[user104658]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

well they're idiots, there's always going to be idiots but my point is if men have issues that need addressing then I think they need to get organised themselves and start educating eachother as well as women and I'm sure alot of women would get behind them too

The men who try get shouted down, dismissed as "male tears", reminded to "shut up because women have it worse", accused of trying to take attention away from "real" domestic abuse...

There's a reason that these organised movements don't really exist and it's not because people haven't tried to start them. The reason is, as above, division and tribalism. A united anti-abuse campaign would be taken more seriously by the "out there" element, both male and female, than the segregated campaigns which only generate backlash. And you can say "yes but only backlash from the idiots who think it's OK!" ... But who exactly are these campaigns trying to reach? Precisely those idiots! If they only reach the non-idiots who already understand that abuse is never justified, then they are pointless, preaching to the choir, and little more than exercises in self-congratulation. Which tbqfh sort of sums up current feminism. The only people really listening and engaging are those who already define themselves as feminists, or those like me (and others on here) who don't identify with the feminism brand but nonetheless do support equality. What's the point in that, exactly?