[Jack_]

Originally Posted by jaxie

You do have to laugh at remoaners who have been giving our democracy away for 40 years and are begging to continue.

We all know the legal cases have nothing really to do with parliamentary sovereignty and a lot to do with trying to slow or halt Brexit. Lets not dress it up as if remoaners are now the champions of democracy.

Not really an example of hypocrisy like mine was regardless of whether that's true (it isn't) or not though is it? So a failed point I'm afraid. And again, trying to paint 'remoaners' (dear God I'm cringing) as anti-democracy when many leavers have lambasted protesters for exercising their democratic right to do so over the summer is really just hilarious. I can't be the only one who is revelling in all this delicious irony? Surely someone else sees this?

As you yourself said, Brexit is going to happen. It will happen. So what's the problem? I know some people would love us just to rush through the process cause 'we want our democracy back (but not on this issue) grr!!!' and 'scrap those workers rights!!!!!! F**k that red tape!!!' etc etc etc but the reality of the situation is that this is a pretty big issue in the history of British politics and one that quite rightly needs to be debated and dealt with over a suitable period of time. Again, the referendum wasn't fought or voted on how we leave the EU, or when we leave the EU - just that we do, and that's what will happen - so what's the issue?

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

"You do have to laugh at some leavers who demanded they wanted 'our parliamentary sovereignty back' during the referendum campaign now vehemently opposing it being utilised to begin the process of us leaving the very thing they hate so much! "

who specifically are you referring to?

Some of the leavers who are doing what I just described? Be it Farage, people on social media, or on here (if the shoe fits and all that). The clue was in the sentence

[Tom4784]

'remoaners'

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Jack_

Not really an example of hypocrisy like mine was regardless of whether that's true (it isn't) or not though is it? So a failed point I'm afraid. And again, trying to paint 'remoaners' (dear God I'm cringing) as anti-democracy when many leavers have lambasted protesters for exercising their democratic right to do so over the summer is really just hilarious. I can't be the only one who is revelling in all this delicious irony? Surely someone else sees this?

As you yourself said, Brexit is going to happen. It will happen. So what's the problem? I know some people would love us just to rush through the process cause 'we want our democracy back (but not on this issue) grr!!!' and 'scrap those workers rights!!!!!! F**k that red tape!!!' etc etc etc but the reality of the situation is that this is a pretty big issue in the history of British politics and one that quite rightly needs to be debated and dealt with over a suitable period of time. Again, the referendum wasn't fought or voted on how we leave the EU, or when we leave the EU - just that we do, and that's what will happen - so what's the issue?



Some of the leavers who are doing what I just described? Be it Farage, people on social media, or on here (if the shoe fits and all that). The clue was in the sentence

Keep telling yourself that!

[Jack_]

I shall, because we haven't - and once again, if anything it's been leave voters who haven't been much of a proponent of democracy this summer

Anyway Brexit will happen and I'm sure you'll be delighted when we've got our parliamentary sovereignty back and the Tories have decided to repeal vast amounts of workers rights legislation enshrined in EU law because the economy is flatlining and we need people to be more 'productive' or some **** and yes that seems fair enough but hey we got our democracy back and the immigrants are banned so yay good going guys

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

"You do have to laugh at some leavers who demanded they wanted 'our parliamentary sovereignty back' during the referendum campaign now vehemently opposing it being utilised to begin the process of us leaving the very thing they hate so much! "

who specifically are you referring to?

yeah like our govt is 'democratic', the decisions they have made are unconstitutional...proven to be, in a court of law.
That's about as undemocratic as it gets.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

yeah like our govt is 'democratic', the decisions they have made are unconstitutional...proven to be, in a court of law.
That's about as undemocratic as it gets.

So what will they be proven to be if the Supreme Court overturns the decision of the high Court? Or in that Incidence will the law be an ass?

[Kizzy]

I don't doubt it will be, it seems nothing is allowed to stand in the way of our steamroller govt.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I don't doubt it will be, it seems nothing is allowed to stand in the way of our steamroller govt.

So it's selective adherence to the law you advocate then?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jaxie

So it's selective adherence to the law you advocate then?

Is that not exactly what we are seeing from brexiteers?

Wasn't the insistence that we make our own laws, EU laws had no place in Britain?
yet lo.. When our govt fall foul of our laws it's 'oh those laws are no good, they're old smelly laws...silly constitutional laws to protect the sovereignty of parliament.
We should totally have shiny new laws which says when May says jump the judges, lords and the electorate say 'how high ma'am?'.......pffft!

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Is that not exactly what we are seeing from brexiteers?

Wasn't the insistence that we make our own laws, EU laws had no place in Britain?
yet lo.. When our govt fall foul of our laws it's 'oh those laws are no good, they're old smelly laws...silly constitutional laws to protect the sovereignty of parliament.
We should totally have shiny new laws which says when May says jump the judges, lords and the electorate say 'how high ma'am?'.......pffft!

No it's not what we are seeing from Brexiters, I would imagine most are waiting to see what the Supreme Court will say, thereby respecting the law. I've not seen anyone say we can ignore the law.

What a lot of tosh in regards May, the high court didn't say how high to her. Under the law though she has the right to appeal. So far as a PM she hasn't done anything terrible, she's a little cautious but that's not a bad thing in a PM.

Silly, pointless unnecessary court case brought by idiotic arrogant people though, yes.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jaxie

No it's not what we are seeing from Brexiters, I would imagine most are waiting to see what the Supreme Court will say, thereby respecting the law. I've not seen anyone say we can ignore the law.

What a lot of tosh in regards May, the high court didn't say how high to her. Under the law though she has the right to appeal. So far as a PM she hasn't done anything terrible, she's a little cautious but that's not a bad thing in a PM.

Silly, pointless unnecessary court case brought by idiotic arrogant people though, yes.

You just proved my point! You don't think the govt should act within the parimetres of the law if you think this was pointless.
She has been proven to be acting unconstitutionally, she is the one acting arrogantly flagrantly disregarding the law.

[Livia]

It's amazing how much people's faith in the law increases when it fits in with their agenda.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Livia

It's amazing how much people's faith in the law increases when it fits in with their agenda.

Very true.

[Northern Monkey]

Originally Posted by Livia

It's amazing how much people's faith in the law increases when it fits in with their agenda.

.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Livia

It's amazing how much people's faith in the law increases when it fits in with their agenda.

[Tom4784]

Originally Posted by Livia

It's amazing how much people's faith in the law increases when it fits in with their agenda.

It's also amazing how many people are willing to flout those laws to get what they want despite it being in direct conflict with why they wanted to leave in the first place.

Protest the law, call for changes but flouting it or making out that other people are hypocritical for following is just plain hypocritical in itself.

[arista]

"hey we got our democracy back and the immigrants are banned "

Not Legit Workers, Jack
- they will have contract work

But illegals and immigrant Criminals or Dossers
banned


Democracy Is Cool

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

You just proved my point! You don't think the govt should act within the parimetres of the law if you think this was pointless.
She has been proven to be acting unconstitutionally, she is the one acting arrogantly flagrantly disregarding the law.

You are adding two and two and making 10. I didn't prove your point at all. What I think about the court case is an opinion and is not the point. However I've never once, and nor has the government said anything about not abiding by the law. Come to that neither have the government, they are following the process of the law through appeal. Too desperate to be right. You can't just make up what other people are saying to suit your perception or agenda.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

It's also amazing how many people are willing to flout those laws to get what they want despite it being in direct conflict with why they wanted to leave in the first place.

Protest the law, call for changes but flouting it or making out that other people are hypocritical for following is just plain hypocritical in itself.

Who is flouting the law exactly.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Livia

It's amazing how much people's faith in the law increases when it fits in with their agenda.

I hope you're not suggesting I don't have faith in the law, personally I have NEVER given any indication I don't.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jaxie

You are adding two and two and making 10. I didn't prove your point at all. What I think about the court case is an opinion and is not the point. However I've never once, and nor has the government said anything about not abiding by the law. Come to that neither have the government, they are following the process of the law through appeal. Too desperate to be right. You can't just make up what other people are saying to suit your perception or agenda.

The government is desperate to be right, unfortunately they have been found to be wrong.
The appeal will be interesting.

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

The government is desperate to be right, unfortunately they have been found to be wrong.
The appeal will be interesting.

What you are advocating the law while intimating the government has not right of appeal or is somehow wrong to appeal. That's not how it works.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by jaxie

What you are advocating the law while intimating the government has not right of appeal or is somehow wrong to appeal. That's not how it works.

They have, although who is going to hear the case?
Also this is not a 'case' as such in relation to rape or murder, it's a point of constitutional law which in effect should really be more a black and white issue... Either she can or she can't, it's been found she can't, how is appealing going to prove she can?

[jaxie]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

They have, although who is going to hear the case?
Also this is not a 'case' as such in relation to rape or murder, it's a point of constitutional law which in effect should really be more a black and white issue... Either she can or she can't, it's been found she can't, how is appealing going to prove she can?

What do you mean who is going to hear it. The Supreme Court judges will.

There is a lovely picture of them if you Google.

The reason we have the ability to appeal is that a court will sometimes get it wrong. The Supreme Court is the highest court in the land.

[Cherie]

Supreme Court rules MP's have to vote before triggering Article 50