[user104658]

TBH I'd like to talk to him about these things to see if he actually has any depth or insight, or if (as I strongly suspect) his desire to portray himself as deep and thoughtful is mostly window-dressing.

He's a confusing character at the moment because he waxes lyrical about being a deep thinker and philosophical, but to be honest, his interactions with others are severely lacking in any amount of deeper thought or understanding. He's intolerant of people and unwilling to even look for their depth unless it's offered to him on a platter... which is profoundly unphilosophical.

I mean yes we can all have our off days like that, and it's not an indicator of overall character, but we've seen him for 6 weeks now and I've rarely (if ever) seen him make much of an effort to examine the world from any perspective other than his own. So what exactly is it that he wants to talk about? . Perhaps he wants to preach, which isn't really the same thing.

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

TBH I'd like to talk to him about these things to see if he actually has any depth or insight, or if (as I strongly suspect) his desire to portray himself as deep and thoughtful is mostly window-dressing.

He's a confusing character at the moment because he waxes lyrical about being a deep thinker and philosophical, but to be honest, his interactions with others are severely lacking in any amount of deeper thought or understanding. He's intolerant of people and unwilling to even look for their depth unless it's offered to him on a platter... which is profoundly unphilosophical.

I mean yes we can all have our off days like that, and it's not an indicator of overall character, but we've seen him for 6 weeks now and I've rarely (if ever) seen him make much of an effort to examine the world from any perspective other than his own. So what exactly is it that he wants to talk about? . Perhaps he wants to preach, which isn't really the same thing.

You are a loveable dick to be sure

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Cherie

You are a loveable dick to be sure

I've been saying it for years

[Cherie]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I've been saying it for years

if you didn't hide the loveable so well

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

TBH I'd like to talk to him about these things to see if he actually has any depth or insight, or if (as I strongly suspect) his desire to portray himself as deep and thoughtful is mostly window-dressing.

He's a confusing character at the moment because he waxes lyrical about being a deep thinker and philosophical, but to be honest, his interactions with others are severely lacking in any amount of deeper thought or understanding. He's intolerant of people and unwilling to even look for their depth unless it's offered to him on a platter... which is profoundly unphilosophical.

I mean yes we can all have our off days like that, and it's not an indicator of overall character, but we've seen him for 6 weeks now and I've rarely (if ever) seen him make much of an effort to examine the world from any perspective other than his own. So what exactly is it that he wants to talk about? . Perhaps he wants to preach, which isn't really the same thing.

I would add (to myself ) though that I think he does VERY MUCH WANT to be that person, which is maybe why he's so keen to go there, but... I think he needs to do a lot more work on himself and an absolute boatload of introspection before he's really able to operate on that level in any way. And currently, his own mind is far too stormy for him to even do that. In fact I think he'll end up doing himself some real emotional harm if he stares into the abyss for too long before he's sorted out his own mental landscape. Basically I think he's a little boy playing with fire (excuse the pun ) right now.

[poppsywoppsy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I would add (to myself ) though that I think he does VERY MUCH WANT to be that person, which is maybe why he's so keen to go there, but... I think he needs to do a lot more work on himself and an absolute boatload of introspection before he's really able to operate on that level in any way. And currently, his own mind is far too stormy for him to even do that. In fact I think he'll end up doing himself some real emotional harm if he stares into the abyss for too long before he's sorted out his own mental landscape. Basically I think he's a little boy playing with fire (excuse the pun ) right now.

He says he would love a conversation on certain subjects but he cannot have a conversation on his own.

Surely that's why you haven't seen it.

He has said no one else is interested or intelligent enough to have these conversations so don't blame him for them not happening. The level of general knowledge in there is abysmal.

I am sure, I would go nuts if all I was hearing all day was smutty innuendos, body functions and make up and beauty tips.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by poppsywoppsy

He says he would love a conversation on certain subjects but he cannot have a conversation on his own.

Surely that's why you haven't seen it.

He has said no one else is interested or intelligent enough to have these conversations so don't blame him for them not happening. The level of general knowledge in there is abysmal.

I am sure, I would go nuts if all I was hearing all day was smutty innuendos, body functions and make up and beauty tips.

That's not my point really. My point is that if he currently doesn't have the ability to discuss anything (it seems) in a calm and measured way, then being so eager to delve into the depths of things like social politics, suicide and mortality is a really bad idea both for himself and for anyone who would be going there with him. There are types of conversation that it's frankly just naive to plunge feet-first into to shoot the breeze or pass the time. The abyss stares back, and Lewis to be brutally honest does not seem like an emotionally healthy person right now... if he's not careful, he'll fold like wet tissue paper. Is all I'm saying. Keeping interactions fun and light has a very good purpose and can be very important... he's desperate to insist that these interactions are "lesser" instead of just "different", and that to me strongly indicates that he doesn't know how to find the balance that will (not to be melodramatic but...) keep him sane.

[poppsywoppsy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

That's not my point really. My point is that if he currently doesn't have the ability to discuss anything (it seems) in a calm and measured way, then being so eager to delve into the depths of things like social politics, suicide and mortality is a really bad idea both for himself and for anyone who would be going there with him. There are types of conversation that it's frankly just naive to plunge feet-first into to shoot the breeze or pass the time. The abyss stares back, and Lewis to be brutally honest does not seem like an emotionally healthy person right now... if he's not careful, he'll fold like wet tissue paper. Is all I'm saying. Keeping interactions fun and light has a very good purpose and can be very important... he's desperate to insist that these interactions are "lesser" instead of just "different", and that to me strongly indicates that he doesn't know how to find the balance that will (not to be melodramatic but...) keep him sane.

If no one can speak to him on these issues, your point is just conjecture.

He has had many laughs and carries himself well at these times.

You are putting him down through your perceived opinion of what might happen, not what has actually occurred.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by poppsywoppsy

If no one can speak to him on these issues, your point is just conjecture.

He has had many laughs and carries himself well at these times.

You are putting him down through your perceived opinion of what might happen, not what has actually occurred.

..it is what has already occurred though and not conjecture...he’s judged the majority of his housemates as snakes and reptiles..not people he’s delved below the surface of but of people he hasn’t wanted to delve below the surface of...

[user104658]

Originally Posted by poppsywoppsy

If no one can speak to him on these issues, your point is just conjecture.

He has had many laughs and carries himself well at these times.

You are putting him down through your perceived opinion of what might happen, not what has actually occurred.

I'm not putting him down, I'm analysing his character in a social situation because he's on a show that has been about analysing characters in social situations since the day it was conceptualised. I don't think he's a bad person, I certainly don't think he's "evil" or "scum" or any of the other stuff that's been thrown around about him, but I do know (for a fact, because he's said it) that he considers certain types of conversation and interaction to be inherently "better" than others which I find naive, and he has frequently shown that he struggles to keep his emotions balanced, and those things combined (in my opinion) show a lack of the intellectual maturity and emotional stability that's required to properly engage in a balanced discussion of the things he wants to talk about.

Being blunt I find it highly unlikely that he could continue an interaction on these topics with someone who doesn't agree with what he's saying for very long without becoming frustrated or angry. I think he assumes that a different perspective = "people who just don't get it". And that's not a conversation.

I would add that the reason I'm pretty confident about these things is that I've been there. I lived there for years ... .

[poppsywoppsy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I'm not putting him down, I'm analysing his character in a social situation because he's on a show that has been about analysing characters in social situations since the day it was conceptualised. I don't think he's a bad person, I certainly don't think he's "evil" or "scum" or any of the other stuff that's been thrown around about him, but I do know (for a fact, because he's said it) that he considers certain types of conversation and interaction to be inherently "better" than others which I find naive, and he has frequently shown that he struggles to keep his emotions balanced, and those things combined (in my opinion) show a lack of the intellectual maturity and emotional stability that's required to properly engage in a balanced discussion of the things he wants to talk about.

Being blunt I find it highly unlikely that he could continue an interaction on these topics with someone who doesn't agree with what he's saying for very long without becoming frustrated or angry. I think he assumes that a different perspective = "people who just don't get it". And that's not a conversation.

I would add that the reason I'm pretty confident about these things is that I've been there. I lived there for years ... .

You don't know how he could react though.

Because he might be having an interesting discussion with someone on a subject he is interested in, he could find it highly enjoyable.

You are basing your analysis on his frustrations in the past and not on any actual conversation he might care to have in the future.

It's not going to happen because there are not many in there who could have this conversation. I think he is dying to have this conversation and perhaps learn from it too, it doesn't automatically follow that he will blow up if he regards the other person has an educated and valid point of view.

[Jules82]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I'm not putting him down, I'm analysing his character in a social situation because he's on a show that has been about analysing characters in social situations since the day it was conceptualised. I don't think he's a bad person, I certainly don't think he's "evil" or "scum" or any of the other stuff that's been thrown around about him, but I do know (for a fact, because he's said it) that he considers certain types of conversation and interaction to be inherently "better" than others which I find naive, and he has frequently shown that he struggles to keep his emotions balanced, and those things combined (in my opinion) show a lack of the intellectual maturity and emotional stability that's required to properly engage in a balanced discussion of the things he wants to talk about.

Being blunt I find it highly unlikely that he could continue an interaction on these topics with someone who doesn't agree with what he's saying for very long without becoming frustrated or angry. I think he assumes that a different perspective = "people who just don't get it". And that's not a

conversation.

I would add that the reason I'm pretty confident about these things is that I've been there. I lived there for years ... .

You have good points there TS but I have no doubt that you will also realise that it is very difficult to go into a programme of self improvement. There are so many things that will bring us down just like that, then we have to learn control. I say this also with knowledge and I have found myself taking myself to task, then I have learnt where I went wrong.

For Lewis this is a good exercise, he put himself, warts and all, in front of the public for approval along with the cash. For me I believe that he will analise all things and see where he can go further in his quest. On the other hand he is going to be successful no matter what and it will depend on whether he lets materialism end it for a while. He will take himself to task because he is that sort of person even if he seems negative. Thereagain can we be sure, not really but it is a positive judgement.

Each one of them will have learnt something if they are wise enough to accept the results and after all it is supposed to be a social experiment.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

TBH I'd like to talk to him about these things to see if he actually has any depth or insight, or if (as I strongly suspect) his desire to portray himself as deep and thoughtful is mostly window-dressing.

He's a confusing character at the moment because he waxes lyrical about being a deep thinker and philosophical, but to be honest, his interactions with others are severely lacking in any amount of deeper thought or understanding. He's intolerant of people and unwilling to even look for their depth unless it's offered to him on a platter... which is profoundly unphilosophical.

I mean yes we can all have our off days like that, and it's not an indicator of overall character, but we've seen him for 6 weeks now and I've rarely (if ever) seen him make much of an effort to examine the world from any perspective other than his own. So what exactly is it that he wants to talk about? . Perhaps he wants to preach, which isn't really the same thing.

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

That's not my point really. My point is that if he currently doesn't have the ability to discuss anything (it seems) in a calm and measured way, then being so eager to delve into the depths of things like social politics, suicide and mortality is a really bad idea both for himself and for anyone who would be going there with him. There are types of conversation that it's frankly just naive to plunge feet-first into to shoot the breeze or pass the time. The abyss stares back, and Lewis to be brutally honest does not seem like an emotionally healthy person right now... if he's not careful, he'll fold like wet tissue paper. Is all I'm saying. Keeping interactions fun and light has a very good purpose and can be very important... he's desperate to insist that these interactions are "lesser" instead of just "different", and that to me strongly indicates that he doesn't know how to find the balance that will (not to be melodramatic but...) keep him sane.

..I love it when our thoughts are together, TS.....you’re often the lovable bit and rarely the dick bit.....yeah the thing is with Lewis, is that he feels he’s deep and aspires to be deep but he never delves below the surface with people...he judges only on surface and so deprives himself of getting to know so many housemates in any depth...what would be their views on politics, on homelessness, in suicide...?...he has no idea because he’s already made judgements and all judgements that he’s made are only skin deep...