[Glenn.]

That’s after they get a pass from the weirdo genital police at the door.

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by arista

In todays Daily Telegraph.


[Shops and leisure centres can question
transgender people about their
biological sex before letting them
use changing rooms, the equalities
watchdog has said.
Those who appear to be lying can legally
be refused entry as long as they are not
asked in a rude or offensive manner,
according to updated guidance from
the Equality and
Human Rights Commission (EHRC).

Gyms and hospitals could legally ask
people to provide birth certificates
or passports to prove their biological sex.

The watchdog said trans people could
legally be shut out of anywhere where
women were likely to be in a state of undress.

Last month a Cabinet minister insisted
there would be no “toilet police”
stopping trans women from using
women’s lavatories.

Pat McFadden, the Cabinet Office minister,
said the “logical consequence”
of the Supreme Court ruling was that
everyone should use the facilities
of their biological gender.]


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics...hanging-rooms/

LOVE this for women. What a win It's such a leap forward that some women may now have to prove their biological sex when they want to take a pee.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by BBXX

LOVE this for women. What a win It's such a leap forward that some women may now have to prove their biological sex when they want to take a pee.

what an odd attitude

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Crimson Dynamo

what an odd attitude

Just because you don't understand something it doesn't make it odd. Hope that helps.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by BBXX

Just because you don't understand something it doesn't make it odd. Hope that helps.

Well I don't understand Pakistani grooming gangs

for a kick off

do you want me to continue?

[Vicky.]

Asking for birth certificate or passport is pointless for many as these get changed when you get a GRC.

The transman point.. the supreme court covered that in their guidance, if a female has taken steps to look sufficiently masculine they can be banned from female areas.

I can't seem transmen kicking up a fuss though tbh. They grew up female, they know how female people think..they won't want to potentially scare people, I imagine passing transmen will continue using male areas

Interesting that suddenly we are hearing about transmen though. Usually they are totally forgotten

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

The transman point.. the supreme court covered that in their guidance, if a female has taken steps to look sufficiently masculine they can be banned from female areas.

It's almost like it's not about biological sex being important in the slightest then.

Anyone supporting this ruling should have a major issue with the above caveat and if you don't, it shows you don't care about women or biological sex at all, you just hate trans people.

Irrespective of the hypocrisy, who decides what is 'sufficiently masculine' and why are we letting other people decide define what passes as woman or man on the basis of appearance. ****ing archaic.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by BBXX

It's almost like it's not about biological sex being important in the slightest then.

Anyone supporting this ruling should have a major issue with the above caveat and if you don't, it shows you don't care about women or biological sex at all, you just hate trans people.

Irrespective of the hypocrisy, who decides what is 'sufficiently masculine' and why are we letting other people decide define what passes as woman or man on the basis of appearance. ****ing archaic.

That was my words not the court. The sufficiently masculine part.

It makes sense to me. It's about biological sex but if someone has taken steps to be perceived as male then yes they will cause distress to others on a female only space.

But basically 'but transmen' is not an argument

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

That was my words not the court. The sufficiently masculine part.

It makes sense to me. It's about biological sex but if someone has taken steps to be perceived as male then yes they will cause distress to others on a female only space.

But basically 'but transmen' is not an argument

But what about the Trans Men you view as biological women? Do those biological women not count?

You're advocating for cis women not to share spaces with biological men while at the same time happy that some Trans men (who you happily call female because you see them as women) are sharing space with biological men.

So really, your care for biological sex only extends so far, meaning it's not about biological sex at all and moreover, your care for biological women only extends to cis biological women and so you don't really care about biological women at all. You just don't like trans women and you don't care about trans men.

[Crimson Dynamo]

[Liam-]

Originally Posted by BBXX

It's almost like it's not about biological sex being important in the slightest then.

Anyone supporting this ruling should have a major issue with the above caveat and if you don't, it shows you don't care about women or biological sex at all, you just hate trans people.

Irrespective of the hypocrisy, who decides what is 'sufficiently masculine' and why are we letting other people decide define what passes as woman or man on the basis of appearance. ****ing archaic.

At least people are finally being honest about it now, even though this was the obvious truth from the very beginning

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Liam-

At least people are finally being honest about it now, even though this was the obvious truth from the very beginning

I don't really think they're even being honest, I think they're tripping up over their own hypocrisy.

[Maru]

Originally Posted by Glenn.

But with beards

I mean.. a beard doesn't make someone a man so that would be fine to me. It'd be like washing my hands next to a woman with crazy overgrown armpit hair. It stands out but not offensive or anything.

They're still women technically so they're socialized as such. For women, socialization is much more key and we rely on that to adapt on average than men. I knew a transman from high school who was a bestie and they still at heart had female thinking and boundaries well ingrained... it's not like they lost that? A man looking to cause trouble doesn't know good behavior and will openly try to dominate as such. Sorry, I have history with harassment to that level like so many women, so know what men are more willing to do in private and they're not wallflowers as such as they get something out of intimidating targets. There is a reason to have a visceral reaction to the relaxing of the boundary that allows biomen into those space, but transmen are not even a thought for me. In fact, I think they would more understand the differences in that make this a crossing of lines for many women.

The level of threat and insidious need to dominate that one can experience from a man is not based on appearance or other hidden differences but rather behavior that is biologically ingrained to be predatory that no hormone pill or surgery can hope to remove if it is there.

I have yet to see any biological woman (trans or not) try to emulate these deeply ingrained male instincts. Not only is that not socially desirable but women by their nature tend to be highly socialized. I don't think you really can emulate strongly adapted biological instincts to that deep of a level and that is a very big one to try... it certainly couldn't be pilled in. And it's those characteristics that we don't want anywhere near any aspect of private female social life.

[Cherie]

Am in Cambridge on the way back now while waiting for my friend to arrive popped into Cafe Nero opposite the station the one lockable cubicle is now unisex with a separate disabled toilet next door...no drama just amused me that men had to queue like women have for years lol

It wasn't like this when I last visited so you can thank trans women for your queue gents ��

[Oliver_W]

Again I'll say the simplest solution would be for the two toilets to be for:
(cis) Women
Everyone Else

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by Oliver_W

Again I'll say the simplest solution would be for the two toilets to be for:
(cis) Women
Everyone Else

Same for sport

[Vicky.]

Transmen are biological women. I would have thought the court giving an answer to that would be a good thing. After all, now no cis men can enter female only spaces by pretending to be transmen. Which was apparently concerning to people.

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Transmen are biological women. I would have thought the court giving an answer to that would be a good thing. After all, now no cis men can enter female only spaces by pretending to be transmen. Which was apparently concerning to people.

Yes, that's great. Fantastic news. And it's great news that Trans Men get to use the male facilities. It's what I was advocating for the whole time.

I just find it so interesting that your whole argument has been biological women shouldn't be sharing spaces with biological men, and yet you're okay with trans men using the male facilities... am I on glue, or is that not also biological women and biological men sharing a space?

Can you explain something for me as to why one is okay and the other isn't?

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by BBXX

Yes, that's great. Fantastic news. And it's great news that Trans Men get to use the male facilities. It's what I was advocating for the whole time.

I just find it so interesting that your whole argument has been biological women shouldn't be sharing spaces with biological men, and yet you're okay with trans men using the male facilities... am I on glue, or is that not also biological women and biological men sharing a space?

Can you explain something for me as to why one is okay and the other isn't?

Because women need space away from male people in certain circumstances. Due to (some) mens treatment of women and just..privacy reasons. If men are concerned about single sex spaces then they can lobby and such

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Because women need space away from male people in certain circumstances. Due to (some) mens treatment of women and just..privacy reasons. If men are concerned about single sex spaces then they can lobby and such

What about the trans men, who you call females and biological women? You seem happy for them to share spaces with biological men? I thought women needed space away from men? I'm confused.

[Vicky.]

Originally Posted by BBXX

What about the trans men, who you call females and biological women? You seem happy for them to share spaces with biological men? I thought women needed space away from men? I'm confused.

I do not care if transmen want to use male spaces. That's up to them and the males.

[Vicky.]

Also men are not as much in need of single sex spaces. If they are then I guess it's up to them to complain and such.

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Vicky.

Also men are not as much in need of single sex spaces. If they are then I guess it's up to them to complain and such.

It's not really about men being unsafe. It's about sending trans women into male spaces for men to kick the **** in to them, to be blunt.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by BBXX

It's not really about men being unsafe. It's about sending trans women into male spaces for men to kick the **** in to them, to be blunt.

Have you evidence of that happening since the ruling?

[BBXX]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Have you evidence of that happening since the ruling?

I haven't looked, but you cannot ignore the fact trans women are 4x more likely to be a victim of violence than cis gender people. Do you really honestly think a trans woman is safer in the male changing rooms than the female ones? Are cis women really that violent?