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Old 09-11-2019, 10:38 AM   #1
Oliver_W
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Default Do we need a different term for "Far Right" extremists?

I'm largely indifferent when it comes to politics but on most things I either don't care or lean right, and I have nothing in common with the extremists who are increasingly making a nuisance of themselves.
Nor do any prominent right wing politicians, who are closer to being neoliberalists than anything else. Most are either pro-gay or don't take an active position. Most are for limited immigration. None support the acts of terror carried out by right wing extremists.

I've noticed that feathers get ruffled around here when such extremists are referred to as right wing, and I can see why. Maybe it'd be more productive if they were just labelled as neo-nazis, as absolutely no-one with a brainstem identifies with them, and fascism doesn't fit easily into the left-to-right scale as it contains elements of both extremes, sitting on top of the horseshoe.
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:02 PM   #2
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Neo Nazi's is Fine
for Extreme Far Right Wingers
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:27 PM   #3
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I think it would be bloody hilarious if we stop referring to the extreme right wing as "far right" because it hurts the feelyfeels of your average Joe Tory, whilst still happily referring to ISIS et all as "Islamic Extremists" when there are well over 1.5 billion peaceful Muslims in the world.

For YEARS there has been this rhetoric that the general Muslim community "must take ownership, must take responsibility" for their extreme fringes.

And yet the suggestion is that we should rebrand extreme right-wing attacks under a new name because its "not fair on the normal right wing folks"? Err no. The non-extreme right are often a huge part of bolstering and encouraging the actions of right wing extremists so I don't think a free pass to make them feel more comfortable is warranted in the slightest.
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:35 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Toy Soldier View Post
I think it would be bloody hilarious if we stop referring to the extreme right wing as "far right" because it hurts the feelyfeels of your average Joe Tory, whilst still happily referring to ISIS et all as "Islamic Extremists" when there are well over 1.5 billion peaceful Muslims in the world.

For YEARS there has been this rhetoric that the general Muslim community "must take ownership, must take responsibility" for their extreme fringes.

And yet the suggestion is that we should rebrand extreme right-wing attacks under a new name because its "not fair on the normal right wing folks"? Err no. The non-extreme right are often a huge part of bolstering and encouraging the actions of right wing extremists so I don't think a free pass to make them feel more comfortable is warranted in the slightest.
Islamic extremism is directly influenced by the Qur'an and Hadiths, and the acts are carried out due to the religion.

Racism has no place in politics, racist attacks are carried out because the perpetrator is racist, not because they are right wing.
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:48 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Oliver_W View Post
Islamic extremism is directly influenced by the Qur'an and Hadiths, and the acts are carried out due to the religion.

Racism has no place in politics, racist attacks are carried out because the perpetrator is racist, not because they are right wing.
Current right wing political rhetoric legitimises xenophobia and bolsters extremists by making them believe that "plenty of people are low-key on their side", which encourages them to act.

Far right incidents are on the rise. The individuals carrying out the actions were just as far right as they are now before the incidents began to rise. They are ACTING on their beliefs, because there is an impression that the public mindset is shifting towards one that "quietly" supports the underlying philosophies of those extreme actions.

Katie Hopkins and Nigel Farage aren't going to kill anyone but I absolutely guarantee that their words lead to killing.
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:49 PM   #6
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Whats wrong with fascists?...
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:51 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toy soldier View Post
i think it would be bloody hilarious if we stop referring to the extreme right wing as "far right" because it hurts the feelyfeels of your average joe tory, whilst still happily referring to isis et all as "islamic extremists" when there are well over 1.5 billion peaceful muslims in the world.

For years there has been this rhetoric that the general muslim community "must take ownership, must take responsibility" for their extreme fringes.

And yet the suggestion is that we should rebrand extreme right-wing attacks under a new name because its "not fair on the normal right wing folks"? Err no. The non-extreme right are often a huge part of bolstering and encouraging the actions of right wing extremists so i don't think a free pass to make them feel more comfortable is warranted in the slightest.
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:52 PM   #8
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Nazi fits just fine
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:53 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Toy Soldier View Post
Current right wing political rhetoric legitimises xenophobia and bolsters extremists by making them believe that "plenty of people are low-key on their side", which encourages them to act.

Far right incidents are on the rise. The individuals carrying out the actions were just as far right as they are now before the incidents began to rise. They are ACTING on their beliefs, because there is an impression that the public mindset is shifting towards one that "quietly" supports the underlying philosophies of those extreme actions.

Katie Hopkins and Nigel Farage aren't going to kill anyone but I absolutely guarantee that their words lead to killing.
The people who actually carry out the attacks likely don't have any political views apart from racism, so calling them "right wing" isn't valid.
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Whats wrong with fascists?...
Everything is wrong with them, they're scum!
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:53 PM   #10
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Nazi fits just fine
Agreed.
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:57 PM   #11
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Far right it is.

Far-right politics are politics further on the right of the left-right spectrum than the standard political right, particularly in terms of extreme nationalism,[1][2] nativist ideologies, and authoritarian tendencies,[3] all sustained by an organicist vision of the world.[4]

Used to describe the historical experiences of fascism and Nazism,[5] it today includes neo-fascism, neo-Nazism, Third Position, the alt-right,[6] and other ideologies or organizations that feature ultranationalist, chauvinist, xenophobic, racist, anti-communist, or reactionary views.[7] These can lead to oppression, violence, forced assimilation, ethnic cleansing, and even genocide against groups of people based on their supposed inferiority, or their perceived threat to the native ethnic group,[8][9] nation, state,[10] national religion, dominant culture or ultraconservative traditional social institutions.
[11]


The answer to this nonsensical proposition is no.

The rest of the world calls it far right and theres no reason for tibb to be different
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Old 09-11-2019, 01:00 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Oliver_W View Post
The people who actually carry out the attacks likely don't have any political views apart from racism, so calling them "right wing" isn't valid.

Everything is wrong with them, they're scum!
I meant as a term for the far right extremists obv lol
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Old 09-11-2019, 01:07 PM   #13
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Far Left, Far Right, two peas in a pod as far as I'm concerned
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Old 09-11-2019, 01:14 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Twosugars View Post
Far right it is.

Far-right politics are politics further on the right of the left-right spectrum than the standard political right, particularly in terms of extreme nationalism,[1][2] nativist ideologies, and authoritarian tendencies,[3] all sustained by an organicist vision of the world.[4]

Used to describe the historical experiences of fascism and Nazism,[5] it today includes neo-fascism, neo-Nazism, Third Position, the alt-right,[6] and other ideologies or organizations that feature ultranationalist, chauvinist, xenophobic, racist, anti-communist, or reactionary views.[7] These can lead to oppression, violence, forced assimilation, ethnic cleansing, and even genocide against groups of people based on their supposed inferiority, or their perceived threat to the native ethnic group,[8][9] nation, state,[10] national religion, dominant culture or ultraconservative traditional social institutions.
[11]


The answer to this nonsensical proposition is no.

The rest of the world calls it far right and theres no reason for tibb to be different
Xenophobia, racism, and chauvinism aren't exclusively right wing though.
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Old 09-11-2019, 01:42 PM   #15
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Quote:
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Far Left, Far Right, two peas in a pod as far as I'm concerned
I would LOVE to hear about some far left violence/ terrorism. Could you highlight some for me please?
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Old 09-11-2019, 02:04 PM   #16
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Quote:
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I would LOVE to hear about some far left violence/ terrorism. Could you highlight some for me please?
North Korea, China and Russia are such beacons of virtue
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Old 09-11-2019, 02:07 PM   #17
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I would LOVE to hear about some far left violence/ terrorism. Could you highlight some for me please?
would you open the link if I bothered to post it for you? anyway BOTs has done a fine job in responding
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Old 09-11-2019, 02:29 PM   #18
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Tibb rightwingers feel uncomfortable? So let's rewrite political sciences and the encyclopedia ?
I dont think so

Ollie, join a political sciences faculty somewhere and lead the terminology revolution. Then let us know how you get on.
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Old 09-11-2019, 02:57 PM   #19
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North Korea, China and Russia are such beacons of virtue
False equivalency, we're not talking about far right/left governments we're talking about manifestations of extreme ideologies in Western nations.

Does any extreme ideology have the POTENTIAL to manifest in violent activity? Sure. That doesn't mean that recent far-right attacks aren't far-right attacks, or that they should be rebranded as something else.
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Old 09-11-2019, 03:10 PM   #20
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North Korea, China and Russia are such beacons of virtue
There has never been anything left wing about North Korea, it's actually a theocracy. One swift look at all the miracles attributed to the 3 generations of Korean rulers will show that explicitly.

Russia was far left originally, but again, became more of a theocratic state under Stalin. It then went back to far left post Stalin, but the breakup of the old soviet union saw an oligarchy form.

China was perhaps the longest consistent far left experiment, but today they are pretty much a capitalist country with some older authoritarian ideas thrown in for good measure.
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Old 09-11-2019, 03:30 PM   #21
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I would LOVE to hear about some far left violence/ terrorism. Could you highlight some for me please?
The extremists who get called "right wing" have about as much in common with the mainstream left as they do the right. Which is why fascist or neo-nazi would fit them better.
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Old 09-11-2019, 03:42 PM   #22
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The extremists who get called "right wing" have about as much in common with the mainstream left as they do the right. Which is why fascist or neo-nazi would fit them better.
You've been a cheerleader for immigrants/refugees dying as they tried to find better lives for themselves. Others on this forum have blanket labelled ethnic groups arriving in this country as "trash", I'm guessing no one on this forum considers themselves far right, but if you're acting and using the same language as far right groups, then maybe some folks need to address their own attitudes.
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Old 09-11-2019, 03:45 PM   #23
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The extremists who get called "right wing" have about as much in common with the mainstream left as they do the right. Which is why fascist or neo-nazi would fit them better.
No it wouldn't. Not all far right are nazi
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Old 09-11-2019, 03:47 PM   #24
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You've been a cheerleader for immigrants/refugees dying as they tried to find better lives for themselves. Others on this forum have blanket labelled ethnic groups arriving in this country as "trash", I'm guessing no one on this forum considers themselves far right, but if you're acting and using the same language as far right groups, then maybe some folks need to address their own attitudes.
Well said.
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Old 09-11-2019, 03:50 PM   #25
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Quote:
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You've been a cheerleader for immigrants/refugees dying as they tried to find better lives for themselves. Others on this forum have blanket labelled ethnic groups arriving in this country as "trash", I'm guessing no one on this forum considers themselves far right, but if you're acting and using the same language as far right groups, then maybe some folks need to address their own attitudes.
Plenty of right wingers are all for open immigration, plenty of lefties are against it.
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