[arista]

http://news.sky.com/story/1647277/ju...8-hour-strikes


What happens after these strikes?

[joeysteele]

Absolutely right to do so, I am behind them all the way.

[Kizzy]

Ditto Joey.

[Beso]

they are getting on my tits.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by parmnion

they are getting on my tits.

that's one way of putting it,from what I understand the contract they have been given had 90% of what they wanted anyway.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

that's one way of putting it,from what I understand the contract they have been given had 90% of what they wanted anyway.

If there's still 10% dictatorship still in there then they have every right to protest.

Seriously how can anyone not take their side on this?

[UserSince2005]

lazy bastards.

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

If there's still 10% dictatorship still in there then they have every right to protest.

Seriously how can anyone not take their side on this?

Well sorry Mocky, they are pretty well looked after and I always thought nursing,caring etc were vocations more than money orientated careers,to put people at risk is imo,NOT very caring in my opinion of course.

[Kizzy]

Junior doctors have a launched a legal challenge to Jeremy Hunt’s decision to impose a new contract, and announced that three fresh strikes will hit the NHS in the spring.

Preparing the ground for a new phase in the bitter conflict between the British Medical Association and the Government, the medical union claimed that ministers had failed to assess whether the contract might discriminate against particular groups of junior doctors.

It also announced three 48-hour strikes affecting non-emergency services, to take place in March and April.

The decision came as a former Government advisor on patient safety called on ministers to apologise to junior doctors over their handling of the contract dispute, and to freeze its imposition for up to three years.

Don Berwick, a US expert who helped shape Barack Obama’s health policy and conducted a review of NHS patient safety under the Coalition, said the Government had made a “mistake” and needed to “find a way out”

“You cannot achieve excellence in combat with your future workforce, it makes no sense at all,” he said at an event at the King’s Fund think-tank on 23 February.'

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a6891686.html

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

Absolutely right to do so, I am behind them all the way.

I wouldn't work a 12 hour shifts without some serious overtime. Good for them, I'll back them to the hilt.

[Beso]

can we not mention to the hilt please, i have a prostate exam coming up.

[bots]

Junior doctors are not alone in working silly hours for no overtime, they are not that badly treated. I don't think the government have behaved correctly or approached the issue in the correct way for a sensible solution, but I have no sympathy for the we are hard done by mentality, they knew the type of job it was when they took it in the first place

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Junior doctors are not alone in working silly hours for no overtime, they are not that badly treated. I don't think the government have behaved correctly or approached the issue in the correct way for a sensible solution, but I have no sympathy for the we are hard done by mentality, they knew the type of job it was when they took it in the first place

If you work over your contracted hours then you deserve recompense.
Anyone who does deserves to be exploited, and you will be.
Does that mean everyone should set themselves by your low standards? No.
They knew the type of job ... Is that you stating the obvious or is there a point linked to overtime somewhere there?

[bots]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

If you work over your contracted hours then you deserve recompense.
Anyone who does deserves to be exploited, and you will be.
Does that mean everyone should set themselves by your low standards? No.
They knew the type of job ... Is that you stating the obvious or is there a point linked to overtime somewhere there?

You clearly haven't worked in many jobs where its been anything other than a clock watching experience. Its not exploitation, its people committed to doing the best they can in the activity they are involved in.

Work doesn't have to be about earning money. So, please put your me me me attitude to one side and accept not everyone has your views on life.

[smudgie]

12 Hour shifts are quite the norm for a lot of people, 2 days 2 nights and then 4 off, but any overtime on top of the shift system gets paid at an enhanced rate.
I don't see why the doctors shouldn't get the same consideration.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

You clearly haven't worked in many jobs where its been anything other than a clock watching experience. Its not exploitation, its people committed to doing the best they can in the activity they are involved in.

Work doesn't have to be about earning money. So, please put your me me me attitude to one side and accept not everyone has your views on life.

Me me me? I'm the one defending them them them against you you you...
Like it or not the issue is related to overtime and too bad if you think it's to gauche to discuss, maybe you envisage they are in a profession in which they would forgo wages due their chosen vocation?
Dear me.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Mystic Mock

If there's still 10% dictatorship still in there then they have every right to protest.

Seriously how can anyone not take their side on this?

It beggars belief Mock and the deal still has the most contentious parts of it which the Junior Doctors have said will cause them to not be able to provide the best care for Patients.

Yes the govt has moved some way as have the Junior Doctors too, but not on the really main and sticky points of this absurd and unnecessary contract.
However,in my view, you get nowhere being dictatorial and imposing on people who have to carry the service out things they know are wrong and likely unworkable.

However,let people moan at the Junior Doctors, lets hope one day they don't need them for themselves.
Then let this rotten Health secretary impose this contract, and when there is a large exodus of Junior Doctors from the NHS to work elsewhere or in other Countries even, maybe then people will see how bad the govt has treated them and also badly handled this whole issue of this ridiculous contract.

[MTVN]

Three 48 hour strikes in the space of 2 months over the issue of 'the time at which premium pay rates apply' (quoting the OP article). It's not about the money though eh?

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Three 48 hour strikes in the space of 2 months over the issue of 'the time at which premium pay rates apply' (quoting the OP article). It's not about the money though eh?

That's the thing though it is not about money,they lose money striking for a start.
Then they are still available even on strike for any emergencies that arise and need them.

Two of my Cousins are Junior Doctors, they are shattered all the time now, they say this will make things worse, if Hunt imposes this against their will and really he should be learning from them not dictating to them.
They predict they will and many other Junior Doctors will too, either leave the profession altogether or go to work in another Country.

Thereby avoiding the criticism for the likely worse care that will inevitably come from the imposition of a contract, that not only the Junior Doctors do not want or agree with but in fact neither do the Consultants either, who also support their Junior Doctors.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Three 48 hour strikes in the space of 2 months over the issue of 'the time at which premium pay rates apply' (quoting the OP article). It's not about the money though eh?

Premium rates apply when emergency departments are the most busy weekends and through the night.
Reducing the premium is a cost cutting exercise only, nothing to do with patient safety, waiting times or death rates.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by joeysteele

That's the thing though it is not about money,they lose money striking for a start.
Then they are still available even on strike for any emergencies that arise and need them.

Two of my Cousins are Junior Doctors, they are shattered all the time now, they say this will make things worse, if Hunt imposes this against their will and really he should be learning from them not dictating to them.
They predict they will and many other Junior Doctors will too, either leave the profession altogether or go to work in another Country.

Thereby avoiding the criticism for the likely worse care that will inevitably come from the imposition of a contract, that not only the Junior Doctors do not want or agree with but in fact neither do the Consultants either, who also support their Junior Doctors.

But it seems that the main sticking points now are about money, primarily whether Saturday hours before 5pm should be 'premium pay' or not. Millions of people up and down the country now treat Saturdays as a working day for no extra money yet junior doctors not earning premium pay before 5pm is suddenly an outrage even though they are having their basic pay increased to offset it? And with the government's proposals no doctor will have to work more than four nights in a row or five long day shifts and those who work at least one in four Saturdays will be compensated. I struggle to see why the proposals are as controversial as they are being made out to be.

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by MTVN

But it seems that the main sticking points now are about money, primarily whether Saturday hours before 5pm should be 'premium pay' or not. Millions of people up and down the country now treat Saturdays as a working day for no extra money yet junior doctors not earning premium pay before 5pm is suddenly an outrage even though they are having their basic pay increased to offset it? And with the government's proposals no doctor will have to work more than four nights in a row or five long day shifts and those who work at least one in four Saturdays will be compensated. I struggle to see why the proposals are as controversial as they are being made out to be.

It is the point that this will stretch out Doctors working time more and yes it will hit extra payments they would have normally got which really is wrong anyway to alter such a situation without their agreement.

It has taken 40 years for Junior Doctors to grumble and strike against a govt,they never take strike action lightly.
This contract is not how Hunt has presented it to the public and even today more is unfolding as to exaggeration of figures used in his statements.

So faced with the prospect of being forced to possibly further endanger lives through poorer more spun out time, what are Junior Doctors to do, lie back and let someone like Hunt who has no medical experience anyway, dictate to them.

They go on strike but make sure all are available for any emergency situation, what could be fairer than that.
If Hunt and this govt continue to just try to walk over Junior Doctors, and do impose this contract,then he can not only forget about 7 day healthcare in the NHS,he will not be able to likely cover most days with guaranteed safe health care as more people turn away from training to be Junior Doctors at all and those already there leave.

Junior Doctors are the ones that save lives, not Hunt,he as I said before should be working with them,listening to them and compromising as to their fears, not just tearing in like a bulldozer over their many genuine fears and concerns as to what care they will be able to properly give in the future.

The ones not telling the whole truth on this contract are the govt and Hunt,I will say here what I said to one of my Cousins who is agonising about staying in the NHS now,... ''this man Hunt will never listen to you, he will twist and lie as to this contract until some or maybe in time most of the public turn on you,so make your move to Australia or elsewhere, who are crying out for the UKs Junior Doctors and where you will appreciated by their govt and their people far more than here''...

If I was junior Doctor,I'd for sure be off like a shot telling him what to do with his very misleading ,new and unnecessary contract.

[Suze]

I agree with the Junior Docs.

[Tom4784]

Good, the contract is ridiculous and they should strike. Jeremy Hunt needs to be removed, all he is doing is killing the NHS and I struggle to understand why anyone would take his side unless they don't really understand what's going on.

[arista]

This a Thread from 2016.

We are now in 2024 Labour Power.

The Strikes Will Carry On
they stated today.

They are Happy Wes Streeting MP Health Sec.
was their today

He returns same time next week.


No change in the Junior Doctors Strikes