Originally Posted by kazanne

IMO,it was Labour that brought this country to its knees,now it has to be propped up again and it will be hard ,but it HAS to be done,no one likes it but as they say you have to be cruel to be kind.

How are Labour to blame for the current financial crisis? It is a worldwide financial meltdown.

You can't cut your way out of a recession, you have to spend money on infrastructure so that people are back to work and have money in their pockets again, which they in turn pass on to businesses.

Thatcher destroyed industry in this country, and wiped towns off the map. Her own cabinet were even telling her to forget about the north. Imagine that.

[Kizzy]

a tory invention...outsourcing, everything we used to produce steel, coal, textiles blah blah is now imported. thats why we have no work and the cost of importing all the stuff we need is astronomical, all so fatcats can save money on labour, put the industry abroad and pay them peanuts...but us northerners wont be marching to london from jarrow this time, will be marching to the DSS for a crisis loan.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by kazanne

IMO,it was Labour that brought this country to its knees,now it has to be propped up again and it will be hard ,but it HAS to be done,no one likes it but as they say you have to be cruel to be kind.

The Conservatives need to get rid of David Cameron if they want any improvments for this country I think.

Is she dead, yet?

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by jedward fever

The Conservatives need to get rid of David Cameron if they want any improvments for this country I think.

And replace him with who, Osborne? I'm no Conservative but he's actually done a very good job as a leader, even in the situation we're in now with all the recent troubles most people would still far rather place their trust in him than Miliband

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by MTVN

And replace him with who, Osborne? I'm no Conservative but he's actually done a very good job as a leader, even in the situation we're in now with all the recent troubles most people would still far rather place their trust in him than Miliband

I would take Gordon Brown again than keep David Cameron as leader as his just a Labour man really with the way his running the country at the moment.

Also what made my mind up about David Cameron was when The Riots happened and it took him almost a week just to come close to sorting the situation out,when any other leader would have sorted it all out within 2 or 3 days.

Also don't forget the comment about go and hug a huddy when his was running for Prime Minister.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

Is she dead, yet?

No.



The Queen Is also Older And Alive

Originally Posted by arista

No.



The Queen Is also Older And Alive

How about now?

[arista]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

How about now?

No Alive and Well.

[Scarlett.]

I don't like the Tories, never have, but David Cameron is probably the only person in the political world at the moment who seems to have any idea how to run a country? I mean could you really see Milliband being a decent PM?

[arista]

Originally Posted by Chewy

I don't like the Tories, never have, but David Cameron is probably the only person in the political world at the moment who seems to have any idea how to run a country? I mean could you really see Milliband being a decent PM?

True


Very Valid Point

Originally Posted by Chewy

I don't like the Tories, never have, but David Cameron is probably the only person in the political world at the moment who seems to have any idea how to run a country? I mean could you really see Milliband being a decent PM?

David Cameron is ideologically opposed to the needs of most of the people in the country. This Eaton educated, multi-millionaire is cutting services to the most needy in society. He's cutting the safety nets away from the poor whilst not one banker has been prosecuted for their financial crimes.

Just because the leader of the opposition is not a good politician, it doesn't mean that our standards have to drop to their level.

Politicians need to improve to our level, and not we sink to theirs.

[Livia]

Multi-millionaire Tony Blair went to Fettes in Edinburgh, don't see anyone on the left kicking up a fuss about that. In fact, more than half of Labour Party MPs have been privately educated. But if a Tory is privately education it's a stick with which to beat them, supposedly.

The financial mess was in full flow long before the Conservatives came to power. No bankers have been prosecuted by the Conservative Party in much the same way that no bankers were prosecuted under Labour. The Fred Goodwin/RBS scandal happened under Labour. They didn't even ask him for his knighthood back, so how anyone would imagine that bankers should be prosecuted now the Conservatives are in charge smacks slightly of double-standards.

Originally Posted by Livia

Multi-millionaire Tony Blair went to Fettes in Edinburgh, don't see anyone on the left kicking up a fuss about that. In fact, more than half of Labour Party MPs have been privately educated. But if a Tory is privately education it's a stick with which to beat them, supposedly.

The financial mess was in full flow long before the Conservatives came to power. No bankers have been prosecuted by the Conservative Party in much the same way that no bankers were prosecuted under Labour. The Fred Goodwin/RBS scandal happened under Labour. They didn't even ask him for his knighthood back, so how anyone would imagine that bankers should be prosecuted now the Conservatives are in charge smacks slightly of double-standards.

If I was defending Labour and Blair you'd have made some decent points. But I didn't. I am way to the left of the centre-right Labour party. There is a plague on both their houses as far as I'm concerned. It's just that the current ruling party (Forget about the LD's), is waging a war on the poor and most needy, whilst protecting their friends. Labour would have done the same but to a lesser extent. They certainly wouldn't have demonised people on benefits, though, the way the tories have.

I say this as someone who was fairly privileged growing up myself. Although not on the same level as Boris, David and the rest of the Bulingdon Club.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

If I was defending Labour and Blair you'd have made some decent points. But I didn't. I am way to the left of the centre-right Labour party. There is a plague on both their houses as far as I'm concerned. It's just that the current ruling party (Forget about the LD's), is waging a war on the poor and most needy, whilst protecting their friends. Labour would have done the same but to a lesser extent. They certainly wouldn't have demonised people on benefits, though, the way the tories have.

I say this as someone who was fairly privileged growing up myself. Although not on the same level as Boris, David and the rest of the Bulingdon Club.

My points about the current Labour Party were valid, regardless of your own particular point of view. But, as you say, there there is no 'left' in British politics now. One politician I really admire both as a politician and as a human being is Tony Benn, although I don't always agree with him. Born to a privileged life but a real left-winger. I wonder what the Labour Party might be like if they had more politicians like him instead of the insipid champagne socialists who run it now.

I agree somewhat with the benefits point you raise, however, we both know that there are people claiming benefits to which they are not really entitled, or because they are better off on benefits than they would be if they were working. How do you flag up those people if not by reforming the way benefits are allocated? Labour does not generally reform benefits because those people who receive them are (generally) traditionally their voters.

I say this as someone who, unlike you, does not come from a fairly privileged background. I come from one of the poorest (Labour) Boroughs in east London. I worked hard for my degree while working to support myself. Nobody ever handed me a damn thing. Yet I grew up surrounded by people who live their life on benefits, housed by the council, who had their values and work-ethic handed down to them by parents who had lived the same lifestyle.

[Mystic Mock]

Am I the only that thinks that there isn't a normal right wing party to oppose Labour and Conservatives as both parties policies are more to the left now?

[Kizzy]

yes, i would go as far as to say the liberals under clegg are still reeling from his new views...It was during my degree (supported soley by student loan) that i found a love for sociology, and a realisation that some are predestined to fall into benefit traps. It also follows that a re-education is what is required not punishment. Some may be able to 'pull themselves up by the boot straps' others need a helping hand to ease out of the poverty trap... I did

[Tom4784]

She had her good points and her bad points, it'd be hard to be a PM in that time and not be despised. it's the same now as no matter who won the last election they would have been unpopular regardless just because unpopular decisions will have always had to be made due to the current climate.

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

She had her good points and her bad points, it'd be hard to be a PM in that time and not be despised. it's the same now, no matter who won the last election they would have been unpopular regardless just because unpopular decisions will have always had to be made due to the current climate.

Which is both the Tories and Labour's fault in the first place when paying millions off to currupt Governments like Zimbabwe,and joining America on two wars that was nothing to do with us.

[lostalex]

I agree with him. I love Meryl Streep, she's awesome. <3

Originally Posted by jedward fever

Am I the only that thinks that there isn't a normal right wing party to oppose Labour and Conservatives as both parties policies are more to the left now?

That's insane - the conservatives are going down the right wing policy faves of trying to privatise healthcare to the free market, demonising the poor, cutting benefits, anti-europe etc.

The problem is the lack of a left wing, not the lack of a right wing. Labour are a centre right party these days.

How much more to the right do you want to go? BNP?

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Jesus.H.Christ

That's insane - the conservatives are going down the right wing policy faves of trying to privatise healthcare to the free market, demonising the poor, cutting benefits, anti-europe etc.

The problem is the lack of a left wing, not the lack of a right wing. Labour are a centre right party these days.

How much more to the right do you want to go? BNP?

No I don't want the BNP,I actually want a sane right wing party not two left wing parties,I mean David Cameron is as far from right wing as any sane left wing person could go.

And Labour right wing? Labour are like the 2nd most left wing party after The Respect party.

Originally Posted by jedward fever

No I don't want the BNP,I actually want a sane right wing party not two left wing parties,I mean David Cameron is as far from right wing as any sane left wing person could go.

And Labour right wing? Labour are like the 2nd most left wing party after The Respect party.

Well you currently have an insane right wing party too busy implementing right wing policies (privatisation of healthcare/immigration/tough on the poor/benefits), whilst a centre-right opposition allows it to happen.

Just because parties are traditional left/right wing, they don't stay that way unless their actions back up their ideology. Cameron is very right wing, and Labour have moved to the right.

I am left wing, and there is no party advocating the implementation of left wing policies to get us out of this mess.

[Jack_]

I'm pretty sure most people consider Labour a centre right party nowadays, after Blair's reign with New Labour.

As far as I understand it, Labour are further right to the Conservatives than the Lib Dems are.

[Mystic Mock]

Tony Blair was a fake bastard,he ran Labour probably more right wing than all former PM's before him,but he was still very,very left wing like with the prison sentences being shorter and excusing criminals for everything.