[the truth]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

"They were failed by a system which ignored the warning signs and put corporate self-interest and cost control ahead of patients and their safety."

They both criticised the cost-cutting and target-chasing culture that had developed at the Mid Staffordshire Trust, which ran the hospital.

From the report..
''But staffing levels were also said to be too low because the trust was trying to slash costs by £10m.''

Truth, what are you expecting?... do you think that you can reduce and remove staff and funding without it affecting patient care?..

Ultimately who is to blame? I know you say the nurses but I disagree, they are spread very thin, disreguarded when highlighting issues, overworked and undervalued.
Of course there will be one or two bad apples that have slipped through but is that not the same in any profession?

very selective the parts you choose to listen to

patients were drinking water out of flower vases to stay alive, patients literally died of thirst in front of the nurses who didnt even keep them alive with water? sorry no one can pass that buck anywhere, its disgusting and these nurses must face prosecution

more money was pumped into the nhs at that time than ever in its history, so to simply blame money is nonsense. this is a question of management yes but also the basic human morality of these nurses.

My ONLY sympathy is for the poor abused neglected manslaughtered dead patients and their friends and family , some of whom are members of this website. sorry for you to try and cleafr than names of all these nurses on here is callous cold and cruel and shameful. please show more respect for people here and everywhere else who have lost thousands of loved ones through nursing neglect. even lord faulkner admitted last night on question time, this was a failure by nurses and politicians and management. all were guilty of these horrors.

25000 people died from blood clots last year that were picked up in hospitals by poor nursing practices. I would also add nurses have way more support too than previous decades, cleaners do the cleaning, cooks bring the food and often drinks, you have auxillary nurses too. they have the biggest union in the contry supporting them too. I have as much sympathy for these nurses as they had for the dead patients dying all around them through sheer neglect , NO SYMPATHY AT ALL.

I couldnt watch people die of thirst around me , could you?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by the truth

very selective the parts you choose to listen to

patients were drinking water out of flower vases to stay alive, patients literally died of thirst in front of the nurses who didnt even keep them alive with water? sorry no one can pass that buck anywhere, its disgusting and these nurses must face prosecution

more money was pumped into the nhs at that time than ever in its history, so to simply blame money is nonsense. this is a question of management yes but also the basic human morality of these nurses.

My ONLY sympathy is for the poor abused neglected manslaughtered dead patients and their friends and family , some of whom are members of this website. sorry for you to try and cleafr than names of all these nurses on here is callous cold and cruel and shameful. please show more respect for people here and everywhere else who have lost thousands of loved ones through nursing neglect. even lord faulkner admitted last night on question time, this was a failure by nurses and politicians and management. all were guilty of these horrors.

25000 people died from blood clots last year that were picked up in hospitals by poor nursing practices. I would also add nurses have way more support too than previous decades, cleaners do the cleaning, cooks bring the food and often drinks, you have auxillary nurses too. they have the biggest union in the contry supporting them too. I have as much sympathy for these nurses as they had for the dead patients dying all around them through sheer neglect , NO SYMPATHY AT ALL.

I couldnt watch people die of thirst around me , could you?

Why did you ask me to read the report and comment on the facts that are screaming out from it about the failings within management structures,will they face any repercussions for the fallout?....will they *******.
I states quite clearly that they were struggling with budget cuts and yet you insist the government were throwing money at the NHS ..
Were you reading the same report I was , doesen't seem like it .
The RCN was criticised for not listening to nurses screaming out for intervention...now they appear to be shouldering the blame for this sorry state, it's like blaming the loss of a war on the poor sods charging out of the trenches into the line of fire!

[bbfan1991]

It is disgusting how these patients were treated and the attitudes of some of the staff and management there leave a lot to be desired on what has been covered, but I hope the necessary changes will be made to prevent things like this from happening again.

It is such a shame that it might dampen some peoples faith in the NHS and IMO some of the hard working and dedicated staff will get dragged down with this bad publicity because if anything it is these people who deserve more recognition for what they do, but the most important thing right now is that the families of former or deceased patients have justice for their loved ones.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by bbfan1991

It is disgusting how these patients were treated and the attitudes of some of the staff and management there leave a lot to be desired on what has been covered, but I hope the necessary changes will be made to prevent things like this from happening again.

It is such a shame that it might dampen some peoples faith in the NHS and IMO some of the hard working and dedicated staff will get dragged down with this bad publicity because if anything it is these people who deserve more recognition for what they do, but the most important thing right now is that the families of former or deceased patients have justice for their loved ones.

I agree with paragraph 1 but not paragraph 2. the ONLy shame is that 1200 innocent people died through neglect, the egos of nurses or staff are irrelevant compared to the horror of the brutal deaths these innocent people suffered from and the lies their families were told. I do agree with your last sentence though, justice must be done, people , management, nurses must be prosecuted. alan johnson should also be dragged over the coals , he was partly responsible and his mealy mouthed drivel on this week , last night was a disgrace

[bbfan1991]

Originally Posted by the truth

I agree with paragraph 1 but not paragraph 2. the ONLy shame is that 1200 innocent people died through neglect, the egos of nurses or staff are irrelevant compared to the horror of the brutal deaths these innocent people suffered from and the lies their families were told. I do agree with your last sentence though, justice must be done, people , management, nurses must be prosecuted. alan johnson should also be dragged over the coals , he was partly responsible and his mealy mouthed drivel on this week , last night was a disgrace

My reference regarding to the NHS staff was not about egos, it is just that I do not think that those who have lost faith in the NHS because of this story can lump ALL staff who work for the organisation in hospitals across the country into one bad category because of the horrific mistakes and events that happened at Stafford Hospital.

I have every sympathy with those were affected by this and hope they get the answers they desparately need.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by bbfan1991

My reference regarding to the NHS staff was not about egos, it is just that I do not think that those who have lost faith in the NHS because of this story can lump ALL staff who work for the organisation in hospitals across the country into one bad category because of the horrific mistakes and events that happened at Stafford Hospital.

I have every sympathy with those were affected by this and hope they get the answers they desparately need.

nobody did lump ALL staff into the same boat across the UK? thats just made up. why is that your biggest concern? the biggest concern should surely be the unnecessary premature deaths of 1200 people and tens of thousands more across our country

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Why did you ask me to read the report and comment on the facts that are screaming out from it about the failings within management structures,will they face any repercussions for the fallout?....will they *******.
I states quite clearly that they were struggling with budget cuts and yet you insist the government were throwing money at the NHS ..
Were you reading the same report I was , doesen't seem like it .
The RCN was criticised for not listening to nurses screaming out for intervention...now they appear to be shouldering the blame for this sorry state, it's like blaming the loss of a war on the poor sods charging out of the trenches into the line of fire!

I guess you ignored the parts were patients died of thirst, because nurses didnt give them drinks of water, or died ecause they werent given their basic medication by nurses, or simply died through being ignored, or the 25000 who died of clots across the uk last year because of nursing incompetence and failure to prevent and to diagnose clots...why do you ignore these life and death issues? do you not care? I ask again, could you ignore patients requests for simple glasses of water as they die of thirst around you?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by the truth

I guess you ignored the parts were patients died of thirst, because nurses didnt give them drinks of water, or died ecause they werent given their basic medication by nurses, or simply died through being ignored, or the 25000 who died of clots across the uk last year because of nursing incompetence and failure to prevent and to diagnose clots...why do you ignore these life and death issues? do you not care? I ask again, could you ignore patients requests for simple glasses of water as they die of thirst around you?

Stop making this so personal, debate the point don't create some bizarre hypothetical.
Once again nurses do not prescribe, nor do they diagnose. We are going round and around here, I have agreed that there will be a few that have been negligable in their care but to denigrate every honest decent hardworking nurse in the UK is wrong.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Stop making this so personal, debate the point don't create some bizarre hypothetical.
Once again nurses do not prescribe, nor do they diagnose. We are going round and around here, I have agreed that there will be a few that have been negligable in their care but to denigrate every honest decent hardworking nurse in the UK is wrong.

wheres the bizarre hypothetical this happened, the proof is there 1200 people died through sheer neglect, many died of thirst, no one denigrated EVERY HONEST DECENT nurse so why did you just make up that hypothetical imagined criticism. Im talking about the nurses who were not honest and decent and allowed innocent people to die of thirst and neglect on a massive scale

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by the truth

wheres the bizarre hypothetical this happened, the proof is there 1200 people died through sheer neglect, many died of thirst, no one denigrated EVERY HONEST DECENT nurse so why did you just make up that hypothetical imagined criticism. Im talking about the nurses who were not honest and decent and allowed innocent people to die of thirst and neglect on a massive scale

I referred to your silly 'would you?' 'could you?'
How could anyone know what it is like to be in that position unless you had experienced it?...
You don't seem to be so quick to suggest that along with some nurses there may also be some managers and more importantly some governmental bodies at fault here too for creating this impossible situation in the first place?...