[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by kirklancaster

The 'Public Outrage' is not generally aimed at ANY help being given to GENUINE refugees - and there are some - just to the never ending thousands of fit, able bodied young men who make up the majority of these 'illegal immigrants opportunity seekers.

Criticising the general public of the UK just because they increasingly do not agree with the 'welcome -one-and-all' mentality is unfair.

The media cannot manipulate actual undoctored live tv footage of the conduct of some of these 'illegals' so it is banal to blame them.

Welcome one and all with no passport .. that's not really how it is though is it? less so now than ever.
The conduct of these 'illegals' who incidentally are also 'people' is understandable given the desperate circumstances.
I really don't feel many in the UK are best placed to empathise with the inhabitants of some parts of the world, we're too coddled here and know nothing of the real threat of survival to imagine having to flee our homeland.

[Northern Monkey]

There are literally millions of people who are suffering in Africa.We can't be a safe haven for them all.We are currently letting gangsters and people smugglers decide who we take in.Which likely include many economic migrants.The number one thing that we need is CONTROL.That is the key word.We currently have no idea who is coming in.We need to stop the swarming and secure our borders and decide ourselves who we let in.

[arista]

Yes a Solid higher fence
they can not get over

[Kizzy]

How about a dome? We could all just live under glass so nobody could ever get in again.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

How about a dome? We could all just live under glass so nobody could ever get in again.

No we do not need that
yet

[arista]

new higher Tougher Fence needed fast

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Welcome one and all with no passport .. that's not really how it is though is it? less so now than ever.
The conduct of these 'illegals' who incidentally are also 'people' is understandable given the desperate circumstances.
I really don't feel many in the UK are best placed to empathise with the inhabitants of some parts of the world, we're too coddled here and know nothing of the real threat of survival to imagine having to flee our homeland.

I agree with all you have said Kizzy.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Welcome one and all with no passport .. that's not really how it is though is it? less so now than ever.
The conduct of these 'illegals' who incidentally are also 'people' is understandable given the desperate circumstances.
I really don't feel many in the UK are best placed to empathise with the inhabitants of some parts of the world, we're too coddled here and know nothing of the real threat of survival to imagine having to flee our homeland.

but the point is they are in France, and probably were in a few safe European countries before they arrived there. There is only one reason, given those circumstances, why they fight to gain illegal entry in to the UK, they think they will get an easy life with benefits paid.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

but the point is they are in France, and probably were in a few safe European countries before they arrived there. There is only one reason, given those circumstances, why they fight to gain illegal entry in to the UK, they think they will get an easy life with benefits paid.

Yes I have heard that said many times, how do we know there aren't 1000s who have stopped off in many other European countries?
Just how can illegal immigrants claim benefits?... or work? There is the flaw in the logic, they can't.

[empire]

britain can't save the world, I believe in putting british people first, if britain did not have welfare, do you think that eighty percent of those people would come here, with the rise of the right wing in europe, the eu made this happen by not giving italy the right too, turn the boats away from there shores, norway deported a large mount of asylum seekers, and denmark is going too do the same, but in britain, they can't deport them, for some silly reasons, the soft touch is not going too make things better, if you let more in, then it won't stop,

[smudgie]

Stop the invasion, electrify the fences and keep them at bay, then let them be processed.
If they have destroyed their papers then no entry allowed. There we go, sorted.

[Kizzy]

Above all they are humans... before 'illegals'

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/v...gle-camp-video

[Mitchell]

Dreading going through it on Friday

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Above all they are humans... before 'illegals'

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/v...gle-camp-video

They are indeed, sadly it is unbelievably thought they should be treated like dangerous animals.

If I were in their place, and how I hope and pray I never would find myself in such a chaotic state.
Were I then to read and hear some of the hard line comments form this so called decent and caring UK citizenship,and/or get access to the rotten and vile prejudiced media of the UK, then the UK would be just about the last place I would even want to try to start to hope for a better life in now.

So intolerant, selfish and cold have great chunks of the UK now become.

[bots]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Yes I have heard that said many times, how do we know there aren't 1000s who have stopped off in many other European countries?
Just how can illegal immigrants claim benefits?... or work? There is the flaw in the logic, they can't.

there are illegal workers all over the country, its naive to think the problem doesn't exist

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

there are illegal workers all over the country, its naive to think the problem doesn't exist

If the govt tightened up on the employers involved that issue would be addressed. I don't know why you suggest I'm naive to this..however who is to blame for this practice, is it those being exploited?

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

If the govt tightened up on the employers involved that issue would be addressed. I don't know why you suggest I'm naive to this..however who is to blame for this practice, is it those being exploited?

No one coming here would refuse likely cash in hand lower pay to get them started when offered by 'bad' employers who are trying to just get cheap labour and use these migrants for that purpose too.

I agree with you totally, however it seems no matter how bad employers and businesses are,they should get supported and be run after by politicians and govts too it seems,no one daring to say anything bad as to employers and businesses.

You couldn't make it up could you Kizzy.
The migrants are to blame,not the 'dubious',(as to a word to use at best), employers.
people who should not be employers or even in business at all since they are actually breaking the law.
Still, just blame the migrants,that is the more fashionable thing to do.

[empire]

poor working familes who are paying high rent and struggling too feed there children, when migrants in lorries, will get free food, free housing, and won't have too work, and thanks too the state, we will end up paying for it, alot of migrants who step foot here, hate are way of life, and they look down on us, and there is alot of truth about that, when british working famlies are having too take food banks so there children won't go hungry, those migrants don't give a damn, about us,

[Nedusa]

Originally Posted by Samuel.

Yes, it is. These people are being talked about as scum. It's far from an ideal situation but it's being fueled by the xenophobia in this country. It's fantastic that they're being looked after in the mean time, and the question that should be asked is why our poorest people are not treated like this, rather than the much popular question of why aren't they being treated like our poorest.

Perhaps it's time for a bit of healthy xenophobia...?

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Nedusa

Perhaps it's time for a bit of healthy xenophobia...?

Sorry but for me, it should never be right to go down that line.

I really do despair for the UK now, I don't think I even recognise it as the Country I believed it was, all its decent values of protecting the weakest and poorest and caring for its sick, while internationally standing up against injustice for those persecuted worldwide.

This all seems to be being thrown away and allowing the blaming of immigrants for all the UKs ills,an agenda I hate and one which,I think, will further reduce the standing of the UK in the World and see more and more of its decent citizens going elsewhere if it continues.

That anyone can believe xenophobia can be right, is even more worrying.
Great Britain,not 'great' for much longer if this is the road where we are going down now.

[MTVN]

To be fair this is not something unique to Britain though, all of Europe is in a mess about the migrant influx and though it won't be reported in our media there is a fairly similar situation on the France-Italy border where migrants have been clashing with police after France sealed the border there. I think it's understandable that people would be a bit disconcerted by pictures of hundreds of people storming fences, hiding in lorries etc. Of course it's also understandable why such people would take such desperate measures to enter the UK. Yes they've passed through several safe countries but it's not like these are all the migrants in the world heading straight for the UK - most other EU countries take a lot more than we do and I don't think it's fair for us to tell Italy, Germany etc. that it's their problem and not ours just because we happen to be located at a more inconvenient place geographically than they do. Then again it's also the case that a lot of these people are not asylum seekers, they are economic migrants and somehow, somewhere along the line they have got a misleading impression that the UK has a lot more to offer them than other European countries. Otherwise I can't believe they would try so relentlessly when, because of the Schengen agreement, they could go almost anywhere they wanted on mainland Europe and try and build a life there instead of risking it trying to enter this country.

[bots]

I think people are missing the point though, illegal immigrants do get work, they do get benefits, and that's why they are here. We can continue to say, oh poor souls, let them in, its not their fault, or we can tighten up on employers, benefit agencies and our borders. These people are attempting to enter the country ILLEGALLY. It shouldn't be allowed.

[Kizzy]

Healthy xenophobia, is that a thing, if we had not offered refuge to many throughout the years how many members from here wouldn't be posting now? 'I'm alright Jack' that's the order of the day.
As Joey said the plight of the oppressed is either being ignored or suppressed, the media focus on the monetary cost to the UK only and the fact Joe bloggs from Kent has been stuck in traffic for 6hrs and his pie and mash will be on the table... No mention of what is causing the immigrants to flee in the first place :/

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

I think people are missing the point though, illegal immigrants do get work, they do get benefits, and that's why they are here. We can continue to say, oh poor souls, let them in, its not their fault, or we can tighten up on employers, benefit agencies and our borders. These people are attempting to enter the country ILLEGALLY. It shouldn't be allowed.

Is it clear what point you're making? You say they do get benefits, the point is to get benefits you must have been processed and have the relevant paperwork and an address.
I appreciate they are not coming her via the correct channels, to simply slap a label of criminal on each and every one is a very blinkered view.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Is it clear what point you're making? You say they do get benefits, the point is to get benefits you must have been processed and have the relevant paperwork and an address.
I appreciate they are not coming her via the correct channels, to simply slap a label of criminal on each and every one is a very blinkered view.

Sadly,this is the view I am finding more and more, I stand disillusioned looking at people I am talking to about this.

You are right as to the benefits,the govt can and should be doing more to address that issue, they have talked about it for years but still it is possible to claim,claim being the word, as you point out to get any benefits you fist have to 'claim' them.

Again, it is the migrants fault that they can claim them and not the systems.
So they become the really bad guys warranting being treated like dangerous animals.
Then the employers,they are the ones making the jobs available, avoiding declaring the due tax and national insurance contributions that should be made when employing someone.
Yet the immigrants taking the jobs are seen as the villains.
Jobs that would not be offered to home citizens since that could be harder to get away with,needing more pay for starters, and so this is a way of very cheap labour for bad employers and bad businesses.

I think the way this is being handles is a disgrace and as Germany has pointed out, they take far more migrants than the UK does.
We are turning into a selfish, whining nation that unless we wake up to how unjust this is, the UK standing in the World will plummet even further, and deservedly so in my view.
I am actually ashamed at this time of my own Country.

Anyway, Now I am off to court today now, to help some sick and disabled people fight for their cruelly and wrongfully removed benefits being taken from them under this shower of a govt.
Injustice is not sadly just with the immigrants worldwide but also against those in the UK too, who are genuinely sick and in great need to.

That however is another issue for elsewhere but just even more shame to add to the UKs standing in the World and how it treats people in dire need.
Whether it be home sickness benefits or fleeing persecution from poverty and danger in other Countries, where these migrants are trying to flee from.