[ElProximo]

Originally Posted by Stu

Youtube video

-Mortality from drug related deaths in Europe [The Netherlands is amongst the lowest].
http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/stats07/drdtab05a

Keep in mind we are now talking about death. Some say death of heroin addicts is solving the problems.
I have a big problem with someone's daughter putting dirty cocks in her mouth so she can lay in a stupor in a piss-smelling alley.
But she isn't DYING from overdoses and so we have a success? Some would argue the pain and horrors are extended.

However, I have a problem with this 2005 survey right away. Netherlands 'among the lowest'. For death. People dying of overdoses.
Which might tell me they are very good at containing hardcore junkies and swiftly getting them to Emergency.
Which is what I did observe in Amsterdam. Authorities have very strict and well-organized expertise in containing junkies.
Goofy tourists who giggle about how a policeman SAW THEM smoking weed and let them go?
What the goofy tourist doesn't know is that the police are deliberately patrolling a perimeter meant to keep you (the goofy weed tourist) FROM entering a danger zone.
Behind that zone is where junkies are doing **** you don't need to know about. Also they would rob you blind.
Each morning a crew in 'hazmat' suits and long sticks arrives in the parks and pokes the bushes.
The dead junkies are obviously dead but any still alive are rushed to hospital.

So yes I do believe that stats reflect what I know about the place. They keep more junkies alive than most anywhere else.

It also tells me there is a massive police presence (which costs tax-payers) and my experience is just that.


But here is the other problem - a helluva lot of hard working Dutch people have to work harder, more days, more hours at their difficult jobs to keep maintaining that excellent ability to keep junkies from dying. So they can be junkies for another year (or until the next time they overdose)

Not that I'm doubting you're fond ability for arguing with logic and statistics but these numbers don't lie.

There are lies, damnable lies and then statistics.

The Netherlands have less heroin addicts and less overdoses than the USA,

It's interesting that they always want to use the USA as an example where certain inner-city neighbourhoods will skew a very high number.

and probably the likes of Canada and Ireland.

I'd suggest that Vancouver has the highest number of heroin addicts and overdoses than any other place in Canada per capita. I've seen more in Toronto but its also a much bigger city.

Not only has their Cannabis policy been highly effective in pacifying their youth with amongst the lowest useage rates in Europe but the safe access to Heroin has been lauded by other member states and copied. And lord knows how much good that taxed dope has done for the country.

I don't know what kind of gimmick statistics are being used to inform this idea that something is pacifying youth to low usage rates. Amsterdam is swarming with stoned youth. I might guess your discounting foreigners or using averages where farmlands and smaller cities are lowering numbers in easy-access areas?

Safe access to heroin is NOT 'lauded' by other EU nations and there has been NON-STOP **** over this situation for many many decades. It's been a major piss-off problem in the EU for a long time and causes all kinds of problems at the borders (drug smuggling etc)

and no, weed does NOT produce tax-revenue good. It costs the Dutch plenty to administer and then the massive police presence in the weed shop areas.
For some reason pro-drug people think weed is a great way to give the government lots of money. it doesn't.

If you look anywhere you will find Heroin addicts injecting themselves in poverty. We have an area for that here in Cork just like you do in Vancouver. Just like they do in Amsterdam in certain concentrated areas. I'm well aware of the problems specifically in Downtown Eastside in Vancouver and to blame that on a liberal dope policy is absurd and without merit. Those people didn't decide to become hooked on Crack because you can get pot easily.

Everyone who starts doing crack or heroin becomes poor. Then they get to hand out in the many charities, food banks, homeless shelters which allows them to steal and rob and scam and ***** full-time to earn enough for more drugs.
They all started doing weed. They loved getting high. then started doing more intense drugs.

Have you ever actually been to Amsterdam?

Yes. Twice. 2 times too many.

It's beautiful. Certain parks are dodgy which you can avoid. The Red Light district is a hotbed of all the things that probably make your winkie shrivel up in regret. But by and large it's a fantastic city and if you think it's a picture of depravity you must not have made it far beyond central station.

It's a ****hole. It is swarming with dirty panhandling hippies, druggies, criminals, *****s, users, scam artists. Not so many where Muslims run neighbourhoods but then there you get the honour-killings.
The only nice places are when you get as far away from the cannibas cafes and heroin-treatment centres.

If you want to see one of the most potent arguments in favour of the relaxing of archaic drug laws then Google yourself 'drug decriminalization in Portugal' though. Spend a few hours having fun and getting educated.

Dirty freeloading hippies.

Ya there is nothing like drug decriminalization websites online. They seem to be written by the same kind who make '911 Truther' websites and have mastered the pick-n-choose.
IF they can find some statistics to play with in Portugal they demand this become 'THE FACT' (as they interpret it),
yet,
will never so much as mention opium was, for all intents and purposes, made 'legal' in China and there was nothing short of a national tragedy devastating that country as millions became dying zombies.
Then,
When ALL drugs were banned and opium fiends executed the problem ends. That's why you can get shot for selling marijuana in China and why I don't have to put up with pot-heads, crackheads or any junkies anywhere in China.
They don't mention weed is zero-tolerance illegal in Japan and they have very few junkies.
They ignore a dozen examples where 'therapy' methods did nothing and crime, blackmarket, overdoses just carry on or increase.