[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

well, yeah. I mean I don't want to be accused of being racist or anything but there does seem to be an enormous set of double standards going on!

Dont make the exception, be the rule. Saudi Arabia is extreme, compared to the rest of the muslim world, as I pointed out about the Churches in Senegal, but here are more for you:

Algeria


Bahrein


Bangladesh




Imdonesia


Iran


Kuwait


Jordan


Kuwait


Lybya


Morocco


Pakistan


Syria


Turkey


United Arab Emirates



I could go on. BUt as you can see, they have big beautiful churches, with no restrictions, and they an built as many as they deem necessary in these muslim countries.
No matter how you spin it, that decision is wrong, and is definitely oression. Thankfully, most of the rest of the world have condemn the referendum, including France, and all the majors western countries. ONly a minority seem to agree, with it, so there is hope.

And BTW, most of the muslims in the world do think that its ridiculous, Saudi Arabia, asks the catholic church to acknowledge Mohamed as a prophet, as their ondition to allow, buliding of churches. The Christians, dont believe in Mohamed, so its stupid to ask them to do so.
Again dont let one intolerant nation, make you become intolerant like they are. If so, youre no better than the Saudis.

[Wildcat!]

Oh no! All that effort, and I cant see my pictures.
cAn anyone else see them?

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Oh no! All that effort, and I cant see my pictures.
cAn anyone else see them?

no sorry Wildcat!!

I really don't know much about this subject to be fair, I'm just trying to look at it from all angles really

[Wildcat!]

Sure I understand, but thats how extremists work. They take a bad aspect of a religion or an exception, to use it as scare tactics, for intolerance. If you only listened to them, you would believe muslim coutntries, dont allow churches, which is untrue.

But here is where I got the pics, bottom of the page.

http://islam-west.com/2007/11/christ...countries.html

[Crimson Dynamo]

http://newsrealblog.com/2009/12/01/stop-the-minarets/


"One could also question Goodman’s use of the specious argument put forth by Amnesty International, which characterizes the Swiss vote banning minarets as a “violation of religious freedom.” A curious argument coming from an organization that remains strangely silent on the issue of religious freedom in the Islamic world, where it is forbidden to build a church of any kind in countries such as Bangladesh, Afghanistan, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia (where Christians may not even set foot in many areas for fear of being executed)."

http://jonathanturley.org/2009/11/29...doesnt-add-up/

interesting video!

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Sure I understand, but thats how extremists work. They take a bad aspect of a religion or an exception, to use it as scare tactics, for intolerance. If you only listened to them, you would believe muslim coutntries, dont allow churches, which is untrue.

But here is where I got the pics, bottom of the page.

http://islam-west.com/2007/11/christ...countries.html

point taken Wildcat. Like I said before it really doesn't bother me in the slightest whether or not they build them anyway, I would have just thought if they don't allow it in their countries why should other countries allow them but you've proven that that isn't 100% true.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by LeatherTrumpet

http://newsrealblog.com/2009/12/01/stop-the-minarets/


"One could also question Goodman’s use of the specious argument put forth by Amnesty International, which characterizes the Swiss vote banning minarets as a “violation of religious freedom.” A curious argument coming from an organization that remains strangely silent on the issue of religious freedom in the Islamic world, where it is forbidden to build a church of any kind in countries such as Bangladesh, Afghanistan, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia (where Christians may not even set foot in many areas for fear of being executed)."

Thats a fair point, and it should be condemned.
Its also good to note, that there are 50 countries in the world considered to be muslim. So obviously those intolerant nations, are a minority.


And BTW, there are churches, in all those countries you listed.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by setanta

Yep, but they're the big boys; the hive centre, just like the Vatican is to Catholics, right?

LIke I said, they have churches on those coutries, I dont know, where the poster got their informations, but its not true. Some countries, still have issues, with persecussion I think, but they have churches.

[Wildcat!]

http://across.co.nz/BangladeshChurches.html

http://across.co.nz/PakistanChurches.html

And Afghanistan, is definitely no big boy in the muslim world, neither is Bangladesh

[InOne]

I'd prefer to the discuss the way they reacted to that woman in Luton...

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

LIke I said, they have churches on those coutries, I dont know, where the poster got their informations, but its not true. Some countries, still have issues, with persecussion I think, but they have churches.

Hey, I'm not having a pop, just trying to understand more about your faith and how the more orthodox followers feel about other creeds and ways of life, especially from states like that where Islamic Law is practiced. Look, Christianity has a bloody past too which is not something to be proud of but like you said, we shouldn't ingnorantly condemn others or react strongly with any kind of rhetoric without having a look at the facts.

I'm reading about Islamic Law and the history of persecutian of Non- Muslims now and it's a bit troubling to say the least in certain parts.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by setanta

Hey, I'm not having a pop, just trying to understand more about your faith and how the more orthodox followers feel about other creeds and ways of life, especially from states like that where Islamic Law is practiced. Look, Christianity has a bloody past too which is not something to be proud of but like you said, we shouldn't ingnorantly condemn others or react strongly with any kind of rethoric without having a look at the facts.

I'm reading about Islamic Law and the history of persecutian of Non- Muslims now and it's a bit troubling to say the least in certain parts.

yeah, fair enough. I just object to the insinuation, based on maybe 2 or 3 countries in the whole muslim world. And BTW, most muslim countries, do not have muslim law (sharia). They have a regular constitution, that has nothing to do with the religion. I think these are the countires that practice it!

Iran

Pakistan

Saudi Arabi

Nigeria

Sudan

Iraq (prior to 2003)

Egypt

And again, most muslim I know, dont agree with Islam as a law, And some of its cruel punishments.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by InOne

I'd prefer to the discuss the way they reacted to that woman in Luton...

Gladly! They are a bunch of morons, like most muslim extremists. And they should be arrested, if you ask me.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

yeah, fair enough. I just object to the insinuation, based on maybe 2 or 3 countries in the whole muslim world. And BTW, most muslim countries, do not have muslim law (sharia). They have a regular constitution, that has nothing to do with the religion. I think these are the countires that practice it!

Iran

Pakistan

Saudi Arabi

Nigeria

Sudan

Iraq (prior to 2003)

Egypt

And again, most muslim I know, dont agree with Islam as a law, And some of its cruel punishments.

Most religions have laws that are outdated now anyway I think. Catholicism has loads that could do with changing

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

Most religions have laws that are outdated now anyway I think. Catholicism has loads that could do with changing

Yeah, but religion doesn't play a huge part in a democratic societies law making or judicial system.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by setanta

Yeah, but religion doesn't play a huge part in a democratic societies law making or judicial system.

no, it doesn't, I really know very lttle about Muslim countries laws and how much of a part their religion plays in their judicial system or democratic societies though

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

no, it doesn't, I really know very lttle about Muslim countries laws and how much of a part their religion plays in their judicial system or democratic societies though

I don't really know so much either, but I've been reading about it right now and the whole thing looks very antiquated to me, which I can't really see functioning in our world on any level. It would be kinda like us drawing from the old testament for all our laws.... a fair bit of it has no real relevance or place in the real world.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Gladly! They are a bunch of morons, like most muslim extremists. And they should be arrested, if you ask me.

Indeed, are you sure they are what we would call extreme though? I mean if they are the youth, it is not good!!

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by setanta

I don't really know so much either, but I've been reading about it right now and the whole thing looks very antiquated to me, which I can't really see functioning in our world on any level. It would be kinda like us drawing from the old testament for all our laws.... a fair bit of it has no real relevance or place in the real world.

Thats why I laugh, when I hear people say stuff like, they are worried about Islam, because they want to bring Sharia law to the UK!
LIke thats ever gonna happen. Most muslim countries dont use it, how in the wold would it ever see daylight here?

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by InOne

Indeed, are you sure they are what we would call extreme though? I mean if they are the youth, it is not good!!

Of course they are extremists. Anyone who would throw rotten eggs at a Muslim woman, because that woman is not as good a Muslim as they like, is an extremist, no matter how old they are.
People have to understand, those types of incidents, always make the press, thats why some think all muslims are like that. BUt nothing could be further from the truth. Most want peace, and dont want to dominate the headlines, for the wrong reasons. BUt thats all that they show, they will never show you anything good accomplished by the muslim community.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Thats why I laugh, when I hear people say stuff like, they are worried about Islam, because they want to bring Sharia law to the UK!
LIke thats ever gonna happen. Most muslim countries dont use it, how in the wold would it ever see daylight here?

It's interesting reading though cuz a few of the countries practice Islamic Law when it involves marriage and inheritance, so obviously it has a certain presence in many states. Fascinating stuff.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Of course they are extremists. Anyone who would throw rotten eggs at a Muslim woman, because that woman is not as good a Muslim as they like, is an extremist, no matter how old they are.
People have to understand, those types of incidents, always make the press, thats why some think all muslims are like that. BUt nothing could be further from the truth. Most want peace, and dont want to dominate the headlines, for the wrong reasons. BUt thats all that they show, they will never show you anything good accomplished by the muslim community.

Indeed, half the muslims I know are not too bothered about Islam, they just get on with it. I think it is to do with indentity crisis is some care. Are they British, Muslim, are they from where their parents are from ect. Some can deal with it and class themselves as whatever they want and get on with it. But if they face prejudice and that, they tend to look some other things such as extremism. But that should not really be happening now as we've had muslims over here for decades. Maybe some people are just more prone to violence and act that way because they can. Same with people who joined the IRA when they were most active.

[setanta]

Originally Posted by InOne

Same with people who joined the IRA when they were most active.

That's a whole other discussion baby.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by setanta

It's interesting reading though cuz a few of the countries practice Islamic Law when it involves marriage and inheritance, so obviously it has a certain presence in many states. Fascinating stuff.

Yeah, thats true. They do that in my country as well, but its strictly up to the individuals to decide, if they want the law when they sign their marriage papers.

[InOne]

Originally Posted by setanta

That's a whole other discussion baby.

I know lol I don't think it needs to be reopened!!!