[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Well exactly, it's not "normal" and its not just because he's used to it and won't stop, things change as children approach adolescence and it would be normal for them to naturally start to want privacy.

The fact that he hasn't, and especially the wetting + aggression, suggests there's a much deeper issue with this boy than the simple fact that he has been bedsharing. It sounds like he has a serious fear of sleeping alone - and a fear like that isn't borne from "never having slept alone", its much more likely that he HAS slept alone and whilst doing so something has happened that's been traumatic and triggered this fear.

Like any fear really. Most people who are scared of flying for example, it's not because they've never flown. It's because one of the first times they did fly, something happened that terrified them (bad turbulence, scary crosswinds on landing etc).

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Toy Soldier,I keep saying this but your posts are really incredible.

I agree there seems like there must some likely serious issues with this 13 year old that as you say has them in no way wanting to sleep on their own.
We haven't got the full story behind this and that is why I would not say it is wrong.

You make a great point as to the flying too, I have a Cousin who will not fly because there was some engine trouble when she flew as a teenager,she has never and has stated she will nver, set foot in a plane again.
To gte her home after the flight that scared her, My Aunt and Uncle had to travel overland and bring her back on Eurostar.

Like I said, if a young child is scared alone and you just force them to sleep alone anyway, that's not going to solve anything, it's going to make it into a bigger and longer lasting issue.

The last part quoted separately above this comment of your post makes another really understanding and very strong point too.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Well exactly, it's not "normal" and its not just because he's used to it and won't stop, things change as children approach adolescence and it would be normal for them to naturally start to want privacy.

The fact that he hasn't, and especially the wetting + aggression, suggests there's a much deeper issue with this boy than the simple fact that he has been bedsharing. It sounds like he has a serious fear of sleeping alone - and a fear like that isn't borne from "never having slept alone", its much more likely that he HAS slept alone and whilst doing so something has happened that's been traumatic and triggered this fear.

Like any fear really. Most people who are scared of flying for example, it's not because they've never flown. It's because one of the first times they did fly, something happened that terrified them (bad turbulence, scary crosswinds on landing etc).

Like I said, if a young child is scared alone and you just force them to sleep alone anyway, that's not going to solve anything, it's going to make it into a bigger and longer lasting issue.

...hmmm, I'm not sure whether there would have definitely been an 'incident' involved, obviously it's a possibility but it's also perfectly 'normal' for children to have fears of the dark/night time etc...'imaginary monsters'...?...but as they sleep in their beds, over time they start to realise that they're safe and those 'monsters' in their heads gradually disappear...if they never have had to sleep alone, then they haven't experienced that security of knowing they're safe other than the feeling that it's their parent/mum's presence that is keeping them safe..?..and as they get older and into adolescence, which is a very confusing time anyway, those fears could just increase so it's hard to dispel the 'monster', and that I think could well lead to real anxiety issues in their lives....

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Ammi

...hmmm, I'm not sure whether there would have definitely been an 'incident' involved, obviously it's a possibility but it's also perfectly 'normal' for children to have fears of the dark/night time etc...'imaginary monsters'...?...but as they sleep in their beds, over time they start to realise that they're safe and those 'monsters' in their heads gradually disappear...if they never have had to sleep alone, then they haven't experienced that security of knowing they're safe other than the feeling that it's their parent/mum's presence that is keeping them safe..?..and as they get older and into adolescence, which is a very confusing time anyway, those fears could just increase so it's hard to dispel the 'monster', and that I think could well lead to real anxiety issues in their lives....

It's easy to make that assumption but the opposite is usually the case - if a child is really, truly scared of monsters at night and his parents continue to put him back into that situation while he's anxious, it becomes a bigger and more serious problem. "Face your fear" doesn't really apply to young children, you have to be very careful as a minor fear can escalate into an ongoing phobia at these developmental stages. Phobias are linked to anxiety and adrenaline responses, in other words, they form when you are afraid, especially when that fear isn't quickly soothed. A serious fear of the dark / fear of being alone is very unlikely to arise from "never having to deal with it", it arises from being told to go back to bed to deal with it... being forced to "learn how to handle it alone".

Children who aren't denied emotional dependancy at a young age generally grow up to become more independent and emotionally secure than those who are "tiger parented" into stoicism. It's counter-intuitive, but it's just a fact of developmental psychology.

Forcing it encourages children to learn how to shut down or swallow emotions and fears - not how to understand them and deal with them rationally.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

It's easy to make that assumption but the opposite is usually the case - if a child is really, truly scared of monsters at night and his parents continue to put him back into that situation while he's anxious, it becomes a bigger and more serious problem. "Face your fear" doesn't really apply to young children, you have to be very careful as a minor fear can escalate into an ongoing phobia at these developmental stages. Phobias are linked to anxiety and adrenaline responses, in other words, they form when you are afraid, especially when that fear isn't quickly soothed. A serious fear of the dark / fear of being alone is very unlikely to arise from "never having to deal with it", it arises from being told to go back to bed to deal with it... being forced to "learn how to handle it alone".

Children who aren't denied emotional dependancy at a young age generally grow up to become more independent and emotionally secure than those who are "tiger parented" into stoicism. It's counter-intuitive, but it's just a fact of developmental psychology.

Forcing it encourages children to learn how to shut down or swallow emotions and fears - not how to understand them and deal with them rationally.

..no, I agree..'forcing' someone to face their fears and especially children can be very counterproductive but that's not what I meant..sorry if I didn't explain it properly... but usually and what is considered the 'norm' is for much younger children than adolescents to have time to realise that their fears and 'monsters' are imaginary and they can only do that by at some point sleeping on their own and realising that they're completely safe and that's with the guidance of their parents and dependant on the child as well as to how long it takes, it's a gradual process which could be reasonably quick or could take a long time...but if it's left until adolescence then it's going to be a lot harder and could create other anxiety issues as well...but I don't necessarily think there has been an 'incident' which may have caused fears...it is a possibility of course but with my own personal experience...'associations' if it was an association can be a lot more complicated and it might not be directly something that is associated to sleep or night time at all....