuff. LOL.

Honestly: it was seen as out of the ordinary at all. Certainly when I went to school latterly in England, it didn't happen there - though I have a feeling it had been 'banned' by then.

[Jack_]

Niamh is right. As am I. It isn't an opinion, it's a fact.

Originally Posted by Niamh.

A "gentle" smack? Again........for it to have any kind of effective on the child it has to hurt them.

Exactly. Thread effectively over.

If it doesn't at least hurt then it's not effective, and how anyone could justify hurting anyone, let alone a child is just beyond me. It's not possible to. It's wrong and that's the end of it. And not only is it hurting them, but it's also quite physically threatening and intimidating. Sounds quite an odd concept to me and despite not being a parent myself, and at times finding some screaming children very irritating, never could I imagine myself or even want to lay a finger on a child, or even think about it.

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Anyone who can't handle a 4-6 year old without having to resort to violence against them -and they're still babies in my eyes- needs help themselves imo

Well I don't think this happens often Niamh - but again I agree with you. I think anyone that condones violence, or indeed any kind of physical abuse (unless used in self defence) has something wrong with them and needs help, there's no excuses for it whatsoever and as I've said time and time again, as a society we need to try and get to a stage where it's eradicated, and by effectively promoting such action, that isn't going to happen.

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

I was taught in school with the leather strap being a deterrent, not a cane. I still don't regard that as barbaric. It stopped a lot of the nonsense and misbehaviour.

There's only so much detention can do.

And why doesn't this surprise me?

Niamh's right, I couldn't see you defending someone slapping an elderly or disabled person, so what makes it alright when it's a child? I remember though you condoned the actions of that man who used physical force to throw the much younger and smaller built man off of a train, yet when I asked you if he'd thrown off a woman or an elderly person, or indeed both, you didn't seem so accepting then, or you may have again simply refused to acknowledge the question. That speaks volumes if you ask me.

Either you have quite a strong dislike for children...or, you quite like the idea of a physical force and violence.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by kizzy

OMG is that where they killed some and put them in the walls?....

Originally Posted by 08marsh

Makes me shiver that story. Is that the building they demolished and found hundreds of bodies in the foundations?

No idea.. I just recall it being spoken about when I was a bit older and before I did actually to boarding school. I'm now really curious!

Originally Posted by Jack_

Niamh is right. As am I. It isn't an opinion, it's a fact.



Exactly. Thread effectively over.

If it doesn't at least hurt then it's not effective, and how anyone could justify hurting anyone, let alone a child is just beyond me. It's not possible to. It's wrong and that's the end of it. And not only is it hurting them, but it's also quite physically threatening and intimidating. Sounds quite an odd concept to me and despite not being a parent myself, and at times finding some screaming children very irritating, never could I imagine myself or even want to lay a finger on a child, or even think about it.



Well I don't think this happens often Niamh - but again I agree with you. I think anyone that condones violence, or indeed any kind of physical abuse (unless used in self defence) has something wrong with them and needs help, there's no excuses for it whatsoever and as I've said time and time again, as a society we need to try and get to a stage where it's eradicated, and by effectively promoting such action, that isn't going to happen.



And why doesn't this surprise me?

Niamh's right, I couldn't see you defending someone slapping an elderly or disabled person, so what makes it alright when it's a child? I remember though you condoned the actions of that man who used physical force to throw the much younger and smaller built man off of a train, yet when I asked you if he'd thrown off a woman or an elderly person, or indeed both, you didn't seem so accepting then, or you may have again simply refused to acknowledge the question. That speaks volumes if you ask me.

Either you have quite a strong dislike for children...or, you quite like the idea of a physical force and violence.

I don't particularly care what you recall particularly as this thread is discussing young children, not a drunken, foul mouthed abusive lying fare dodging teenager - and to compare it to such is not a like for like situation at all.

I'd also appreciate if you kept your personal insults about me reigned in. You are here to discuss the subject matter - not to discuss me personally nor is it acceptable for you to personally insult me.

[Pyramid*]

Been looking at the Girvan Nuns Schools...and came across this blog from someone.

School

I remember my first day at St Xaviours in Dalmelington. It was run by nuns who were very strict. I wore a uniform like St Trinians (I cant remember what it was called - Gymslip maybe?). I got the ruler on my hand for dipping my finger in the inkwell on the desk. I was only 4 or 5 at the time. The bus stop to go home was on the main road next to a barn with horses in it. The old bridge was still in use when I went to school. The new bridge was being built, it must be over fifty years old now. How time flies. My dad was a miner and we lived in brand new houses with inside bathroom and toilet. We had our own back and front garden, I think the street was called Barnsheen Ave (16).


Unfortunately, I can't exactly ask my parents which school it was as they are no longer here. I'm really intrigued now though.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by kizzy

Yes psychological abuse works best anyway...We actually did find you on the doorstep, the hedgehogs left you because you were a very naughty baby.

No kind of abuse is good.

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Well, seeing as I happened to be talking about myself, and me getting the strap and why I got it : I think I'm mabye, just maybe, in a better position to say whether I felt it was abuse or violent - and I didn't. Indeed, it was very much seen as a badge of honour half the time by the other pupils.




OMG. You might have something there - I was told that I came from my mummy's tummy.

Do you think that meant she ATE me then vomitted me back up.

Whether you felt you deserved it or not is irrelevant to my opinion that no child ever deserves to be hit with a belt or a strap or a cane.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

No kind of abuse is good.



Whether you felt you deserved it or not is irrelevant to my opinion that no child ever deserves to be hit with a belt or a strap or a cane.

I am in a better place to decide if punishment dished out to me personally, was in my own opinion, was acceptable, to me. I was relaying a personal experience and I think I am in a better position to comment on whether I felt that wrong or right or violent. I based that on my own personal experience. Your opinion is your opinion and I could also say that it is irrelevant to mine. That however would be quite disrespectful.


You do seem very intent on continually telling me I am wrong or my opinion is wrong.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

I am in a better place to decide if punishment dished out to me personally, was in my own opinion, was acceptable, to me. I was relaying a personal experience and I think I am in a better position to comment on whether I felt that wrong or right or violent. I based that on my own personal experience. Your opinion is your opinion and I could also say that it is irrelevant to mine. That however would be quite disrespectful.


You do seem very intent on continually telling me I am wrong or my opinion is wrong.

Again.........If you said hitting disabled people was ok, I would tell you you are wrong, If you said hitting elderly people was ok I would tell you you are wrong and If you say hitting children is ok...........I will tell you you are wrong.

And hitting children with implements such as belts, canes or straps is most certainly wrong, infact I think you would wind up in prison if you did that to a child today.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Again.........If you said hitting disabled people was ok, I would tell you you are wrong, If you said hitting elderly people was ok I would tell you you are wrong and If you say hitting children is ok...........I will tell you you are wrong.

And hitting children with implements such as belts, canes or straps is most certainly wrong, infact I think you would wind up in prison if you did that to a child today.

This thread is not discussing hitting elderly people or disabled people though.

I'm not likely to wind up in any prison since I have said repeatedly on here that anything other than a gentle smack today - is unacceptable: an important point which you seem very deliberately to be ignoring.

MTVN has already clearly stated why he feels there is nothing wrong with it either, as have other. . It seems you have some bone to pick with me - given that you are soley addressing only what I have to say on the matter as far as believing there is nothing wrong with a gentle smack. I see you are not addressing any other poster who has commented with the same views as me - why would that be I wonder?

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

This thread is not discussing hitting elderly people or disabled people though.

I'm not likely to wind up in any prison since I have said repeatedly on here that anything other than a gentle smack today - is unacceptable: an important point which you seem very deliberately to be ignoring.

MTVN has already clearly stated why he feels there is nothing wrong with it either, as have other. . It seems you have some bone to pick with me - given that you are soley addressing only what I have to say on the matter as far as believing there is nothing wrong with a gentle smack. I see you are not addressing any other poster who has commented with the same views as me - why would that be I wonder?

Pyramid, I'm quite sure if you check back along, you'll find that I have addressed other people besides you. Infact, I've replied to : Samuel, Ninastar,08Marsh, lostalex, Arista, Thesheriff, Mr. Luvaluva, Vicky, Bollo, The Mockinator and Kizzy.

I'd also like to point out that it was infact you that originally quoted me, I was simply replying to you so I would appreciate it if you would stop trying to paint such an untrue picture of events.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Right or wrong?

Inspired by chinese woman beating the baby thread. I don't mean beating the kid but smacking.

Personally, I think there are better more effective ways of disciplining kids and hitting children is always wrong. Thoughts?

Originally Posted by Niamh.

My opinion is right on this, I used the example of disabled and elderly people because I don't see the difference in hitting them or children.

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Pyramid, I'm quite sure if you check back along, you'll find that I have addressed other people besides you. Infact, I've replied to : Samuel, Ninastar,08Marsh, lostalex, Arista, Thesheriff, Mr. Luvaluva, Vicky, Bollo, The Mockinator and Kizzy.

I'd also like to point out that it was infact you that originally quoted me, I was simply replying to you so I would appreciate it if you would stop trying to paint such an untrue picture of events.

Let's start at the beginning Niamh, and I'll reply to you stating I am painting such an untrue picture of events.

You created this thread - it would therefore be reasonable that I should reply to you at some point, given that you started the thread - which was indeed an interesting one.

What is more interesting is that you started your opening post and you asked : Right or Wrong? and then asked for peoples thoughts.

People then gave you their thoughts. When anyone gave their own different stance - you didn't want to know their thoughts, other than to tell them they were wrong. In my own case I made it clear the distinction I made in a gentle smack, and specifically, where I felt it was acceptable, and did so as well as did other posters, several times over and over again.

You vehemently refused to accept anyone elses opinion as being 'right' - preferring instead to tell those who didn't share your view,, that they were wrong, and repeatedly (quote above as one of several examples) .

To ask what people think of a subject: to specifically ask Right or Wrong; then not respect their opinion or view when it is given : If you felt there was no other answer other than your own, then why ask the question in the first place if all you were going to do was dismiss anything anyone else had to say on the subject?

I'm not entirely sure why you wanted to discuss what other people thought of the subject of smacking children, when you aren't prepared to accept someone elses point of view without deriding it or them (by saying they needed help etc) - regardless of how much you disagree with it.?

What was the point in you asking ''Right or Wrong'' if then all you intended doing was telling others they were wrong? That's not leaving much room for discussion and imo, defeats the purpose of healthy serious debating.

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

As long as you clean up after yourself - I really don't care what you think.

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Utter nonsense the last part. I don't have kids... I was a child and I was given sometimes more than a light smack - oddly enough: I didn't grow up to be an abuser to children regardless, nor did I grow up thinking hitting babies or toddlers is right, nor did I grow up to believe that a good thumping of a child was correct either.

A person does not have to be a parent to have an opinion you know.

So, you are allowed to dismiss other peoples opinions, but I'm not...........interesting.

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

So..you don't agree with me, is there any particular reason for you labouring your point Niamh?

I'm labouring my point because this is a debate thread..........that's what you do in debate threads.

This is not about old people, nor is it about diabled children. It is about young children who some people may chose to smack as a form of discipline and discussing that.

Again, this is a debate thread........sometimes people draw comparisons in debate threads when they're trying to make a point, please don't tell me what I can and can't draw comparisons with. Thank You.

Your opinion isn't right or wrong - neither is mine. But you appear to be coming across as though you think your way is the only correct way. It's not - it is what you believe, and what some others believe. It's not an opinion I agree on, and I don't happen to be alone in my opinion.

Again........this is a debate......of course I think I'm right as do you.......but you're not.

There really is no point in going round in circles - we disagree for the reasons we both have stated. That's the way it works sometimes.

Stop replying to me then.

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

No your opinion is only your opinion. And it is highly disrespectful to dismiss the opinion of others.

Really? as disrespectful as saying someones opinion is "Utter Nonsense"?

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

This thread is not discussing hitting elderly people or disabled people though.

I'm not likely to wind up in any prison since I have said repeatedly on here that anything other than a gentle smack today - is unacceptable: an important point which you seem very deliberately to be ignoring.

MTVN has already clearly stated why he feels there is nothing wrong with it either, as have other. . It seems you have some bone to pick with me - given that you are soley addressing only what I have to say on the matter as far as believing there is nothing wrong with a gentle smack. I see you are not addressing any other poster who has commented with the same views as me - why would that be I wonder?

I did actually answer that in a previous post, infact I answered that in two previous posts (one directly to you) but I will repost them :

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Well I would assume it's not going to be anyway effective if it doesn't actually hurt the child, and I would never want to physically hurt my children.

Originally Posted by Niamh.

A "gentle" smack? Again........for it to have any kind of effective on the child it has to hurt them
I don't agree with hitting old people or disabled people either, am I right about that? I see no difference with hitting kids, they're all the most vulnerable members of our society.

I only referred to being hit by a strap after you brought it up.

If you don't like the way I am arguing my points in this thread, then don't reply to me Pyramid, please don't try to make out I have some sort of vendetta against you. I have disagreed with many people in this thread yet you're the only one who accused me of this.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

No kind of abuse is good.



Whether you felt you deserved it or not is irrelevant to my opinion that no child ever deserves to be hit with a belt or a strap or a cane.

I was joking in that post niamh...

[ChristmasNeeve]

Originally Posted by kizzy

I was joking in that post niamh...

ok