[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

Yes, they exist and can therefore pick up on the lost custom of the shops. I wasn't putting words in your mouth, I was connecting the two things you said to make the observation.

They may or may not pick up the custom, my point was they will make a profit regardless...it may not be quite so obscene as before the £100 stake FOBTs.

I never said it wouldn't.
I merely suggested, with the online options, those opting to not play at the £2 stake limit or be unable to due to a closure of their local shop wouldn't spend their money elsewhere if they transfer their custom online. It would still be going to the betting industry. Just another thought.

This seems like a contradiction, you suggested FOBT high stake customers wouldn't use an online service?

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

This seems like a contradiction, you suggested FOBT high stake customers wouldn't use an online service?

High stake FOBT customers are not all FOBT customers?

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

High stake FOBT customers are not all FOBT customers?

'a lot of those high staking customers will not go online'


' I merely suggested, with the online options, those opting to not play at the £2 stake limit or be unable to due to a closure of their local shop wouldn't spend their money elsewhere if they transfer their custom online. '

This is what I found contradictory.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

'a lot of those high staking customers will not go online'


' I merely suggested, with the online options, those opting to not play at the £2 stake limit or be unable to due to a closure of their local shop wouldn't spend their money elsewhere if they transfer their custom online. '

This is what I found contradictory.

A lot of high staking customers opting not to bet online because you have to provide personal information, and your economy argument not working because some customers who don't spend in the shops due to their closures are spending online is not contradictory. It's two separate statements about two separate things.

Again, "high staking customers" are not all customers.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

A lot of high staking customers opting not to bet online because you have to provide personal information, and your economy argument not working because some customers who don't spend in the shops due to their closures are spending online is not contradictory. It's two separate statements about two separate things.

Again, "high staking customers" are not all customers.

You are tying yourself up in knots here.. if the big spenders don't want to bet online and the FOBT is capped where are they going to spend their money?
It may not help the economy but i hope it does, should bookies close and the temptation at every turn removed on the high St hopefully those who may have an issue will be able to resist the urge.
I'm aware high staking customers are not all customers, they are however those who are being aided by the regulation here. Again I think regulation is a good thing and store closures are a good thing. Yes theRe are some job losses but ultimately I'd say that's for for the greater good of aiding gambling addicts.

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

You are tying yourself up in knots here.. if the big spenders don't want to bet online and the FOBT is capped where are they going to spend their money?

It may not help the economy but i hope it does, should bookies close and the temptation at every turn removed on the high St hopefully those who may have an issue will be able to resist the urge.

I'm aware high staking customers are not all customers, they are however those who are being aided by the regulation here. Again I think regulation is a good thing and store closures are a good thing. Yes theRe are some job losses but ultimately I'd say that's for for the greater good of aiding gambling addicts.

I think it helping the economy is sadly a stretch; a lot of the closures may well actively damage local economies is the sad reality and I'm honestly amazed that the government went ahead with capping the machines, as they are HEAVILY taxed (government has been profiting off of machines addicts quite nicely ).

The benefit to people with gambling addiction though is more than worth it. Especially given that, in my experience, the number of gamblers who have at least a low-level bona-fide addiction is MUCH higher than the industry would like people to believe.

[bots]

I think the fact so many shops are now closing shows how exploitative the previous rules were. It's not dissimilar to curbing drug use/addiction and forcing the narcos to shutdown

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

I think it helping the economy is sadly a stretch; a lot of the closures may well actively damage local economies is the sad reality and I'm honestly amazed that the government went ahead with capping the machines, as they are HEAVILY taxed (government has been profiting off of machines addicts quite nicely ).

The benefit to people with gambling addiction though is more than worth it. Especially given that, in my experience, the number of gamblers who have at least a low-level bona-fide addiction is MUCH higher than the industry would like people to believe.

We all know how adept companies are at avoiding tax though however heavily that industry is taxed? Maybe the govt aren't finding they're getting the cut of these high stake machines they were expecting? As you say were it such a cash cow would they be taking action? The ethical high Road is not what the modern conservative is known for. It prob is a stretch I guess the addicts will have to access support before any money they were giving the bookies would be spent in other ways, saved or reinvested.

[Marsh.]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

You are tying yourself up in knots here.. if the big spenders don't want to bet online and the FOBT is capped where are they going to spend their money?
It may not help the economy but i hope it does, should bookies close and the temptation at every turn removed on the high St hopefully those who may have an issue will be able to resist the urge.
I'm aware high staking customers are not all customers, they are however those who are being aided by the regulation here. Again I think regulation is a good thing and store closures are a good thing. Yes theRe are some job losses but ultimately I'd say that's for for the greater good of aiding gambling addicts.

I've not tied up any knots. You're the one misunderstanding what I've written.

I didn't say the economy wouldn't be affected. I said the customers who either willingly move away from stores or are forced to due to store closures will most likely go online, therefore not having much of an impact outside of the industry. Therefore, based off that, I found your hypothesis of the economy gaining signifanctly less likely.

The big stakers, however, will be turned away from online gambling. The people I refer to are a minority tens of thousand of pounds a month gamblers. Not your more casual gamblers who make up a majority of the customer base in my own experience. But, again, there's no real guarantee that someone who is hooked on gambling to that degree will not find some way of emptying it all into FOBT/Bandit machines instead of spending all that cash on something else.

Literally all I said Kizzy, in two separate posts.

I hope the addicts and problem gamblers benefit from the legislation too. But as long as gambling exists the temptation will be there and, sadly, the industry as a whole isn't budging.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Marsh.

I've not tied up any knots. You're the one misunderstanding what I've written.

I didn't say the economy wouldn't be affected. I said the customers who either willingly move away from stores or are forced to due to store closures will most likely go online, therefore not having much of an impact outside of the industry. Therefore, based off that, I found your hypothesis of the economy gaining signifanctly less likely.

The big stakers, however, will be turned away from online gambling. The people I refer to are a minority tens of thousand of pounds a month gamblers. Not your more casual gamblers who make up a majority of the customer base in my own experience. But, again, there's no real guarantee that someone who is hooked on gambling to that degree will not find some way of emptying it all into FOBT/Bandit machines instead of spending all that cash on something else.

Literally all I said Kizzy, in two separate posts.

I hope the addicts and problem gamblers benefit from the legislation too. But as long as gambling exists the temptation will be there and, sadly, the industry as a whole isn't budging.

I get that you don't feel it will benefit the economy you have stated that several times... personally I still do maybe it won't be instantaneous but as those impulsive high stake customers are prevented from using the fobts to lose vast amounts of money in time they may seek help or find a new outlet fir their addiction?..