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Niamh. · 07-11-2017, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

"And anyway I know it wasn't MTVN and Vicky 'cos they were all me."

Niamh. · 07-11-2017, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

i take every infraction personally and keep a tally of which mod/admin infracted me - a league table as it were

I often refer to Neem as Man City and Vicky as Palace

not sure why...

Because I'm a winner probably

Vicky. · 07-11-2017, 01:44 PM

Well this thread has been fun to read today. Don't think a thread has ever grown so fast in such a short period of time that is outside the BB section and not full of spam.

To clear a few things up, while reports do alert us to a thread, a report alone will no result in a post being infracted. We will read through the thread (or just the argument, if its clear where it started) and moderate accordingly, which often results in no action taken at all, or just a couple of deletions. Infact, a lot of the time we get a situation where memberX reports memberY for insults, we check out the thread and it turns out that memberX actually started the insulting and the post they reported wasn't even an insult in the first place or was a retaliation to a whole page of insults sent their way beforehand. MemberX gets infracted. MemberY is either deleted, or warned. So effectively, memberX brings on their own infraction and the person they were baiting just to report when they finally snapped, gets nothing.

We don't only moderate on reports. Especially in this section as a lot of staff actively use and/or read this section most of the time, so we will see threads and their contents anwyay.

The biased staff thing I really find pretty bizzare. As in most sections the staff cover pretty much all opinions. For example in this section I would say me and dezzy tend to be very left wing. Niamh is left usually but pretty middle. Josy seems around middle overall. MTVN is right wing. And James seems to be very right. So if one member from any persuastion was being infracted a lot, the other mods on the same political persuasion would speak up about it (this is assuming we mod according to our own personal persuasion in the first place, which we don't).

Being called racist, after a racist post, is not an insult IMO either. If we were to class calling out obvious racism as a rule break, that would be silly. Brillo, given it seems to be you who has a particular problem with this, how would you feel if someone posted an obviously sexist post (or persistant borderline sexist posts, followed by one you considered to be outright sexism), you said they were sexist, and you recieved an infraction for insults? Or your post was deleted and the sexist one was left to stand?

In general, posting strong opinions will generate strong responses. Insulting each other is not ok. But I would not class 'you are homophobic' as an insult. 'You are a homophbic dickhead who lives in their mothers basement' I would say was an insult.

So yeah, carry on if you will. Thrashing it all out once in a while is good for the forum I think.

MTVN · 07-11-2017, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Well this thread has been fun to read today. Don't think a thread has ever grown so fast in such a short period of time that is outside the BB section and not full of spam.

To clear a few things up, while reports do alert us to a thread, a report alone will no result in a post being infracted. We will read through the thread (or just the argument, if its clear where it started) and moderate accordingly, which often results in no action taken at all, or just a couple of deletions. Infact, a lot of the time we get a situation where memberX reports memberY for insults, we check out the thread and it turns out that memberX actually started the insulting and the post they reported wasn't even an insult in the first place or was a retaliation to a whole page of insults sent their way beforehand. MemberX gets infracted. MemberY is either deleted, or warned. So effectively, memberX brings on their own infraction and the person they were baiting just to report when they finally snapped, gets nothing.

We don't only moderate on reports. Especially in this section as a lot of staff actively use and/or read this section most of the time, so we will see threads and their contents anwyay.

The biased staff thing I really find pretty bizzare. As in most sections the staff cover pretty much all opinions. For example in this section I would say me and dezzy tend to be very left wing. Niamh is left usually but pretty middle. Josy seems around middle overall. MTVN is right wing. And James seems to be very right. So if one member from any persuastion was being infracted a lot, the other mods on the same political persuasion would speak up about it (this is assuming we mod according to our own personal persuasion in the first place, which we don't).

Being called racist, after a racist post, is not an insult IMO either. If we were to class calling out obvious racism as a rule break, that would be silly. Brillo, given it seems to be you who has a particular problem with this, how would you feel if someone posted an obviously sexist post (or persistant borderline sexist posts, followed by one you considered to be outright sexism), you said they were sexist, and you recieved an infraction for insults? Or your post was deleted and the sexist one was left to stand?

In general, posting strong opinions will generate strong responses. Insulting each other is not ok. But I would not class 'you are homophobic' as an insult. 'You are a homophbic dickhead who lives in their mothers basement' I would say was an insult.

So yeah, carry on if you will. Thrashing it all out once in a while is good for the forum I think.

Centre-right if you don't mind

not sure James would agree that he's very right wing either lol

Vicky. · 07-11-2017, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN

Centre-right if you don't mind

not sure James would agree that he's very right wing either lol

James comes across as very right wing to me

Brillopad · 07-11-2017, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicky.

James comes across as very right wing to me

To the hard left anything right of centre is far right.

Vicky. · 07-11-2017, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brillopad

To the hard left anything right of centre is far right.

In that case, how come I did not categorize MTVN as far right

Jack_ · 07-11-2017, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brillopad

To the hard left anything right of centre is far right.

Conversely, to the far right, anything left-of-centre is hard left

Jack_ · 07-11-2017, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN

Centre-right if you don't mind

not sure James would agree that he's very right wing either lol

I miss you being a lefty tbh

MTVN · 07-11-2017, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack_

I miss you being a lefty tbh

My early uni days

weirdly I was always quite conservative when I first got into politics at 14 or 15 and then went quite left wing at 18/19 before then reverting back to my more natural conservatism at 21/22. Was quite a journey

Jack_ · 07-11-2017, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN

My early uni days

weirdly I was always quite conservative when I first got into politics at 14 or 15 and then went quite left wing at 18/19 before then reverting back to my more natural conservatism at 21/22. Was quite a journey

I was about to say I don't understand how people can change their political views to such extremes (and I totally don't get floating voters at all), but then tbh I was more of a centrist when I got into my first election at 15. If it weren't for further and higher education I'd have probably voted for the Tories by now

Me and my friends often joke in horror about the notion of becoming more right-wing as you get older, so much so that if I ever post anything remotely right wing on this forum you have my permission to permanently ban me

user104658 · 07-11-2017, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTVN

Centre-right if you don't mind

not sure James would agree that he's very right wing either lol

Vicky has spoken and we know all the ins and outs of it now, there's no point denying it.

DemolitionRed · 07-11-2017, 01:49 PM

People are going to get very serious when we start talking about Brexit. There's a lot of anger towards the ruling elites in the way Brexit is being handled and so its a very heady topic. I sit on the side of Brexit, but I see some very emotive and intelligent discussion get ignored and ridiculed by posters with comments like, "we voted out. We are leaving. Get over it" sort comments. Its a discussion on here that's never taken off because one side wants to talk about it and the other side want to shut that discussion down. Its a shame but it is what it is and I can fully see why people get frustrated.

jaxie · 07-11-2017, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

People are going to get very serious when we start talking about Brexit. There's a lot of anger towards the ruling elites in the way Brexit is being handled and so its a very heady topic. I sit on the side of Brexit, but I see some very emotive and intelligent discussion get ignored and ridiculed by posters with comments like, "we voted out. We are leaving. Get over it" sort comments. Its a discussion on here that's never taken off because one side wants to talk about it and the other side want to shut that discussion down. Its a shame but it is what it is and I can fully see why people get frustrated.

Well what do you expect when the other side of the coin keeps implying you were stupid or duped to vote for brexit?

Saying we are leaving get over is a pretty tame response to being called an idiot IMO.

Vicky. · 07-11-2017, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaxie

Well what do you expect when the other side of the coin keeps implying you were stupid or duped to vote for brexit?

Saying we are leaving get over is a pretty tame response to being called an idiot IMO.

Its exactly this kind of tit for tat stuff that should stop. Its that rubbish thats ruining this forum. Yes both sides are guilty at times too.. (though specifically on the brexit thing, I think most voters in general were unaware on what they were actually voting for due to the ridiculous media campaigns built on lies)

Its actually painful for me to read this forum at times, as I remember how decent it used to be and now half the posts seem to be 'ner ner you said this about me so I am saying this about you' rather than much actual reasoned discussion on stuff. This is partly why I took the hardlined reponse to moderation in here, which did result in some actions that may have been OTT at times and clearly didn't work given I ended up flouncing in the mod thread a few days ago and claiming I am not longer modding this section at all as everyone just ignores me

I hope, and this may be overly optimistic, that since this thread has cleared the air a bit and let everyone speak in depth, and also mods to explain a little of quite how moderation works...maybe this section can go back to being half decent. And from now hopefully, stop the tit for tat stuff. The bickering and pointless posts ruin this section. I don't think its fair to lay the blame on any few posters. Or on either 'side'. there is a huge difference between debating, and bickering.

jaxie · 07-11-2017, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Its exactly this kind of tit for tat stuff that should stop. Its that rubbish thats ruining this forum. Yes both sides are guilty at times too.. (though specifically on the brexit thing, I think most voters in general were unaware on what they were actually voting for due to the ridiculous media campaigns built on lies)

Its actually painful for me to read this forum at times, as I remember how decent it used to be and now half the posts seem to be 'ner ner you said this about me so I am saying this about you' rather than much actual reasoned discussion on stuff. This is partly why I took the hardlined reponse to moderation in here, which did result in some actions that may have been OTT at times and clearly didn't work given I ended up flouncing in the mod thread a few days ago and claiming I am not longer modding this section at all as everyone just ignores me

I hope, and this may be overly optimistic, that since this thread has cleared the air a bit and let everyone speak in depth, and also mods to explain a little of quite how moderation works...maybe this section can go back to being half decent. And from now hopefully, stop the tit for tat stuff. The bickering and pointless posts ruin this section. I don't think its fair to lay the blame on any few posters. Or on either 'side'. there is a huge difference between debating, and bickering.

I think you've slightly misinterpreted what I was saying but that's ok I've had a wonderful week!

Vicky. · 07-11-2017, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaxie

I think you've slightly misinterpreted what I was saying but that's ok I've had a wonderful week!

I may well have misread

The rest of the post still stands though. Just pretend I didn't quote you

Its tit for tat nonsense thats the main issue.

Along with some members being a little too sensitive to criticism to be taking part in actual debates. Thats not directed at anyone in particular before that comments taken in the wrong way.

DemolitionRed · 07-11-2017, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaxie

Well what do you expect when the other side of the coin keeps implying you were stupid or duped to vote for brexit?

Saying we are leaving get over is a pretty tame response to being called an idiot IMO.

I doubt anyone called you an idiot. I've read most of those threads and the worst I've seen anti-Brexiteers come up with is the suggestion that people were conned by the likes of Boris and Nigel. Nobody regardless of what side you're sitting on can disagree about the lies. Whilst there may have been comments about stupidity, why would anyone take that as a personal slant against them? Those who voted out all had their own reason for doing so. Talking about those reasons shouldn't be a sore point.

I voted out and I've never felt insulted by the anti-Brexit crowd on here, so what are you seeing that I'm not?

Vicky. · 07-11-2017, 05:35 PM

I did definitely misread you, reading back and the post you quoted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaxie

Well what do you expect when the other side of the coin keeps implying you were stupid or duped to vote for brexit?

Saying we are leaving get over is a pretty tame response to being called an idiot IMO.

Tame response, yes. Helpful to debate on the subject, no. Attempt to engage the topic, no. Actually a pretty childish response? Yes. An overall worthy post in this section, no. Something that should probably just be deleted, yes. Something I would hope people can refrain from doing in the future in the hopes of making this section readable and enjoyable again. Yes. (not limited to brexit or either side or whatever. just in general)

Basically.

What I mean by tit for tat rubbish.

jaxie · 07-11-2017, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicky.

I did definitely misread you, reading back and the post you quoted.

Tame response, yes. Helpful to debate on the subject, no. Attempt to engage the topic, no. Actually a pretty childish response? Yes. An overall worthy post in this section, no. Something that should probably just be deleted, yes. Something I would hope people can refrain from doing in the future in the hopes of making this section readable and enjoyable again. Yes. (not limited to brexit or either side or whatever. just in general)

Basically.

What I mean by tit for tat rubbish.

I think people are going to respond with a lack of empathy to the other view if they feel they are being attacked is what I was attempting to put across. People aren't peons of perfection. So to speak. In an ideal world we would all respect another view when disagreement. In reality this doesn't happen.