[Shasown]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

Although I understand your point that in an ideal world the man should have a say - but the woman has to have the bigger say - as it is, as you say, her body that has to give birth and take the necessary health risks! There simply is no way round that! You can't cater for the wishes of both - if they disagree!

Of course it will always be that way because it is the womans body, but what about cases where the woman wants to keep the baby but the man doesnt want or need the financial commitment.

Shouldn't the man have the right to insist on the woman having an abortion? That would be equal rights wouldnt it? After all the woman decides to go through with the pregnancy the man may resent the child as being an unneccessary financial burden. Why should he have to have 18 years of direct debits for a simple 10 minute(if he was lucky) knee trembler at the back of a nighclub?

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Of course it will always be that way because it is the womans body, but what about cases where the woman wants to keep the baby but the man doesnt want or need the financial commitment.

Shouldn't the man have the right to insist on the woman having an abortion? That would be equal rights wouldnt it? After all the woman decides to go through with the pregnancy the man may resent the child as being an unneccessary financial burden. Why should he have to have 18 years of direct debits for a simple 10 minute(if he was lucky) knee trembler at the back of a nighclub?

That is why men should 'use one' - especially when indulging in a 10 minute knee trembler! As they know they can have no say in whether the woman decides to keep any resulting baby - they have to be extra cautious in protecting themselves and not spreading their seed if they don't want it spread! Common sense - isn't it!

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

That is why men should 'use one' - especially when indulging in a 10 minute knee trembler! As they know they can have no say in whether the woman decides to keep any resulting baby - they have to be extra cautious in protecting themselves and not spreading their seed if they don't want it spread! Common sense - isn't it!

Some men do use them and as you said earlier no method of contraception is 100%

And doesnt the same argument fall back on the woman after all it is her body and if she doesnt want to be inseminated (and possibly infected) shouldnt she insist on him wearing something even if she is on the pill/coil/injection?

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Some men do use them and as you said earlier no method of contraception is 100%

And doesnt the same argument fall back on the woman after all it is her body and if she doesnt want to be inseminated (and possibly infected) shouldnt she insist on him wearing something even if she is on the pill/coil/injection?

If she has any sense, yes - but at least she knows she will have some choice in whether or not to go ahead with an unplanned pregnancy!

Everyone should be careful - but at lot depends on what is at stake for the person having sex! Anyone that really doesn't want to have a child, particularly, if they have no say in the consequences, should take extra care! The same would go for anyone that has strong religous/moral feelings on abortion - extra caution is needed!

[BB_Eye]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Of course it will always be that way because it is the womans body, but what about cases where the woman wants to keep the baby but the man doesnt want or need the financial commitment.

Shouldn't the man have the right to insist on the woman having an abortion? That would be equal rights wouldnt it? After all the woman decides to go through with the pregnancy the man may resent the child as being an unneccessary financial burden. Why should he have to have 18 years of direct debits for a simple 10 minute(if he was lucky) knee trembler at the back of a nighclub?

I pretty much agree with this, especially in cases where women might abuse the system, refuse the pill and have children for the sole purpose of gaining child support money. More often than not, if one party is forced to take on the responsibility of the child against their will, the child will have to live with the consequences.

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

If she has any sense, yes - but at least she knows she will have some choice in whether or not to go ahead with an unplanned pregnancy!

Everyone should be careful - but at lot depends on what is at stake for the person having sex! Anyone that really doesn't want to have a child, particularly, if they have no say in the consequences, should take extra care! The same would go for anyone that has strong religous/moral feelings on abortion - extra caution is needed!

Then surely advertisements of this type are sending out the wrong message, its not just saying supposing you use contraception and the contraceptive fails, dont sweat it we can wipe out that little errr accident as if it never happened.

Isnt it also sending out the message hey go on do what you want, have no strings sex, dont worrying about contraceptive, dont worry about the outcome coz if you are unlucky and fall pregnant we will ensure that little problem is quickly and conveniently removed.

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Then surely advertisements of this type are sending out the wrong message, its not just saying supposing you use contraception and the contraceptive fails, dont sweat it we can wipe out that little errr accident as if it never happened.

Isnt it also sending out the message hey go on do what you want, have no strings sex, dont worrying about contraceptive, dont worry about the outcome coz if you are unlucky and fall pregnant we will ensure that little problem is quickly and conveniently removed.

I agree with this.

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by BB_Eye

I pretty much agree with this, especially in cases where women might abuse the system, refuse the pill and have children for the sole purpose of gaining child support money. More often than not, if one party is forced to take on the responsibility of the child against their will, the child will have to live with the consequences.

Shouldn't knowing that some women do that - make men more cautious - and insist on putting the jacket on - especially when having casual sex!

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Then surely advertisements of this type are sending out the wrong message, its not just saying supposing you use contraception and the contraceptive fails, dont sweat it we can wipe out that little errr accident as if it never happened.

Isnt it also sending out the message hey go on do what you want, have no strings sex, dont worrying about contraceptive, dont worry about the outcome coz if you are unlucky and fall pregnant we will ensure that little problem is quickly and conveniently removed.

What suitable alternative is there! Children stuck in care, or lives lost through back-street abortions! Practicalities!

[Shasown]

Scare irresponsible people shitless!

Graphic details of girls having backstreet abortions,

Show the worst cases of sexually transmitted diseases.

Show them being forced out of their leisurely lifestyles and the harsh realities of parenthood.

The boy looking at the pittance he earns on his wage slip and remembering the court ordering to pay maintenance.

The girl feeling guilty after her abortion.

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Scare irresponsible people shitless!

Graphic details of girls having backstreet abortions,

Show the worst cases of sexually transmitted diseases.

Show them being forced out of their leisurely lifestyles and the harsh realities of parenthood.

The boy looking at the pittance he earns on his wage slip and remembering the court ordering to pay maintenance.

The girl feeling guilty after her abortion.

I'm all for education on the harsh realities of abortion and parenthood for males and females - but forcing women either into or out of abortions is not the answer in my book! For too long sex education has been geared more towards girls, and although it is better than it used to be - still far too many boys/men think they don't have to be careful or take any responsibility because they don't get pregnant - it is about time they realised that the girls aren't the only ones that are responsible and not the only ones that should pay a hefty price!

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

I'm all for education on the harsh realities of abortion and parenthood for males and females - but forcing women either into or out of abortions is not the answer in my book!

Dont women generally force themselves into abortions by not caring about the life they have created, the fact it will interfere with their careers etc, and by not having the common sense to ensure they dont get pregnant?

But once again you have completely missed the point in that post, the idea is to scare them by using graphic images of what happens when adequate care over contraception and sex isnt taken.

[Captain.Remy]

abortion is the new black. Lovin' it <3

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Dont women generally force themselves into abortions by not caring about the life they have created, the fact it will interfere with their careers etc, and by not having the common sense to ensure they dont get pregnant?

But once again you have completely missed the point in that post, the idea is to scare them by using graphic images of what happens when adequate care over contraception and sex isnt taken.

Is ensuring they don't get pregnant then just up to the women, in your book - nothing to do with the men! A lack of common sense on both sides I would say!

I agree with most of the second paragraph! But what happens if the scare tactics don't work?

[Shasown]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

Is ensuring they don't get pregnant then just up to the women, in your book - nothing to do with the men! A lack of common sense on both sides I would say!

I agree with most of the second paragraph! But what happens if the scare tactics don't work?

Whilst it is true that contraception is a dual responsibility, going by the track record of men would you say that little miss average should rely on the man being responsible, or until she is sure she can trust the man to have more than just 'a quick shag sod the outcome' attitude should she not take responsibility for her own body?

Yes a common sense attitude on both sides would mean women would insist on the man using condoms even if she was herself taking some precaustions, just like a man would insist on using a condom even if the woman stated she was on the pill/had a coil fitted, etc. If nothing else it would cut down on the incidences of STD's and also pregnancies as a result of contraceptive failures.

[Ella]

Originally Posted by teamandre

i think the advert is wrong and i dont believe in abortions they are just wrong

So if a woman was raped you think an abortion is wrong in that case? Or if contraception failed? Every single woman on the planet has a right to do what she wants with her body, If she can't physically, mentally or emotionally deal with pregnancy, birth and so on then that's her choice, You may not agree with it, but that doesn't make it wrong.

This is a subject I feel very strongly about.

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Ella

So if a woman was raped you think an abortion is wrong in that case? Or if contraception failed? Every single woman on the planet has a right to do what she wants with her body, If she can't physically, mentally or emotionally deal with pregnancy, birth and so on then that's her choice, You may not agree with it, but that doesn't make it wrong.

This is a subject I feel very strongly about.

[LeatherTrumpet]

disgusting barbaric solution to carelessness

[teamandre]

Originally Posted by Ella

So if a woman was raped you think an abortion is wrong in that case? Or if contraception failed? Every single woman on the planet has a right to do what she wants with her body, If she can't physically, mentally or emotionally deal with pregnancy, birth and so on then that's her choice, You may not agree with it, but that doesn't make it wrong.

This is a subject I feel very strongly about.

no if you read before i said except for speical circumstances e.g rape other things and yes its there body but it doesnt mean i have to agree with it does it thats my opion

[WOMBAI]

Are you never careless - always perfect! No 10 minute knee tremblers then!

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

Are you never careless - always perfect! No 10 minute knee tremblers then!

Yeah people can be careless and make mistakes absolutely but some mistakes have bigger consequences than others. It depends how you look at it I suppose, in my eyes If you make a mistake like getting pregnant when you hadn't wanted to, you've made a mistake that will now effect a whole new person and you should take what you've done very seriously not flippantly say "Oops I made a booboo, not to worry I'll just abort it!" But, I do realise that this is my mind and what I think and maybe I'm wrong but it's just the way I think.

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

Yeah people can be careless and make mistakes absolutely but some mistakes have bigger consequences than others. It depends how you look at it I suppose, in my eyes If you make a mistake like getting pregnant when you hadn't wanted to, you've made a mistake that will now effect a whole new person and you should take what you've done very seriously not flippantly say "Oops I made a booboo, not to worry I'll just abort it!" But, I do realise that this is my mind and what I think and maybe I'm wrong but it's just the way I think.

Personally - I would never take abortion lightly - I don't think most women in that situation do - but it is often the best/only solution for many! Many agonize over their decision - but it has to be their decision to make!

My post above was in relation to men having casual sex - with little or no thought of the consequences - but often being very judgemental about women doing the same! I strongly feel that BOTH sexes need to take responsibility! I think that today society as a whole would agree - but that message can take a long time to get through to some guys!

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

Personally - I would never take abortion lightly - I don't think most women in that situation do - but it is often the best/only solution for many! Many agonize over their decision - but it has to be their decision to make!

My post above was in relation to men having casual sex - with little or no thought of the consequences - but often being very judgemental about women doing the same! I strongly feel that BOTH sexes need to take responsibility! I think that today society as a whole would agree - but that message can take a long time to get through to some guys!

Well you are right of course they should but as a mother and a woman, from the minute I became pregnant with both my children I hoped that they would have good responsible fathers but I committed to look after and be responsible for them either way as I was the one carrying them and bringing them into this world.

[WOMBAI]

Originally Posted by Niamhxo

Well you are right of course they should but as a mother and a woman, from the minute I became pregnant with both my children I hoped that they would have good responsible fathers but I committed to look after and be responsible for them either way as I was the one carrying them and bringing them into this world.

You sound a very strong, level-headed person - with hopefully a good support network - but, unfortunately, it isn't the same for everyone!

[Niamh.]

Originally Posted by WOMBAI

You sound a very strong, level-headed person - with hopefully a good support network - but, unfortunately, it isn't the same for everyone!

Well, I can tell you I wasn't so strong or level headed when I got pregnant with my daughter but yeah I did have good support from my family. Tbh, I think having my daughter was the best thing that could've happened cos I was a bit out of control up until then. But I do understand what you're saying and like I said before I'm not completely against abortion as such, I just think that it should be a serious thing to do for people and I realize it is for most people but not for everyone which I do find disgusting.