[rubymoo]

I've noticed in the popular group that most of the members are either controlling or compliant:

Helen - controlling
Steven - controlling
Kimberly - compliant (could be manipulation)
Ash - compliant (could be manipulation)

Kimberly and Ash are compliant that they fall into line with the controllers, the compliant are at an advantage of manipulating though as the compliant give the controllers what they need, an example is Stevens retorical questions to Kim, he asks questions that he already knows the answer to and Kimberly knows what he wants to hear. Ash supports Helen telling her not to change, even though her behaviour in the beginning was terrible. The one thing i've seen is that the controllers are actually more vulnerable than the compliant, the compliant could actually get into the final by coming off as passive or as the victim, an example is Kim coming across to the public as a down trodden woman who is being held almost hostage by Steven, when actually she is manipulating Steven knowing he's going to come across all sleeping with the enemy.

The unpopular group have all stood their ground with the controllers, and that's why they are disliked by them. The controllers know they can't control them, that's why Helen doesn't like Ashleigh because Ashleigh is competition, that's why Steven doesn't like little Chris because he is competition, both these controllers know that Ashleigh and Chris will make it to the final.

Sorry if i've waffled

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by rubymoo

I've noticed in the popular group that most of the members are either controlling or compliant:

Helen - controlling
Steven - controlling
Kimberly - compliant (could be manipulation)
Ash - compliant (could be manipulation)

Kimberly and Ash are compliant that they fall into line with the controllers, the compliant are at an advantage of manipulating though as the compliant give the controllers what they need, an example is Stevens retorical questions to Kim, he asks questions that he already knows the answer to and Kimberly knows what he wants to hear. Ash supports Helen telling her not to change, even though her behaviour in the beginning was terrible. The one thing i've seen is that the controllers are actually more vulnerable than the compliant, the compliant could actually get into the final by coming off as passive or as the victim, an example is Kim coming across to the public as a down trodden woman who is being held almost hostage by Steven, when actually she is manipulating Steven knowing he's going to come across all sleeping with the enemy.

The unpopular group have all stood their ground with the controllers, and that's why they are disliked by them. The controllers know they can't control them, that's why Helen doesn't like Ashleigh because Ashleigh is competition, that's why Steven doesn't like little Chris because he is competition, both these controllers know that Ashleigh and Chris will make it to the final.

Sorry if i've waffled

spot on

[Niamh.]

Interesting post, very plausible as well Lets just hope that we don't lose Ashleigh or Chris to the newbies

[Creggle]

Very well said.

[HBB1508]

Great post Rubymoo

[rubymoo]

Thank you

[Achilles]

Pauline was the fat controller from Thomas the Tank?

[jessicadanielle]

Really interesting post!

The Helen/Ashleigh Stephen/Chris rivalries are really telling about Helen and Stephen's vulnerability. They are a huge threat to the control they have, or strive to have. I imagine they don't come across people who refuse to allow them control very often in the real world, and will just dispose of them if they do.

The weird thing is... why is there no hostility between Ashleigh & Steven, and little hostility between Chris & Helen? Is it just a gender thing, competing for the alpha male/female role? (Sorry for bringing up alphas, the BOTS psychs mention it every bloody time they're on )

[Achilles]

I think that Helen is the pack leader and all the other animals must submit to her. If one of the animals doesn't submit they get brought in line or shunned from the pack. Helen is the active Lioness and Ash is the passive Lion. The Lion will get up if it feels the Lioness is vulnerable

[rubymoo]

Originally Posted by jessicadanielle

Really interesting post!

The Helen/Ashleigh Stephen/Chris rivalries are really telling about Helen and Stephen's vulnerability. They are a huge threat to the control they have, or strive to have. I imagine they don't come across people who refuse to allow them control very often in the real world, and will just dispose of them if they do.

The weird thing is... why is there no hostility between Ashleigh & Steven, and little hostility between Chris & Helen? Is it just a gender thing, competing for the alpha male/female role? (Sorry for bringing up alphas, the BOTS psychs mention it every bloody time they're on )

Definitely a gender thing!

[rubymoo]

Originally Posted by Achilles

I think that Helen is the pack leader and all the other animals must submit to her. If one of the animals doesn't submit they get brought in line or shunned from the pack. Helen is the active Lioness and Ash is the passive Lion. The Lion will get up if it feels the Lioness is vulnerable

It's like watching a nature programme isn't it!

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by rubymoo

It's like watching a nature programme isn't it!

mmm I guess when you get down to it we're all just animals in the end

[Mick]

Hi rubymoo just read your OP and don't think you have waffled at all.Very interesting observations.RE Steven certainly controlling with Kim but also compliant when it suits with the other two.?

Just out of interest what are your views on any of the newbies if accepted into this group.?

[Achilles]

Originally Posted by rubymoo

It's like watching a nature programme isn't it!

It's mating season for Biannca, she went straight to Winston and raised her bum to him, but he didn't take her up on the offer as he wanted to wait until she was accepted into the pack first

[rionablue]

Originally Posted by rubymoo

I've noticed in the popular group that most of the members are either controlling or compliant:

Helen - controlling
Steven - controlling
Kimberly - compliant (could be manipulation)
Ash - compliant (could be manipulation)

Kimberly and Ash are compliant that they fall into line with the controllers, the compliant are at an advantage of manipulating though as the compliant give the controllers what they need, an example is Stevens retorical questions to Kim, he asks questions that he already knows the answer to and Kimberly knows what he wants to hear. Ash supports Helen telling her not to change, even though her behaviour in the beginning was terrible. The one thing i've seen is that the controllers are actually more vulnerable than the compliant, the compliant could actually get into the final by coming off as passive or as the victim, an example is Kim coming across to the public as a down trodden woman who is being held almost hostage by Steven, when actually she is manipulating Steven knowing he's going to come across all sleeping with the enemy.

The unpopular group have all stood their ground with the controllers, and that's why they are disliked by them. The controllers know they can't control them, that's why Helen doesn't like Ashleigh because Ashleigh is competition, that's why Steven doesn't like little Chris because he is competition, both these controllers know that Ashleigh and Chris will make it to the final.

Sorry if i've waffled

There is some truth in your post and its well laid out so well done to that. But Kim doesn't come across as a down trodden woman who is being held hostage by Steven. He has been playing mind games with her and making her cut up her pictures but she hasn't been spending every minute of every day with him and if she didn't like him she would tell him sod off. She obviously does like him which in my opinion is hugely disappointing as she is my favourite and he is my least favourite. I do hope he is evicted to give her a bit of breathing space

Good post though

[rubymoo]

Originally Posted by Mick

Hi rubymoo just read your OP and don't think you have waffled at all.Very interesting observations.RE Steven certainly controlling with Kim but also compliant when it suits with the other two.?

Just out of interest what are your views on any of the newbies if accepted into this group.?

Bianca will get on well in the popular group, but Helen is top dog so her group will back her as she's been leader from the start, Biannca comes across as a good time girl and Helen won't see her as a threat.

Zoe is the diplomatic one and i feel she will come across as compassionate and caring, she won't allow others to be bullied whilst she's around, Chris is similar to Zoe, but he hasn't got her status (she has a claim to fame), so he tends to go to the diary room and say what we're all thinking, that's why we all like him. Zoe will possibly be a floater/guidance counsellor.

Pav may well be voted out Friday, he seems a nice enough bloke, but coming in halfway through and being a sensible type won't appeal to alot of viewers.

These are just my opinions.

[rubymoo]

Originally Posted by rionablue

There is some truth in your post and its well laid out so well done to that. But Kim doesn't come across as a down trodden woman who is being held hostage by Steven. He has been playing mind games with her and making her cut up her pictures but she hasn't been spending every minute of every day with him and if she didn't like him she would tell him sod off. She obviously does like him which in my opinion is hugely disappointing as she is my favourite and he is my least favourite. I do hope he is evicted to give her a bit of breathing space

Good post though

Steven asks her questions like 'do you love me?' He knows she's going to say yes, 'would you make me sign a pre-nup?' He knows she's going to say no, he asks questions where he knows what her answer will be, because he's intense and apparently charming/charismatic (this is what Judy James said), he's turned her into compliant mode, she may well be completely different on the outside, as for the photos, she must have felt some sort of guilt that she was betraying him, and when Helen backed him up it confirmed to her that she was the one being unreasonable, as Stephen and Helen are the group leaders and to have them tell her it was wrong she proceeded to cut up the photos as she didn't want to upset her leaders.

It would be nice if Steven left, she might get some perspective!