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Swan · 20-01-2023, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

I'm just going to controversially come right out with this one...

Gay men are losing the allyship of women (which they've mostly had since the dawn of civil rights), because when it came to the crunch they showed absolutely no indication of being willing to return the favour or even to listen uncritically with compassion.

Lots of generalisation there but it is what it is. Gay men currently asking "why aren't cis women standing up for us" is an absolutely ludicrous question to ask.

I thought a lot of lesbian movements were starting to turn against gay men? But what do i know?!

Oliver_W · 20-01-2023, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

I'm just going to controversially come right out with this one...

Gay men are losing the allyship of women (which they've mostly had since the dawn of civil rights), because when it came to the crunch they showed absolutely no indication of being willing to return the favour or even to listen uncritically with compassion.

Lots of generalisation there but it is what it is. Gay men currently asking "why aren't cis women standing up for us" is an absolutely ludicrous question to ask.

Owen Jones' recent anti-woman rant pretty much encapsulates the things gay men have to continue to say in order to completely lose (actual) feminists' support ...

Glenn. · 19-01-2023, 12:14 PM

I loathe religion

bots · 19-01-2023, 12:16 PM

half the priests in the CoE are gay. This is all about money. The african (and maybe south american?) branches are anti gay and they are the branches of the church that are growing and therefore earning the cash and have the feet on the ground. If memory serves me right, i think the USA branch of the CoE is anti gay marriage too

Crimson Dynamo · 19-01-2023, 12:51 PM

Spoiler:

arista · 19-01-2023, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

Spoiler:

Yes Very True LT

Livia · 19-01-2023, 02:44 PM

Leave the Church of England alone! If you want to make them accept gay marriage you're also going to make to make the Muslims, the Catholics and the Jews and it will not happen.

Nicky91 · 19-01-2023, 04:44 PM

no gay marriages, or else what?

those stupid elderly in church of england getting triggered

Parmy · 19-01-2023, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicky91

no gay marriages, or else what?

those stupid elderly in church of england getting triggered

God will reincarnate you as a female American marine ribbon worm when you die.

arista · 19-01-2023, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parmnion

God will reincarnate you as a female American marine ribbon worm when you die.

How nice for Nicky

arista · 20-01-2023, 03:35 PM

Yes LT

Justin Welby
Archbishop will not give new prayer blessing for gay couples

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64342940

Liam- · 20-01-2023, 04:00 PM

A lot of generalisations there, a long way of saying some women are happy for bigotry to occur because a minority of gay men have problems with women, not exactly a shining endorsement of women is it

Swan · 20-01-2023, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liam-

A lot of generalisations there, a long way of saying some women are happy for bigotry to occur because a minority of gay men have problems with women, not exactly a shining endorsement of women is it

Women aren't exactly the enemy of gay men. All over the world, the religion heads, all of the laws against gay marriage, and homosexuality as a whole are created, enforced and dictated by men.

user104658 · 20-01-2023, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liam-

A lot of generalisations there, a long way of saying some women are happy for bigotry to occur because a minority of gay men have problems with women, not exactly a shining endorsement of women is it

It is a generalisation but this is a realm of generalisations; it's likewise unfair for gay men to have a problem with all women who have concerns about women's rights relating to trans issues because of a minority of those women who are genuinely hateful - who I don't think anyone can reasonably pretend don't exist.

But it's 2023 and here we are. Allyship isn't about individual relationships and whether or not people on an individual level like each other... it's about going to bat for that team, and if it isn't there (in general), it isn't going to be reciprocated (in general).

It's not out of anything more exciting than apathy.

I'm not even saying that gay men had to go to war for women when they had concern, but the right answer to "We have some concerns about this..." wasn't "Tough **** TERF!" and that's what (in general) came back. Or silence. So the result is silence.

I don't think it's a good thing I think it's utterly tragic, and the winners in the end are going to be the big ol' puffy faced blokes, as usual.

Cherie · 20-01-2023, 04:30 PM

What I never understand about the original issue leaving aside the issue of gay clergy people is if a gay couple are in the faith they would understand the teachings and accept it, and if they are not why would they want to be married in the Church

its like me wanting to get married in a Synagogue even though I am not part of that faith....there are so many places people can get married why do they get so hung up about getting married in a Church ....mind boggling

user104658 · 20-01-2023, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherie

What I never understand about the original issue leaving aside the issue of gay clergy people is if a gay couple are in the faith they would understand the teachings and accept it, and if they are not why would they want to be married in the Church

its like me wanting to get married in a Synagogue even though I am not part of that faith....there are so many places people can get married why do they get so hung up about getting married in a Church ....mind boggling

I would say that I don't understand any gay person who has read any of the bible choosing to be a Christian ... but it's a bit of a moot point because I don't understand any person who has read any of the bible choosing to be a Christian

.

Or really just any person with common sense choosing to be anything other than atheist-agnostic but that's a whole other debate

.

Cherie · 20-01-2023, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soldier Boy

I would say that I don't understand any gay person who has read any of the bible choosing to be a Christian ... but it's a bit of a moot point because I don't understand any person who has read any of the bible choosing to be a Christian

.

Or really just any person with common sense choosing to be anything other than atheist-agnostic but that's a whole other debate

.

Well I would consider myself a Christian but just for the nice bits...not been to Mass in years

GoldHeart · 20-01-2023, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherie

What I never understand about the original issue leaving aside the issue of gay clergy people is if a gay couple are in the faith they would understand the teachings and accept it, and if they are not why would they want to be married in the Church

its like me wanting to get married in a Synagogue even though I am not part of that faith....there are so many places people can get married why do they get so hung up about getting married in a Church ....mind boggling

This is what I don't understand either ,why would you want to get married in a place that doesn't want to marry you. Why force it especially when they know the religion is against it ??.

Exactly there's so many different places to get married now .

Cherie · 20-01-2023, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldHeart

This is what I don't understand either ,why would you want to get married in a place that doesn't want to marry you. Why force it especially when they know the religion is against it ??.

Exactly there's so many different places to get married now .

No idea ....its just bizarre to me, a wedding day is so special why would you want to mar it by getting married in a place that will never accept your union ...