[Liberty4eva]

When there was an assassination in ancient Rome the question they would ask is who benefits? Assad gassing his own people gains him nothing. This smacks of war propaganda. I would sooner believe the rebels (ISIS) gassed the people to frame Assad.

[Denver]

He is an horrible person who will do anything to get rid of people wanting him out

[DemolitionRed]

Does anyone know if it was Shiites or Sunnis who were gassed?

[user104658]

IF indeed it was the rebels / terrorists / miscellaneous who unleashed a chemical weapon, then it is extremely likely that they did so with the prior knowledge of, in collusion with, or possibly even suggested by, an interested third party such as the United States.

Wake up Liberty. You're half way there. Further down the rabbit hole, faster faster!

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

IF indeed it was the rebels / terrorists / miscellaneous who unleashed a chemical weapon, then it is extremely likely that they did so with the prior knowledge of, in collusion with, or possibly even suggested by, an interested third party such as the United States.

Wake up Liberty. You're half way there. Further down the rabbit hole, faster faster!

You would blame Trump if a meteorite crashed into the Middle East and eradicated it - somehow it would be his fault.

Conspiratory theories gone mad.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

You would blame Trump if a meteorite crashed into the Middle East and eradicated it - somehow it would be his fault.

Conspiratory theories gone mad.

Nothing at all to do with Trump.

[Liberty4eva]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

IF indeed it was the rebels / terrorists / miscellaneous who unleashed a chemical weapon, then it is extremely likely that they did so with the prior knowledge of, in collusion with, or possibly even suggested by, an interested third party such as the United States.

Wake up Liberty. You're half way there. Further down the rabbit hole, faster faster!

I'm a lot more awake than you realize, TS. I don't know everything about the world but I know that when it comes to war that governments and media are VERY likely to lie. And perhaps most wars in history are started over lies. War means business. War means opportunity to enhance government power both over seas and domestically. People will know that I am a Trump supporter but I will turn on him so fast if he continues to provoke war.

[jennyjuniper]

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva

When there was an assassination in ancient Rome the question they would ask is who benefits? Assad gassing his own people gains him nothing. This smacks of war propaganda. I would sooner believe the rebels (ISIS) gassed the people to frame Assad.

Saddam Hussein did it.

[the truth]

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva

When there was an assassination in ancient Rome the question they would ask is who benefits? Assad gassing his own people gains him nothing. This smacks of war propaganda. I would sooner believe the rebels (ISIS) gassed the people to frame Assad.

Youre probably right but 90% of US news is controlled by just 6 corporations...General electric, disney, cbs, time warner, news corporation and viacom

its whats known as the illusion of choice, where the 50 odd corporations in the 1980s were bought out and consolidated into just 6. thats just 6 bosses controlling the news in america, frightening

http://www.businessinsider.com/these...ca-2012-6?IR=T

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva

I'm a lot more awake than you realize, TS. I don't know everything about the world but I know that when it comes to war that governments and media are VERY likely to lie. And perhaps most wars in history are started over lies. War means business. War means opportunity to enhance government power both over seas and domestically. People will know that I am a Trump supporter but I will turn on him so fast if he continues to provoke war.

People can shout 'propaganda' all they want. The question is, who's propaganda do we believe?

What we do know is, the West took out Hussein and Gaddafi under a pretext of lies. They want to take out Assad before taking out Khamenei but those pesky Russians are making things tough this time round.

I don't believe for a moment that Western interest is about overthrowing ISIS because there's a hundred gorilla groups just as ruthless as them and I don't believe they want to see the fall of Assad because he's an evil dictator (he's only evil if you only pay attention to western news). This is all about oil pipe lines for both Russia and the West.

[Livia]

If there's no evidence of chemical weapons being used, 'beyond a reaonsable doubt', there is definitely a preponderance of evidence. Victims being treated for what could only have been a chemical attack, and bodies showing unique symptons of exposure to chemical weapons. Leaders in the Middle East are not adverse to using chemical weapons; Saddam's chemical attach on the Kurds at Halabja... for instance.

[the truth]

The west blamed iran for killing 5000 people in the 1980s ...then 20 years later they blamed iraq for the exact same 5000 deaths as an excuse to blow up Iraq? colin powell, bush and killary all peddled this and the masses didnt seem to notice

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by the truth

The west blamed iran for killing 5000 people in the 1980s ...then 20 years later they blamed iraq for the exact same 5000 deaths as an excuse to blow up Iraq? colin powell, bush and killary all peddled this and the masses didnt seem to notice

^This

How can the Syrian government be held accountable for using chemical weapons when, so far, there's not a scrap of evidence. All evidence so far is pointing at Jabhat al-Nusra terrorists, so why would the U.S jump in before an agreed investigation from none interested parties outside of Syria?

From where I'm sitting, it looks like the U.S goal is to weaken the ability of the Syrian Arab Army and its allies to fight terrorism. If that's the case, America has just encouraged mass terrorism with chemical weapons.

[Northern Monkey]

Youtube video

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

People can shout 'propaganda' all they want. The question is, who's propaganda do we believe?

What we do know is, the West took out Hussein and Gaddafi under a pretext of lies. They want to take out Assad before taking out Khamenei but those pesky Russians are making things tough this time round.

I don't believe for a moment that Western interest is about overthrowing ISIS because there's a hundred gorilla groups just as ruthless as them and I don't believe they want to see the fall of Assad because he's an evil dictator (he's only evil if you only pay attention to western news). This is all about oil pipe lines for both Russia and the West.

There may be 100 other groups but ISIS are the ones carrying out all the terror attacks in the West currently and should be top of the list.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

There may be 100 other groups but ISIS are the ones carrying out all the terror attacks in the West currently and should be top of the list.

One thing that's been proven over and over again is, you can't fight gorilla warfare like you can a conventional war because there's no clear supply line. ISIS is so entrenched in multiple areas that they are virtually impossible to pin down.

Perhaps we should ask ourselves, why does ISIS exist and why is ISIS targetting the West? Should we just get out and stop trying to police that part of the world for our own material gain? We need to remind ourselves that just as ISIS is evil to us, the West is equally as evil to ISIS.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

One thing that's been proven over and over again is, you can't fight gorilla warfare like you can a conventional war because there's no clear supply line. ISIS is so entrenched in multiple areas that they are virtually impossible to pin down.

Perhaps we should ask ourselves, why does ISIS exist and why is ISIS targetting the West? Should we just get out and stop trying to police that part of the world for our own material gain? We need to remind ourselves that just as ISIS is evil to us, the West is equally as evil to ISIS.

And why are they entrenched in multiple areas - it's all part of their plan. Hence the battle the West now have with the enemy within. We only have ourselves to blame for that in my opinion. Finally, hopefully, the West are waking up to that.

You make it sound as if they don't dictate to and terrorise their own people, especially the poor women. As if they just go about their lives not bothering anyone else unless others bother them. They are tyrants who need to control others and make their lives a misery. Who are you trying to convince!

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

One thing that's been proven over and over again is, you can't fight gorilla warfare like you can a conventional war because there's no clear supply line. ISIS is so entrenched in multiple areas that they are virtually impossible to pin down.

Perhaps we should ask ourselves, why does ISIS exist and why is ISIS targetting the West? Should we just get out and stop trying to police that part of the world for our own material gain? We need to remind ourselves that just as ISIS is evil to us, the West is equally as evil to ISIS.

They don't just target the West though do they?

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

And why are they entrenched in multiple areas - it's all part of their plan. Hence the battle the West now have with the enemy within. We only have ourselves to blame for that in my opinion. Finally, hopefully, the West are waking up to that.

You make it sound as if they don't dictate to and terrorise their own people, especially the poor women. As if they just go about their lives not bothering anyone else unless others bother them. They are tyrants who need to control others and make their lives a misery. Who are you trying to convince!

Good point

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

And why are they entrenched in multiple areas - it's all part of their plan. Hence the battle the West now have with the enemy within. We only have ourselves to blame for that in my opinion. Finally, hopefully, the West are waking up to that.

Of course its part of their plan. They know the terrain, their enemies don't. I mean, good grief, the American army don't even know who to target because ISIS soldiers can look like civilians; all they can do is rely on tip-offs and interception but neither of those things are reliable

Like you say, its the same in the West. These lone wolves come out of nowhere. They can walk among us without creating suspicion

You make it sound as if they don't dictate to and terrorise their own people, especially the poor women. As if they just go about their lives not bothering anyone else unless others bother them. They are tyrants who need to control others and make their lives a misery. Who are you trying to convince!

They are all fighting for their own cause and many of these fractions are as equally as bad as ISIS... meaning they lop off peoples heads, rape and imprison women and murder babies in arms. The Shiites are as bad as the Sunnis who are as bad as the Wahabis and in the middle of all that mess are people who just want to live peaceful lives or get out of that hell hole.

What am I trying to convince people of? I think I have a fairly good understanding of what started this mess. I know the western governments were no innocents in this and I don't believe for an iota of a second that our governments are the good Samaritans that are trying to resolve this mess.

[waterhog]

Originally Posted by Liberty4eva

When there was an assassination in ancient Rome the question they would ask is who benefits? Assad gassing his own people gains him nothing. This smacks of war propaganda. I would sooner believe the rebels (ISIS) gassed the people to frame Assad.

he is one sick individual - ofcorse her did as he has no limits to what he does and to who. and with russia behind him - he has got a green card.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by waterhog

he is one sick individual - ofcorse her did as he has no limits to what he does and to who. and with russia behind him - he has got a green card.

We can't paint this as black and white like western media have. Its been grossly simplified into Assad EVIL... The west and Saudi GOOD; Its a lot more complex than that.

A percentage of Syrians hate Assad and another percentage see him as the great captain of the ship. Assad's army are killing its opponent's, just as the opponent's are killing people who support Assad. The Shiite's love their president, the Sunni's hate him and want a Sunni government installed, which would be equally dictatorial.

America and the West took it upon themselves to sit on Syrias doorstep and support Assad's opponent's but first they had to paint Assad as the evil tyrant who gasses children (there is no proof to back this claim) They did the same in Iraq and Libya and look at whats risen from the ashes there.

If you read Syrian public opinion of the goings on in Syria, its frightening because the hatred towards the West is huge. Even those who the Americans are presently supporting make comments like, "first we will kill Assad and then we will kill America".

Don't get me wrong. I believe Assad is a dictator, just as Saddam and Khamenei of Iran and Salman Al Saud of Saudi are dictators, but every time we topple a dictator, something much worse takes its place and entire nations become unstable and brutally tribal and we get refugees en-mass arriving on our shores.

So Assad may be bad according to the western government and Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud is good... think about that and you will understand that this has nothing to do with dictatorship and all to do with pipe lines and the price of future oil.

[waterhog]

I am judging him on what he has said and his plans - this man is more deluded then me - what he says is not reality. the quicker he is gone the quicker we can get to grips with the next person who takes his place and all the problems they bring.

[Livia]

Does anyone here think that Assad has been painted as "evil", but that he actually isn't? If anyone's in doubt and you don't trust the press... do some digging yourself, read some of the stories by actual Syrians and see what they've lost. But really, I have faith that the vast majority are not sheep, but thinking beings who can sniff out a lie as well as the next person.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by waterhog

I am judging him on what he has said and his plans - this man is more deluded then me - what he says is not reality. the quicker he is gone the quicker we can get to grips with the next person who takes his place and all the problems they bring.

So another Iraq is for the best then?