[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

I'm choosing to believe that there are a few people who agree with the gist of the message, just not my... Umm... Methods of engagement...

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

I'm choosing to believe that there are a few people who agree with the gist of the message, just not my... Umm... Methods of engagement...

Personally I do find your opinion on this topic to be too extreme for my personal taste.

I would understand your issue with this more if Darts was making them wear really obscene outfits, and that the main event of the Sport is to basically become Porn.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Originally Posted by Kate!

I get where he's coming from

Kate did you also not call Pete Waterman the steam rail pop guy a hero?

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Crimson Dynamo

Kate did you also not call Pete Waterman the steam rail pop guy a hero?

What's up with Pete Waterman?

[user104658]

Isn't it telling when some people believe so strongly that the point and purpose of posting on a forum, is to get as many people patting them on the back as possible. Telling and tragic.

[Beso]

What is glaringly obvious to me is we have all missed the point of the walk on girls..

We must look at who the darts world is trying to draw to the game, and I believe we have the darts poster boy, Luke luttler who isnt even 18 yet. So for me darts are trying to get a younger audience, therefore, these 36 year old milf, walk on girls are there for the horny teenagers to ogle , in an effort to draw the closer to the sport..

[user104658]

If you want some real irony - I'm actually passingly decent at throwing a few darts and my older sister's been in a mixed pub league since she was 20 (so over 20 years)

They don't have walk on girls though

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

If you want some real irony - I'm actually passingly decent at throwing a few darts and my older sister's been in a mixed pub league since she was 20 (so over 20 years)

They don't have walk on girls though

Yeah, see that's my issue with it. It must feel a bit **** for your sister to be trying to be taken seriously as a female player while watching the only women on "the big stage" being paraded around the men like decorations

[Beso]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah, see that's my issue with it. It must feel a bit **** for your sister to be trying to be taken seriously as a female player while watching the only women on "the big stage" being paraded around the men like decorations

What do you mean, the only women on the big stage.?

I could name about 5 top flight female darts players who can mix it with the men, and have done for about 5 years now.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Beso

What do you mean, the only women on the big stage.?



I could name about 5 top flight female darts players who can mix it with the men, and have done for about 5 years now.

That's still very few tbf Parm. I just don't like it in general in sports when women are already mocked and looked down on.. Again, not specifically with Darts, just generally

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah, see that's my issue with it. It must feel a bit **** for your sister to be trying to be taken seriously as a female player while watching the only women on "the big stage" being paraded around the men like decorations

Thats not true though, womens darts is very popular and they are televised and women have been playing with men for years now Fallon Sherrock is probably the stand out but there are more up and coming

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Thats not true though, womens darts is very popular and they are televised and women have been playing with men for years now Fallon Sherrock is probably the stand out but there are more up and coming

It's popular ish. I stand by my point that walk on girls do female players a dis service in being taken seriously, as do ring girls in UFC. Agree with me or disagree, your choice but I firmly believe that to be true regardless

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

It's popular ish. I stand by my point that walk on girls do female players a dis service in being taken seriously, as do ring girls in UFC. Agree with me or disagree, your choice but I firmly believe that to be true regardless

I agree. But I don't think every man who likes to see the walk on girls is a perverted, beer-swilling wife beater as has been suggested on this thread.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

It's popular ish. I stand by my point that walk on girls do female players a dis service in being taken seriously, as do ring girls in UFC. Agree with me or disagree, your choice but I firmly believe that to be true regardless

But you could say the same for cheerleaders or dancers for a artist, each to their own, if they are happy doing it, I dont think people look at these women and compare them to women in sport at least I dont, they are separate entities

Even without the walk on girls there are still pom pom girls on the stage dancing as the darts players walk on these are trained dancers who are being paid to do what they love I guess

[Mystic Mock]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

Yeah, see that's my issue with it. It must feel a bit **** for your sister to be trying to be taken seriously as a female player while watching the only women on "the big stage" being paraded around the men like decorations

The one slippery slope that could happen (but I don't believe that it will) is if the Senior Darts has a popular reaction to the Walk On Girls, then the Sport might try to make it's female competitors also dress up in a more sexy manner to draw in an audience that doesn't really care about the game, and against the wishes of a lot of the female Darts players.

[Liam-]

If you think female athletes are demeaned or looked down on because other women choose to do something else with their lives, then it’s you who has that view of female athletes, you can guarantee the vast majority of people who see a walk on girl, aren’t thinking that the women players should be doing that instead

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Liam-

If you think female athletes are demeaned or looked down on because other women choose to do something else with their lives, then it’s you who has that view of female athletes, you can guarantee the vast majority of people who see a walk on girl, aren’t thinking that the women players should be doing that instead

No I certainly don't have that view of female athletes.

[Liam-]

Originally Posted by Niamh.

No I certainly don't have that view of female athletes.

You’re literally saying it cheapens women and demeans the female athletes, so yes, you do have that view, I don’t, do I think there needs to be ring girls? No, do I think their presence lessens the legitimacy of female athletes or puts a bad image on them? Again, no, but you seem to and that’s not very girl power of you

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Liam-

You’re literally saying it cheapens women and demeans the female athletes, so yes, you do have that view, I don’t, do I think there needs to be ring girls? No, do I think their presence lessens the legitimacy of female athletes or puts a bad image on them? Again, no, but you seem to and that’s not very girl power of you

Well, you're not female Liam so you wouldn't really understand what women have to deal with on an ongoing basis from men. You really think you telling me I'm not for "girl power " is some sort of goal for you? um OK I guess, boo for me

[Livia]

Originally Posted by Liam-

If you think female athletes are demeaned or looked down on because other women choose to do something else with their lives, then it’s you who has that view of female athletes, you can guarantee the vast majority of people who see a walk on girl, aren’t thinking that the women players should be doing that instead

Irritating to see a gay man telling women what they should be thinking. Especially in view of your support of trans women's rights.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Livia

I agree. But I don't think every man who likes to see the walk on girls is a perverted, beer-swilling wife beater as has been suggested on this thread.

No one mentioned wife beating in relation to this thread at all until Cherie brought up "match day" domestic violence, which I'd mentioned in another thread, weeks ago, and is a very real and well understood issue that every domestic violence service and police force in the country is well aware of. I have no idea why people are so keen to dismiss it as untrue. It just is, factually, real. Clearly it caught in Cherie's throat at the time and it was brought up here weeks later in a totally different context, you'd have to ask her for the reason for that.

Men enjoying ogling women half their age is gross, organisations exploiting the fact that they do for advertising/profit is 10x more gross. I'm not going to change my opinion on either of those things. And they do play into a general public mindset that is ultimately damaging. There's ample evidence that it isn't "harmless".

Originally Posted by Cherie

add white to that.... gammon only refers to white men we all know that

Slightly baity because it'll take the whole thing right off topic but you're simply wrong. Gammon is a term that makes people uncomfortable and that's why I use it when I use it. I'm well aware that the issue is male objectification if women, not "teh white men", for example there's a massive problem with males in Muslim communities and their attitudes towards women and girls, and the way they view western women and girls (extreme objectification and dehumanisation plays heavily into the issue of grooming gangs, for example). I've said all of this, clearly and openly, in threads on those topics but you fairly consistently ignore those posts and misrepresented me as "only having an issue with white men" so this isn't unusual Cherie. As you were.

Originally Posted by Liam-

If you think female athletes are demeaned or looked down on because other women choose to do something else with their lives, then it’s you who has that view of female athletes, you can guarantee the vast majority of people who see a walk on girl, aren’t thinking that the women players should be doing that instead

I'm only going to take one final swipe at this because again, brick wall, Liam simply doesn't understand the distinction -- this (none of this) has anything at all to do with the choices being made by women.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Quantum Boy

No one mentioned wife beating in relation to this thread at all until Cherie brought up "match day" domestic violence, which I'd mentioned in another thread, weeks ago, and is a very real and well understood issue that every domestic violence service and police force in the country is well aware of. I have no idea why people are so keen to dismiss it as untrue. It just is, factually, real. Clearly it caught in Cherie's throat at the time and it was brought up here weeks later in a totally different context, you'd have to ask her for the reason for that.

Men enjoying ogling women half their age is gross, organisations exploiting the fact that they do for advertising/profit is 10x more gross. I'm not going to change my opinion on either of those things. And they do play into a general public mindset that is ultimately damaging. There's ample evidence that it isn't "harmless".

[B]It only resonated with me because of your snobbish attitude towards football and now darts because they are working class sports, there are plenty wife beaters in other walks life who are not or never have been working class, you will always be working class QB no matter what job you have ....sorry you cant escape your roots no matter how much you try to distance yourself

Slightly baity because it'll take the whole thing right off topic but you're simply wrong. Gammon is a term that makes people uncomfortable and that's why I use it when I use it. I'm well aware that the issue is male objectification if women, not "teh white men", for example there's a massive problem with males in Muslim communities and their attitudes towards women and girls, and the way they view western women and girls (extreme objectification and dehumanisation plays heavily into the issue of grooming gangs, for example). I've said all of this, clearly and openly, in threads on those topics but you fairly consistently ignore those posts and misrepresented me as "only having an issue with white men" so this isn't unusual Cherie. As you were.


Do you have a slur you use for non whites?


I'm only going to take one final swipe at this because again, brick wall, Liam simply doesn't understand the distinction -- this (none of this) has anything at all to do with the choices being made by women.

Why do you have so many issues with sports with working class roots, you do not follow sport so jog on maybe?

[Cherie]

This is an interesting read from 2017 but still

Darts is now one of Sky’s best-performing sports and the broadcaster has dedicated a whole channel to the World Championship, Sky Sports Darts, every year since the 2015 event.

However, it’s not all about top-line numbers, as the UK broadcast coverage is also attracting a younger audience: the 2016 World Championship coverage on Sky drew a 3% year-on-year increase of viewers from the 25-34 age group, a 1% decrease in viewers from the D/E social demographic, and an 8% increase in viewers from the C1/C2 social demographic. A third of the darts audience on Sky over the last four years has also been female.

These figures are important – and music to the ears of the darts fraternity – because there is a stereotype often directed at darts that its fanbase is made up of older men from the working classes. That may still be true to a certain extent, but it’s audience is certainly shifting to a more diverse demographic make-up – which was seen first hand during the 2015 World Championship when Prince Harry was pictured enjoying a night’s action at Ally Pally.

t’s also worth stressing this isn’t solely a UK phenomenon – both the PDC World Championship and darts more generally are enjoying strong growth on TV in key markets across the globe. The Netherlands is darts’ strongest TV market outside the UK, while eyes should be directed towards Canada, which experienced triple-digit TV viewership growth for the sport in 2016 compared to 2015.

https://www.sportindustry.biz/news-c...nce-you-think/

[Nicky91]

Originally Posted by Cherie

This is an interesting read from 2017 but still

Darts is now one of Sky’s best-performing sports and the broadcaster has dedicated a whole channel to the World Championship, Sky Sports Darts, every year since the 2015 event.

However, it’s not all about top-line numbers, as the UK broadcast coverage is also attracting a younger audience: the 2016 World Championship coverage on Sky drew a 3% year-on-year increase of viewers from the 25-34 age group, a 1% decrease in viewers from the D/E social demographic, and an 8% increase in viewers from the C1/C2 social demographic. A third of the darts audience on Sky over the last four years has also been female.

These figures are important – and music to the ears of the darts fraternity – because there is a stereotype often directed at darts that its fanbase is made up of older men from the working classes. That may still be true to a certain extent, but it’s audience is certainly shifting to a more diverse demographic make-up – which was seen first hand during the 2015 World Championship when Prince Harry was pictured enjoying a night’s action at Ally Pally.

t’s also worth stressing this isn’t solely a UK phenomenon – both the PDC World Championship and darts more generally are enjoying strong growth on TV in key markets across the globe. The Netherlands is darts’ strongest TV market outside the UK, while eyes should be directed towards Canada, which experienced triple-digit TV viewership growth for the sport in 2016 compared to 2015.

https://www.sportindustry.biz/news-c...nce-you-think/

haven't watched darts in many many years honestly, wouldn't know if we are still strongest market outside the UK

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Cherie

Why do you have so many issues with sports with working class roots, you do not follow sport so jog on maybe?

I have no issue at all with the sports Cherie I have the issue with the often-violent subcultures that emerge around them, and anyone who does care about the image of those sports would - I imagine - have an issue with it too, rather than defending it or refusing to acknowledge that it's a problem.