[Sticks]

His rant seemed more aimed at certain organised religions and their command and control structures.

There are religious groupings that do not have hierarchical structures that he seems to be against.

[InOne]

You need to take Pat with a pinch of salt at times. He always makes good points, but his sarcastic manner is why he's so popular.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Scrooge

You need to take Pat with a pinch of salt at times. He always makes good points, but his sarcastic manner is why he's so popular.

Yes its all in the Points.


He is a Great Man.

[keithafc]

Im a believer in the universe, why is it if you die and there is an after life, does that mean its god? No it doesn't. It could be a perfectly natural thing which has just taken place. Perhaps we just live in a place in the universe which has it?

I don't care if there is an after life or if there isn't. Either way, it won't bother me.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by keithafc

Im a believer in the universe, why is it if you die and there is an after life, does that mean its god? No it doesn't. It could be a perfectly natural thing which has just taken place. Perhaps we just live in a place in the universe which has it?

I don't care if there is an after life or if there isn't. Either way, it won't bother me.

That's assuming you know what "God" (if there is one) actually is.
The term "God" doesn't always mean the bearded man sitting on a cloud.

Also, it's funny after reading that "Forum Trolls and Bullies" thing someone posted yesterday it seems to be describing Arista perfectly. Deliberately trying to wind people up with the thread. Arista knows ****.

And amusing how these very vocal and patronising atheists are the ones that seem to need assurance that they are right from other atheists and constantly searching for someone to tell them "You're right, faith is wrong". If they were 100% correct and right in what they say they wouldn't need that. If you don't believe, you don't believe. Whereas a lot of religious people seem to just have their beliefs and keep it private.

[Stu]

Originally Posted by 08marsh

That's assuming you know what "God" (if there is one) actually is.
The term "God" doesn't always mean the bearded man sitting on a cloud.

Also, it's funny after reading that "Forum Trolls and Bullies" thing someone posted yesterday it seems to be describing Arista perfectly. Deliberately trying to wind people up with the thread. Arista knows ****.

And amusing how these very vocal and patronising atheists are the ones that seem to need assurance that they are right from other atheists and constantly searching for someone to tell them "You're right, faith is wrong". If they were 100% correct and right in what they say they wouldn't need that. If you don't believe, you don't believe. Whereas a lot of religious people seem to just have their beliefs and keep it private.

Oh give that tired old rhetoric a rest would you. Everything you said their could be applied to religious people too if I were into weak arse, wank assumptions. No matter how much I love or hate atheists that's just such a lazy argument from people of faith. Of course atheists are going to broadcast their stance on the issue, share information on the universe with other atheists and so on. Very few people are natural atheists considering most of us were reared with religion. Information had to convert them and they now share this information with others.

Are you saying because atheists don't believe that they should not be allowed debate with religious people? After all they know and have their own beliefs. Why don't they just shut up unlike the religious people. Yeah. Atheists should just shut the hell up. So should people in various other positions to give out knowledge or their interpretation and opinion on it. Yeah. Just shut up. You big loosers. We don't want to hear your side of the story because it might in some way threaten ours.

Prominent atheists are not trying to padlock local churches. They are trying to point out that maybe ... just maybe ... religious faith is fallacious in nature and maybe just maybe it has caused a lot of harm and we ought to rethink it a bit. They have every right in the world to do that.

That pissant generalization of 'oh you believe too and you need reassurance too nyah nyah nyah nyah nya nya' applies even more to religious people. I could rewrite that same argument to apply to ... oh I don't know ... people who need a sacred scripture for reassurance and then go to the streets to shout about it aloud in no general direction. But then that doesn't bother me. I think they are wrong, but I respect and cherish their right to free speech.

Atheists are overwhelmingly more closeted than religious people about their beliefs. That just makes a complete mockery of your last sentence.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Stu

Oh give that tired old rhetoric a rest would you. Everything you said their could be applied to religious people too if I were into weak arse, wank assumptions. No matter how much I love or hate atheists that's just such a lazy argument from people of faith. Of course atheists are going to broadcast their stance on the issue, share information on the universe with other atheists and so on. Very few people are natural atheists considering most of us were reared with religion. Information had to convert them and they now share this information with others.

Are you saying because atheists don't believe that they should not be allowed debate with religious people? After all they know and have their own beliefs. Why don't they just shut up unlike the religious people. Yeah. Atheists should just shut the hell up. So should people in various other positions to give out knowledge or their interpretation and opinion on it. Yeah. Just shut up. You big loosers. We don't want to hear your side of the story because it might in some way threaten ours.

Prominent atheists are not trying to padlock local churches. They are trying to point out that maybe ... just maybe ... religious faith is fallacious in nature and maybe just maybe it has caused a lot of harm and we ought to rethink it a bit. They have every right in the world to do that.

That pissant generalization of 'oh you believe too and you need reassurance too nyah nyah nyah nyah nya nya' applies even more to religious people. I could rewrite that same argument to apply to ... oh I don't know ... people who need a sacred scripture for reassurance and then go to the streets to shout about it aloud in no general direction. But then that doesn't bother me. I think they are wrong, but I respect and cherish their right to free speech.

Atheists are overwhelmingly more closeted than religious people about their beliefs. That just makes a complete mockery of your last sentence.

Did I say that my point couldn't be applied to religious people too?

Sorry that you just wasted your time typing up that very long reply when you didn't really need to.
My point was about the atheist we are discussing: the man in the video and to an extent Arista. I could have worded my reply more clearly but it was in response to Arista's post which was basically being patronising to all religious people. It's like saying all muslim's are terrorists, it's not true.

And religious people don't need the sacred scripture to back up anything. The scripture is the cause of their beliefs and religion is all about faith, which isn't about having solid proof.

Suppose it just winds me up when people rant about religion being wrong. "There is no god", "How can you believe in something you can't see" etc, etc. Yet do they have proof that God doesn't exist?

And whoever posted "Whatever the truth is, Religion is far from it". Well, religion is a pretty broad spectrum in general, they don't all believe in the same things. And whether a specific religion is "whatever the truth is" or not, how would you know?

[Stu]

Originally Posted by 08marsh

Did I say that my point couldn't be applied to religious people too?

Sorry that you just wasted your time typing up that very long reply when you didn't really need to.
My point was about the atheist we are discussing: the man in the video and to an extent Arista. I could have worded my reply more clearly but it was in response to Arista's post which was basically being patronising to all religious people. It's like saying all muslim's are terrorists, it's not true.

And religious people don't need the sacred scripture to back up anything. The scripture is the cause of their beliefs and religion is all about faith, which isn't about having solid proof.

Suppose it just winds me up when people rant about religion being wrong. "There is no god", "How can you believe in something you can't see" etc, etc. Yet do they have proof that God doesn't exist?

And whoever posted "Whatever the truth is, Religion is far from it". Well, religion is a pretty broad spectrum in general, they don't all believe in the same things. And whether a specific religion is "whatever the truth is" or not, how would you know?

What about the man in the video and Arista? They are every bit as hopelessly fundamentalist as ... well ... fundamentalists it would seem. I'm still not in favour of levelling the 'no you shut up!' argument at them.

I'm not a strict atheists by the way. I just sound a lot like one considering I would rather defend them in their cause to wrangle any semblance of world power away from the type of religious people who believe word for word in The Bible and suchlike.

I have my own quasi-spiritual-cosmic-arse-psychedelic-casualty views I usually revert back to every four or five days when I realize that strict atheism as simple as it is to get on with simply doesn't satisfy me enough.

[InOne]

Whatever the truth may be. Religion is far from it.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Scrooge

Whatever the truth may be. Religion is far from it.

yeah, that I do agree with. Religion, imo is a nice way to gain a bit of power and control over people

[InOne]

Originally Posted by NingleBells

yeah, that I do agree with. Religion, imo is a nice way to gain a bit of power and control over people

Definitely, can't believe it still does so much in this day and age tbh!

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Scrooge

Definitely, can't believe it still does so much in this day and age tbh!

yeah I know

[arista]

Originally Posted by Scrooge

Whatever the truth may be. Religion is far from it.

There Is No God

[KG.]

Pat

[Angus]

Originally Posted by arista

There Is No God

Prove it.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by King Herod

Prove it.

I will prove it on boxing day

[Livia]

People's faith is personal. Who is anyone else to say what's right and what's wrong if someone feels it in their heart? If only people would accept other people's faith and convictions and not get all self-righteous because they don't believe what you believe.

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Livia

People's faith is personal. Who is anyone else to say what's right and what's wrong if someone feels it in their heart? If only people would accept other people's faith and convictions and not get all self-righteous because they don't believe what you believe.

This.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Livia

People's faith is personal. Who is anyone else to say what's right and what's wrong if someone feels it in their heart? If only people would accept other people's faith and convictions and not get all self-righteous because they don't believe what you believe.

Yes it should be
all these God Freaks Preach Rubbish.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by arista

Yes it should be
all these God Freaks Preach Rubbish.

Do you think that only people like the man on your video should be afforded a voice?

I would like to think that you can believe what you want to believe and leave me alone to believe what I believe without ridiculing me. That's all I ask. I can't believe some people get so angry and upset because other people believe in God or worship in a different way.

[arista]

Originally Posted by Livia

Do you think that only people like the man on your video should be afforded a voice?

I would like to think that you can believe what you want to believe and leave me alone to believe what I believe without ridiculing me. That's all I ask. I can't believe some people get so angry and upset because other people believe in God or worship in a different way.

So May God Freaks Do Damage
to this World.


I can Fully Understand the Anger at God Nutters
like Bin Laden or GW Bush.
Both used there God as the backer to what hell they did.



There is No Proven God


It is the best way to be
No God.

[Livia]

Originally Posted by arista

So May God Freaks Do Damage
to this World.... etc etc.

Being a Jew, I'm well aware of the damage people do to each other because they misunderstand each other's faith or lack of it. I believe we have to be tolerant of each other without trying to convert others. If you don't believe in God, that's your of personal feeling. I don't agree; but I have no interest in trying to convince or convert you. We can agree to disagree.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by arista

So May God Freaks Do Damage
to this World.


I can Fully Understand the Anger at God Nutters
like Bin Laden or GW Bush.
Both used there God as the backer to what hell they did.



There is No Proven God


It is the best way to be
No God.

Funny how you ridicule religious people for pushing their views on other people, or trying to convert people yet you're the one stating your OPINIONS as fact and stating that there is categorically NO GOD. The term "God" being a diverse term anyway.

I'm willing to participate in a discussion about religion and faith but you're just rude. Don't even listen to people's points. Just ignore it, say "You're wrong" and move on. Very intelligent.

[iRyan]

I believe that god is the earth, the universe, and is just a massive massive massive amount of energy. And when people pray it's like like they are sending out that positive energy. Like someone said on Oprah, the power of the human mind and the energy it gives out is almost undiscovered and is alot more powerful than we think.

I think our bodies are just vessels for our spirits. They mean nothing, it's our spirits and our soul and our mind that controls everything. Religion makes God out to be a person and refer to him as a 'he' which is just not correct IMO. God is not a he, or a she, or an it. God doesn't live in the sky. God is what's all around us, it's what we're made of.

I used to be Catholic but now as I grow up, I have my own mind. And as much as I want to believe in the tradional Catholic beliefs and views, I'm finding it hard to believe that it's all real. Because alot of it to be just sounds like folklore.

I do believe that when you die, your soul lives on. And I believe in reincarnation as well. But I don't believe in the whole 'if you sin you go to hell' thing. I think it's all made up to scare people. What constitutes a sin? And I hate how Christians pick and choose bits out of the bible to go along with. In the bible it says divorcing, maturbation, and premarital sex are mortal sins. Yet the majority of Christians and Catholics have all done that. Yet if someone is a homosexual, they all point the finger and call them a sinner and say they will go to hell. Talk about hypocritical.

[LidlSistA]

I agree with the person who said faith is a personal thing and far more complex than whether a being exists in the sky. Live and let live. However people get through life is their business! Peace out