[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

And not one of you who believes he is a child molester has commented on any of the videos some of us posted giving details ,interviews etc about his innocence ,that in itself tell me what I need to know,people are afraid they might hear or see something that they would have to admit is dodgy and they really don't want to explain that. Joey said they would get ignored, and he was right

That they don't want to watch the video?

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

That they don't want to watch the video?

Of course they don't ,wonder why.

[Cherie]

Marlon says the family – and a team of attorneys, who put Robson on the stand to defend Jackson in 2005 – has been through all of this before. The surviving Jackson brothers don't know Safechuck, they say, but Taj did, and he calls Robson’s changed narrative the “ultimate betrayal.”

Family members have their own opinions about why Robson’s story has changed. The choreographer was grateful for an invitation to Jackson’s memorial – he attended with his family, Taj says – and danced “right behind” Janet Jackson for a tribute at MTV's Video Music Awards. He even “wanted to get close to MJ’s kids” in 2009, Taj says.


From left, Wade Robson, director Dan Reed and James Safechuck pose for a portrait to promote the film "Leaving Neverland." The Michael Jackson estate has sent a letter to the U.K.’s Channel 4 warning that the documentary on Robson and Safechuck, who accuse the singer of molesting them as boys, violates the network's programming guidelines.
Taylor Jewell/Invision/AP
But things soured, the family says. They say that when Robson was passed over to direct and choreograph Cirque du Soleil's "One" show spotlighting Michael in Las Vegas, his financial troubles began. That’s when they say Robson began selling off his Jackson memorabilia and pitching a book with allegations against the pop star before suing the family in 2013.

“It’s never been about justice for him," Taj says. "It’s always been about fame and money.”

The accusers' lawyer, Vince Finaldi, scoffs at the suggested timeline: "It's just another example of the Jackson press machine manipulating facts and telling half-truths in order to try and discredit a victim," he says.

Finaldi says Robson was hired to choreograph the "One" show but suffered a nervous breakdown and dropped out.

As described in "Leaving Neverland," "after the birth of his son, he started having visions of his son being abused by Michael Jackson and reflecting on the abuse that he suffered, and realizing how bad that was from a different perspective," Finaldi says. Robson pulled away from the entertainment industry, which he found triggering. "Did he suffer financial stresses because of it? Absolutely. But he's never been fired from a job in his life."

But the documentary, with graphic descriptions of alleged sexual abuse, prompts direct questions:

Was Michael Jackson ever sexually abused as a child? The brothers shake their heads. “Never,” Jackie says.

In “Leaving Neverland,” it’s alleged that the pop star would spend five or six hours at a time on the phone with young children. Doesn’t his family find this odd?

No, they say. “He would talk to me and my brothers for hours and hours,” Taj says. “My uncle didn’t have a (traditional) childhood, so he lived vicariously through children. He’d say to me: 'You’re so lucky you had a birthday party. What was it like?'... He was constantly trying to reclaim his childhood, and I don’t think people understand that, because people didn’t live though Michael Jackson’s life."

Do they acknowledge that their brother’s behavior was, at the very least, eccentric when it came to spending time with children, including nights in his bed?

Marlon Jackson calls it all innocent. “Taj is the same age as all these kids they used to spend nights (with) all the time. A bunch of kids would come over and have pillow fights, (watch) “Three Stooges,” swim, all this stuff. Watching movies, they’re tired, they’d fall asleep.”

“(Marlon’s) children were there,” Jackie says. “My kids were there. Tito’s children were there.”

After accusations of sexual misconduct, did the brothers ever suggest Michael change his behavior with children, whose hands he often held in public?

“We didn’t really have to,” Jackie says. “Because I knew my brother and what his mission was all about, was helping children, helping people around the world.”

The family calls Jackson an easy target, made easier now because under the American legal system, it's not possible to sue, shame or slander a dead man. The brothers point to Michael Jackson’s search to reclaim his childhood, international charity work, and how he’d open up Neverland to nearby hospitals and schools while he was touring.

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/life/t...ey/3005672002/

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Marlon says the family – and a team of attorneys, who put Robson on the stand to defend Jackson in 2005 – has been through all of this before. The surviving Jackson brothers don't know Safechuck, they say, but Taj did, and he calls Robson’s changed narrative the “ultimate betrayal.”

Family members have their own opinions about why Robson’s story has changed. The choreographer was grateful for an invitation to Jackson’s memorial – he attended with his family, Taj says – and danced “right behind” Janet Jackson for a tribute at MTV's Video Music Awards. He even “wanted to get close to MJ’s kids” in 2009, Taj says.


From left, Wade Robson, director Dan Reed and James Safechuck pose for a portrait to promote the film "Leaving Neverland." The Michael Jackson estate has sent a letter to the U.K.’s Channel 4 warning that the documentary on Robson and Safechuck, who accuse the singer of molesting them as boys, violates the network's programming guidelines.
Taylor Jewell/Invision/AP
But things soured, the family says. They say that when Robson was passed over to direct and choreograph Cirque du Soleil's "One" show spotlighting Michael in Las Vegas, his financial troubles began. That’s when they say Robson began selling off his Jackson memorabilia and pitching a book with allegations against the pop star before suing the family in 2013.

“It’s never been about justice for him," Taj says. "It’s always been about fame and money.”

The accusers' lawyer, Vince Finaldi, scoffs at the suggested timeline: "It's just another example of the Jackson press machine manipulating facts and telling half-truths in order to try and discredit a victim," he says.

Finaldi says Robson was hired to choreograph the "One" show but suffered a nervous breakdown and dropped out.

As described in "Leaving Neverland," "after the birth of his son, he started having visions of his son being abused by Michael Jackson and reflecting on the abuse that he suffered, and realizing how bad that was from a different perspective," Finaldi says. Robson pulled away from the entertainment industry, which he found triggering. "Did he suffer financial stresses because of it? Absolutely. But he's never been fired from a job in his life."

But the documentary, with graphic descriptions of alleged sexual abuse, prompts direct questions:

Was Michael Jackson ever sexually abused as a child? The brothers shake their heads. “Never,” Jackie says.

In “Leaving Neverland,” it’s alleged that the pop star would spend five or six hours at a time on the phone with young children. Doesn’t his family find this odd?

No, they say. “He would talk to me and my brothers for hours and hours,” Taj says. “My uncle didn’t have a (traditional) childhood, so he lived vicariously through children. He’d say to me: 'You’re so lucky you had a birthday party. What was it like?'... He was constantly trying to reclaim his childhood, and I don’t think people understand that, because people didn’t live though Michael Jackson’s life."

Do they acknowledge that their brother’s behavior was, at the very least, eccentric when it came to spending time with children, including nights in his bed?

Marlon Jackson calls it all innocent. “Taj is the same age as all these kids they used to spend nights (with) all the time. A bunch of kids would come over and have pillow fights, (watch) “Three Stooges,” swim, all this stuff. Watching movies, they’re tired, they’d fall asleep.”

“(Marlon’s) children were there,” Jackie says. “My kids were there. Tito’s children were there.”

After accusations of sexual misconduct, did the brothers ever suggest Michael change his behavior with children, whose hands he often held in public?

“We didn’t really have to,” Jackie says. “Because I knew my brother and what his mission was all about, was helping children, helping people around the world.”

The family calls Jackson an easy target, made easier now because under the American legal system, it's not possible to sue, shame or slander a dead man. The brothers point to Michael Jackson’s search to reclaim his childhood, international charity work, and how he’d open up Neverland to nearby hospitals and schools while he was touring.

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/life/t...ey/3005672002/

I hope you've not copied and pasted this

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by chuff me dizzy

I hope you've not copied and pasted this

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by chuff me dizzy

I hope you've not copied and pasted this

She did link though, spot the difference

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

She did link though, spot the difference

Im joking

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

Of course they don't ,wonder why.

Because the last one posted was half an hour long

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Because the last one posted was half an hour long

Tbf though if we are to get a balanced view and we are willing to sit through 4 hours of accusations, we should at least watch some of the rebuttals, and I will Kazanne when I finish watching this one

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Tbf though if we are to get a balanced view and we are willing to sit through 4 hours of accusations, we should at least watch some of the rebuttals, and I will Kazanne when I finish watching this one

Yes but I don't think he's guilty because of that show, I've thought he was guilty for years because of how he behaves with young boys, stuff that no video can say is lies because it's right there in photos, videos and from MJs own mouth

[chuff me dizzy]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yes but I don't think he's guilty because of that show, I've thought he was guilty for years because of how he behaves with young boys, stuff that no video can say is lies because it's right there in photos, videos and from MJs own mouth

Me totally ^^^^

[bots]

Any information that comes out now is nothing more than navel gazing unless it's accompanied by hard evidence. Thats why I havent bothered watching the latest documentary. It's been produced by a producer with a specific agenda so it can't be considered investigative journalism. I've thought Jackson was dodgy for many, many years, and my opinion is not going to change.

Also, somewhat amusing, the BBC are saying that they are not banning his music, the original topic of the thread

[chuff me dizzy]

I haven't watched any videos defending MJ as IMO he's indefensible ,and watching people in the videos making out he was a saint is too much for me, I have my opinion from MJ over many years and nothing can change my opinion of him ,as have his fans and no one should tell anyone else they are wrong for being in whichever camp they are in

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Because the last one posted was half an hour long

But you managed to watch a 4 hour one over 2 nights,surely if you were unbiased you would watch half an hour

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

But you managed to watch a 4 hour one over 2 nights,surely if you were unbiased you would watch half an hour

Yes an actual properly made documentary not some you tube ****e

[Kazanne]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yes an actual properly made documentary not some you tube ****e

So because it was on YouTube it's ****e, actual footage and interviews , yes I guess something made to look so sombre ,so cold and scripted would probably fit some peoples notions of him.How would you know anyway as you haven't seen them.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

So because it was on YouTube it's ****e, actual footage and interviews , yes I guess something made to look so sombre ,so cold and scripted would probably fit some peoples notions of him.How would you know anyway as you haven't seen them.

I've seen plenty of creepy footage of MJ over the years to base my opinion on thanks, I love how you think yours video is the only one that counts though

[joeysteele]

Originally Posted by Kazanne

So because it was on YouTube it's ****e, actual footage and interviews , yes I guess something made to look so sombre ,so cold and scripted would probably fit some peoples notions of him.How would you know anyway as you haven't seen them.

Anything, which does not contain analytical expansion or analysis of what is being claimed.
Therefore presented as you say in this weighted, non challenging way, as this programme was.

In my view, should be treated with sceptism.
What were they afraid of if questioned and challenged.

Whereas the videos you posted, which I knew would be poo pooed as I said.

They, as the court case and all other facts, contained in the video you posted, don't fit the agenda of those thinking and wanting MJ guilty and pilloried.

You were right before too, when you said MJ wanted to fight the Chandler issue publicly in court.

MJs lawyer was pressed on that in your video, where he clearly stated the settling of that was done without MJs approval, against his wishes.

It won't matter because the lawyer won't be believed either over these 2 in this programme.

MJ did fight all charges brought, all through.
Challenged all and won.
That says far more about these 2 now in my view.