[Jack_]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

I feel so bad for these people, some of the photos that have been emerging from Syria the last week are so scary. We don't know how lucky we are to have been born this side of the world. And you can be sure if we weren't we'd be doing what we could to find a safer place for our families too

Yeah but they're brown people so who cares

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Yeah but they're brown people so who cares

pathetic

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Yeah but they're brown people so who cares

mmhhmm I'm so sad I'm a part of this rotten part of history

[Ammi]

...there shouldn't be 'illegal' in humanity...go back and make yourself legal before you come knocking on our door for refuge...it's like someone turning up on our doorsteps, bleeding or whatever and saying...how it that you went past that door or that door to knock here, rather than help that person...I just don't get it...who knows why it's this country but it's missing the point of why the refuge is needed in the first place because to flip it around..these poor people have bypassed other countries where they could have had less risk to their lives...I do understand fear but the thing is, that fear starts to lose focus of what people in parts of the world are going through/what their daily lives are and in being fearful of 'young men' it loses focus of women and children../families...one of them was a 13yr old child, some were between 15yrs and 17yrs old...one elderly man suffered a fit and they were all suffering hypothermia...and they would take those risks just to claim benefits or something because maybe they watch Benefit Street while they watch friends/family/neighbours die....?...and think oh I'll have a little bit of that...


..and to be harshly blunt as well, it's really sometimes hard not to think prejudice because in cases of police brutality and killings of ethnic minorities, it's sometimes said ..stop judging, you don't know the whole facts and it's media portrayal...but this is exactly the same, it's judging and media portrayal and we don't know the facts of why it's the UK that refuge is sought...but the 'common factor' though is 'not the same skin colour' so not the same understandings/empathy and not the same humanity...and we only really have the 'luxury' of judgement and prejudice because of where our parents lived in the world...we moan and groan (encouraged by the media)...of so many in the UK claiming benefits and being so harsh on them because of it/they shouldn't be/they're not entitles to and all of those things that are thrown out...until it comes to those old overseas immigrants and then it's all ours, don't you know...we need to be looking out for own../our own that we often say aren't entitled and manipulating a system...

..the world sucks sometimes...

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...there shouldn't be 'illegal' in humanity...go back and make yourself legal before you come knocking on our door for refuge...it's like someone turning up on our doorsteps, bleeding or whatever and saying...how it that you went past that door or that door to knock here, rather than help that person...I just don't get it...who knows why it's this country but it's missing the point of why the refuge is needed in the first place because to flip it around..these poor people have bypassed other countries where they could have had less risk to their lives...I do understand fear but the thing is, that fear starts to lose focus of what people in parts of the world are going through/what their daily lives are and in being fearful of 'young men' it loses focus of women and children../families...one of them was a 13yr old child, some were between 15yrs and 17yrs old...one elderly man suffered a fit and they were all suffering hypothermia...and they would take those risks just to claim benefits or something because maybe they watch Benefit Street while they watch friends/family/neighbours die....?...and think oh I'll have a little bit of that...


..and to be harshly blunt as well, it's really sometimes hard not to think prejudice because in cases of police brutality and killings of ethnic minorities, it's sometimes said ..stop judging, you don't know the whole facts and it's media portrayal...but this is exactly the same, it's judging and media portrayal and we don't know the facts of why it's the UK that refuge is sought...but the 'common factor' though is 'not the same skin colour' so not the same understandings/empathy and not the same humanity...and we only really have the 'luxury' of judgement and prejudice because of where our parents lived in the world...we moan and groan (encouraged by the media)...of so many in the UK claiming benefits and being so harsh on them because of it/they shouldn't be/they're not entitles to and all of those things that are thrown out...until it comes to those old overseas immigrants and then it's all ours, don't you know...we need to be looking out for own../our own that we often say aren't entitled and manipulating a system...

..the world sucks sometimes...

The thing is.Sad though it is.There's an awful awful lot of people who want to come here.There's even been people from South America been found amongst all these immigrants,People from all over Africa and all over the Middle East aswell as refugees.
You can't just have an open door.There has to be a system in place to process these people and find places for them all accross Europe and there should be Arab countries helping too.This is why Cameron said he would take them directly from the refugee camps.If there were no system in place the whole thing would collapse.Alot of these people are being taken advantage of by people smuggling rackets charging them alot of money to go on a dangerous journey that they might not make alive.This has to be discouraged.
I think we should be taking more genuine refugees but they have to be taken from the refugee camps and processed properly so we can know that they're not just economic migrants trying their luck because they think Britain is a soft touch.Do you not think it's strange that alot of these people supposedly fleeing for their life are'nt greatful just to be in a safe country?I know i would be.That is why the systems need to be in place because by the time they've managed to reach Britain it's gone past that stage of just wanting to be safe.I would bet many of these people are'nt Syrian or refugees even if some are but you can't distinguish between the genuine cases unless they're processed properly.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

The thing is.Sad though it is.There's an awful awful lot of people who want to come here.There's even been people from South America been found amongst all these immigrants,People from all over Africa and all over the Middle East aswell as refugees.
You can't just have an open door.There has to be a system in place to process these people and find places for them all accross Europe and there should be Arab countries helping too.This is why Cameron said he would take them directly from the refugee camps.If there were no system in place the whole thing would collapse.Alot of these people are being taken advantage of by people smuggling rackets charging them alot of money to go on a dangerous journey that they might not make alive.This has to be discouraged.
I think we should be taking more genuine refugees but they have to be taken from the refugee camps and processed properly so we can know that they're not just economic migrants trying their luck because they think Britain is a soft touch.Do you not think it's strange that alot of these people supposedly fleeing for their life are'nt greatful just to be in a safe country?I know i would be.That is why the systems need to be in place because by the time they've managed to reach Britain it's gone past that stage of just wanting to be safe.I would bet many of these people are'nt Syrian or refugees even if some are but you can't distinguish between the genuine cases unless they're processed properly.

...but even with economic migrants though..it's still that their country can't offer them any quality of life because of the volatile situations in their countries, there is no employment/no quality of medical care etc to be had either so just a really shabby existence of hopelessness....and isn't that something that many UK citizens have also very often done in other countries that they've emigrated to or do emigrate to...because they work and work and work but in another country they can achieve things and a quality of life that would be impossible here for various reasons...and we don't have to endure anything resembling what people in some countries have to...but many still striving some kind of life quality../economic reasons...

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...but even with economic migrants though..it's still that their country can't offer them any quality of life because of the volatile situations in their countries, there is no employment/no quality of medical care etc to be had either so just a really shabby existence of hopelessness....and isn't that something that many UK citizens have also very often done in other countries that they've emigrated to or do emigrate to...because they work and work and work but in another country they can achieve things and a quality of life that would be impossible here for various reasons...and we don't have to endure anything resembling what people in some countries have to...but many still striving some kind of life quality../economic reasons...

But do you know how many millions if not billions of people are in poverty around the world?Our tiny island or even Europe could'nt accommodate every person on lower wages than us that wants to come here.It's totally unrealistic.Hence why countries have systems in place and migration policies.That is a much bigger problem of inequality between the rich and poor countries and corrupt governments.That is something that is a huge issue but that needs solving in the countries themselves.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Northern Monkey

But do you know how many millions if not billions of people are in poverty around the world?Our tiny island or even Europe could'nt accommodate every person on lower wages than us that wants to come here.It's totally unrealistic.Hence why countries have systems in place and migration policies.That is a much bigger problem of inequality between the rich and poor countries and corrupt governments.That is something that is a huge issue but that needs solving in the countries themselves.

..thing is though with many/most things...there is always reasons and logic why 'we can't' rather than focusing more attention to 'how can we make it possible'...obviously not to home every refugee seeking refuge but we only have control over what our help could be in possibilities..../anyways, because of my time clock, I'm always logging off just as many are logging on and catching up on threads...so I'm sorry I can't continue in conversation but I have to go now and you have a lovely day NM......

[bots]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...there shouldn't be 'illegal' in humanity...go back and make yourself legal before you come knocking on our door for refuge...it's like someone turning up on our doorsteps, bleeding or whatever and saying...how it that you went past that door or that door to knock here, rather than help that person...I just don't get it...who knows why it's this country but it's missing the point of why the refuge is needed in the first place because to flip it around..these poor people have bypassed other countries where they could have had less risk to their lives...I do understand fear but the thing is, that fear starts to lose focus of what people in parts of the world are going through/what their daily lives are and in being fearful of 'young men' it loses focus of women and children../families...one of them was a 13yr old child, some were between 15yrs and 17yrs old...one elderly man suffered a fit and they were all suffering hypothermia...and they would take those risks just to claim benefits or something because maybe they watch Benefit Street while they watch friends/family/neighbours die....?...and think oh I'll have a little bit of that...


..and to be harshly blunt as well, it's really sometimes hard not to think prejudice because in cases of police brutality and killings of ethnic minorities, it's sometimes said ..stop judging, you don't know the whole facts and it's media portrayal...but this is exactly the same, it's judging and media portrayal and we don't know the facts of why it's the UK that refuge is sought...but the 'common factor' though is 'not the same skin colour' so not the same understandings/empathy and not the same humanity...and we only really have the 'luxury' of judgement and prejudice because of where our parents lived in the world...we moan and groan (encouraged by the media)...of so many in the UK claiming benefits and being so harsh on them because of it/they shouldn't be/they're not entitles to and all of those things that are thrown out...until it comes to those old overseas immigrants and then it's all ours, don't you know...we need to be looking out for own../our own that we often say aren't entitled and manipulating a system...

..the world sucks sometimes...

Thought provoking for sure.

I think the true problem is that very different issues and problems are being grouped together and treated as the same when they are completely different.

The people lining up in Calais are not there escaping war and famine, they are there to exploit the most generous nation in Europe. We can only be the most generous nation in Europe while we look after a finite number of people, that's a fact. All our systems can only function with sustainable proportions of people inputting to the systems wealth. Its a fine balance before it all goes pear shaped and falls apart.

I believe you would be hard pushed to find anyone who would turn their back on genuine sufferers from war, and we do our bit there by re-settling people in the refugee camps set up for their protection. Those people are verified and catered for by our country the correct way. Where they are housed and cared for appropriately.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Thought provoking for sure.

I think the true problem is that very different issues and problems are being grouped together and treated as the same when they are completely different.

The people lining up in Calais are not there escaping war and famine, they are there to exploit the most generous nation in Europe. We can only be the most generous nation in Europe while we look after a finite number of people, that's a fact. All our systems can only function with sustainable proportions of people inputting to the systems wealth. Its a fine balance before it all goes pear shaped and falls apart.

I believe you would be hard pushed to find anyone who would turn their back on genuine sufferers from war, and we do our bit there by re-settling people in the refugee camps set up for their protection. Those people are verified and catered for by our country the correct way. Where they are housed and cared for appropriately.

This sums it up really

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Cherie

This sums it up really

It does but it appears the left cant seem to see the distinction?

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

It does but it appears the left cant seem to see the distinction?

Only the left eh? I would think both sides are guilty of this. Lefties have (often too much) compassion and overlook the 'bad' ones in order to help the 'good'. Where the right appear to tar everyone with the same brush and just say 'keep out'. So yes, seems most will lump them all together yet come to different conclusions.

Both guilty. Like usual.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by bitontheslide

Thought provoking for sure.

I think the true problem is that very different issues and problems are being grouped together and treated as the same when they are completely different.

The people lining up in Calais are not there escaping war and famine, they are there to exploit the most generous nation in Europe. We can only be the most generous nation in Europe while we look after a finite number of people, that's a fact. All our systems can only function with sustainable proportions of people inputting to the systems wealth. Its a fine balance before it all goes pear shaped and falls apart.

I believe you would be hard pushed to find anyone who would turn their back on genuine sufferers from war, and we do our bit there by re-settling people in the refugee camps set up for their protection. Those people are verified and catered for by our country the correct way. Where they are housed and cared for appropriately.

I agree.Sometimes people can confuse refugees and other migrants and will say things like 'They're not migrants!They're refugees!Have a heart etc etc'.Which is an emotional response but does'nt address the issue.This is why all of them just turning up in Europe and getting mixed up together harms the plight of the actual refugees.