[oddballmisfitsFTW]

Originally Posted by Livia

There was a HUGE depression before WW2. Did you hear about that? The whole of the world suffered. The reason Hitler came to power was that he promised the Germans, who were starving, he would put food on their table. They worked, they built autobahns, he fed their children. Hearts and minds. Thats how he rose to power so astonishingly quickly. The mass production of arms didn't occur until quite a while after Hitler was in power.

To say that the upper Class British gave Hitler power is ill-informed and really classist. It wasn't just the working class that died in WW2, people from all classes died.

There was the great depression and there is the "economic crisis" that happened recently. I have a very bad feeling something seriously ****ed up is gonna happen within next few years. I dont trust the ruling classes who own the politicians.
I am very paranoid about it. I do think there is something behind WWII and the depression is connected to it and the economin crisis of recent times is connected to the Iraq, Afghanistan and any future wars we may have (eg Iran).
And, WWII and modern wars are connected in some way, I think
Knee jerk reaction I even say to myself is paranoid etc, but they got found out to be blatantly lying about Iraq and Afghanistan, so what else are they lying about. Seems very dodgy to me, very sinsister and doesnt sit right with me at all
Economic crisis was caused by the banks themselves, no question in my mind. They are greedy and stealing the publics money from under their noses under the guise of "oooh we have a crisis, we need help"
NO they are lying just like Iraq and Afghanistan.

[StGeorge]

Originally Posted by oddballmisfitsFTW

There was the great depression and there is the "economic crisis" that happened recently. I have a very bad feeling something seriously ****ed up is gonna happen within next few years. I dont trust the ruling classes who own the politicians.
I am very paranoid about it. I do think there is something behind WWII and the depression is connected to it and the economin crisis of recent times is connected to the Iraq, Afghanistan and any future wars we may have (eg Iran).
And, WWII and modern wars are connected in some way, I think
Knee jerk reaction I even say to myself is paranoid etc, but they got found out to be blatantly lying about Iraq and Afghanistan, so what else are they lying about. Seems very dodgy to me, very sinsister and doesnt sit right with me at all
Economic crisis was caused by the banks themselves, no question in my mind. They are greedy and stealing the publics money from under their noses under the guise of "oooh we have a crisis, we need help"
NO they are lying just like Iraq and Afghanistan.

I dont know the complete ins and outs of the reasoning behind Iraq and Afghan' but if in Iraq in particular we went knowing there were no WOMDs, then those in power at the time should be questioned accordingly.
IMO we were wrong not to have finished the job in the freeing of Kuwait. We gave Saddam the benefit of the doubt and a second chance and he preceded to annialate the Kurds & Shiites and push the boundaries until the Allies kicked him out. I personally beleive we have been justified in removing an Hitlerite tyrant irrespective of WOMDs or not.
Afghan? I think we are again justified to enter a country and remove those responsible for one of the worsed terrorist acts against a civilian population in modern times. What narks me is that the USA intelligence network(there's an anomaly if ever there was one) had a perfect opportunity prior to 911 to remove Ossie Bin Liner and bulked. It resulted in the murder of a prominent Afghan leader who was working with the west. Shameful period.
I agree with the Afghan war but know that its one we wont win unless we win the people, which we arent doing in certain areas. This type of war has failed in Vietnam and even as close as N.Ireland, where armed conflict against an enemy you cant identify hinders your chances of success. Fortunately both those conflicts ended once both sides came to the table and talked. But with the indoctrines that the Bin Liner Fundamentalists follow, talking is never ever going to be an option.

[oddballmisfitsFTW]

Originally Posted by StGeorge

I dont know the complete ins and outs of the reasoning behind Iraq and Afghan' but if in Iraq in particular we went knowing there were no WOMDs, then those in power at the time should be questioned accordingly.
IMO we were wrong not to have finished the job in the freeing of Kuwait. We gave Saddam the benefit of the doubt and a second chance and he preceded to annialate the Kurds & Shiites and push the boundaries until the Allies kicked him out. I personally beleive we have been justified in removing an Hitlerite tyrant irrespective of WOMDs or not.
Afghan? I think we are again justified to enter a country and remove those responsible for one of the worsed terrorist acts against a civilian population in modern times. What narks me is that the USA intelligence network(there's an anomaly if ever there was one) had a perfect opportunity prior to 911 to remove Ossie Bin Liner and bulked. It resulted in the murder of a prominent Afghan leader who was working with the west. Shameful period.
I agree with the Afghan war but know that its one we wont win unless we win the people, which we arent doing in certain areas. This type of war has failed in Vietnam and even as close as N.Ireland, where armed conflict against an enemy you cant identify hinders your chances of success. Fortunately both those conflicts ended once both sides came to the table and talked. But with the indoctrines that the Bin Liner Fundamentalists follow, talking is never ever going to be an option.

I dont know whole truth about Iraq/Afghanistan either but I lean more towards Afghanistan was more justifiable than Iraq, IF what the US/UK government tells us is true.
Problem is I dont trust a single word they say at all.
I do know that both Bin Laden and Saddam were formerly "allies" with the west. Both times it was the CIA who were involved. These sneaky guys are always around at the start of trouble are they not?
Who was involved at start of Vietnam, CIA again.
Something is not right and the governments of the west I think are treating us like gullible idiots.
I just wanna know what they are upto, what is the reason they causin so much **** around the world. Is it simply due to fundamentalists wanting to bring down the west? I dont believe that is the reason, because my philosophy now is, whatever the politicians tell you, thats a lie and the truth is hidden somewhere. They tell us over and over and over war on terror war on terror.
What could be true is that the west wants to control the middle east and Saddam and Taleban needed to be removed for them to do this. Next they might move onto Iran, which cause WWIII, if Iran have nuclear weapons.
Maybe thats what the sick, twisted ruling classes want though.

[StGeorge]

Originally Posted by oddballmisfitsFTW

I dont know whole truth about Iraq/Afghanistan either but I lean more towards Afghanistan was more justifiable than Iraq, IF what the US/UK government tells us is true.
Problem is I dont trust a single word they say at all.
I do know that both Bin Laden and Saddam were formerly "allies" with the west. Both times it was the CIA who were involved. These sneaky guys are always around at the start of trouble are they not?
Who was involved at start of Vietnam, CIA again.
Something is not right and the governments of the west I think are treating us like gullible idiots.
I just wanna know what they are upto, what is the reason they causin so much **** around the world. Is it simply due to fundamentalists wanting to bring down the west? I dont believe that is the reason, because my philosophy now is, whatever the politicians tell you, thats a lie and the truth is hidden somewhere. They tell us over and over and over war on terror war on terror.
What could be true is that the west wants to control the middle east and Saddam and Taleban needed to be removed for them to do this. Next they might move onto Iran, which cause WWIII, if Iran have nuclear weapons.
Maybe thats what the sick, twisted ruling classes want though.

Unfortunately there probably isnt much wrong with what you say. And thats worrying.

[Ketman]

Originally Posted by oddballmisfitsFTW

And, WWII and modern wars are connected in some way, I think
Knee jerk reaction I even say to myself is paranoid etc, but they got found out to be blatantly lying about Iraq and Afghanistan, so what else are they lying about. Seems very dodgy to me, very sinsister and doesnt sit right with me at all

No need to suppose a grand conspiracy that includes all wars ever fought. The war against Iraq was an opportunist war for the US and there is very little that can be said in defence of Bush-Blair. WWII is a different case, however. Fighting that war impoverished Britain for a generation. There were no material gains of any kind for us. The only motives in 1939 were those of sheer survival - fight and win, or go under. They should have acted earlier, and Churchill wanted them to, but he was out of the loop in those years. Instead they let the armed forces go to pot while the Nazis were building theirs up, and this had the effect of leading the Nazis to believe that they could act as they liked in Europe, and Britain would just let them. That was a mistake, but we have to take some blame for allowing them to make it. But, overall, it was one of the few wars in our history where we can be proud of our role.

[oddballmisfitsFTW]

Originally Posted by Ketman

No need to suppose a grand conspiracy that includes all wars ever fought. The war against Iraq was an opportunist war for the US and there is very little that can be said in defence of Bush-Blair. WWII is a different case, however. Fighting that war impoverished Britain for a generation. There were no material gains of any kind for us. The only motives in 1939 were those of sheer survival - fight and win, or go under. They should have acted earlier, and Churchill wanted them to, but he was out of the loop in those years. Instead they let the armed forces go to pot while the Nazis were building theirs up, and this had the effect of leading the Nazis to believe that they could act as they liked in Europe, and Britain would just let them. That was a mistake, but we have to take some blame for allowing them to make it. But, overall, it was one of the few wars in our history where we can be proud of our role.

there may well be no connection at all, but I dont discount it completely, I just keep at back of my mind and try not to worry bout it

if it was true there wouldnt be material gains for us the general population, but there would for the ruling classes.
The UK was in massive debt before the crisis, who was the money borrowed from? and then cos of the economic crisis the banks cry help, so taxpayer helps out the banks and UK has even more debt. Then to get rid of the debt (yeah right) cuts are made and taxes go up again.
Its all ****ed up and they are getting away with it before our very eyes. Alomst comical really how much they have PWNED us
To me it equates to "we got you by the short and curlies, now this is what we gonna do....."