[Angus]

Originally Posted by Shasown

Just to correct you there, child benefit is only paid to those whose children are resident in the UK


But just to really hack you off, migrant workers from EEA countries can claim Child Tax Credit and Working Tax Credit, which adds up to a lot more money in their pocket than Child Benefit.

Unfortunately not a lot can be done about that as its one of the benefits of the EEA policies that workers can pick up tax allowances from their own country and the country they work in.

Its good to know should you decide to work in Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Estonia, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Romania, Slovakia, or Slovenia you will be able to sign up for the pittances oops allowances their workers get.

Economic migrants from Eastern Europe are receiving child benefit for their children who do NOT live in the UK.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/majo...ng-abroad.html


This is from the Department of Works & Pensions website:

Benefits for children in EEA countries
UK Child Benefit and Child Tax Credit
If you are in the UK or another EEA country and

you are employed or self-employed in a job in which you must pay contributions under the UK scheme
or

you are getting one of one of the following UK benefits:
Contribution-based Jobseeker's Allowance
Guardian's Allowance
Incapacity Benefit
contribution-based Employment and Support Allowance
State Pension
Widows Benefit/Bereavement benefits
Industrial Injuries Disablement Benefit
you can usually get UK Child Benefit or Child Tax Credit for your children, even if they are living in another EEA member state.

[uvhater]

There are some people in this country who are just plain greedy.

I don't work (yep a stay-at-home Mum) but my husband does work full-time and we receive the relevant benefits for two children. I also receive Disability Living Allowance and Carer's Allowance for my eldest child. Our income is STILL no where near the £44K limit and we could manage without child benefit. I won't bore you with the details but I make sure the child benefit is spent ON the child and not the rest of the family. I always have and always will. One of my sisters got child benefit she just put it in her purse and spent it on whatever.

Absouletly crazy that all parents received this money no matter how much they earn, yes even the Royal Family. Can't tell me they even notice this amount in their bank account.

Believe you me if you are unemployed or on a very very low wage child benefit can be a lifesaver (sometime literally).

[arista]

Originally Posted by Shaun

Well, cutbacks have to be made...

Bang On Right
Shaun.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by KG.

I earnt a lot of respect for the Tories for this.

Yeah, I'm quite liking this Tory government, they know what cuts need to be made but they're starting with the top earners where there will be little disruption as opposed to last time they were in power when they started at the bottom

Originally Posted by ~Kerry~

You don't choose to get Child benefit. You GET it. You don't claim it. Once you have a child the parent gets it, full stop. It's a general thing. Not a benefit like signing on you nana

You still have to put a claim form in, you don't just set up a direct debit when you leave hospital. Most benefits don't require signing on you nana

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Shaun

Well, cutbacks have to be made...

Yes cutbacks do have to be made and a national debt does have to be repaid and in Camerons own words everyone will have to contribute accordingly. But this isn't everyone this is just the so called better off. Well some of them are but not all of them not by a long way. There are people who are absolutely vulnerable and they need these allowances to put food on the table and nobody can deny that - but there are others who 'cant afford' to buy their kids school uniforms but can afford £90 trainers because the child wants them, 'cant afford to pay for their child to go on school trips to broaden their minds but can afford DS consoles, is eligable for free school meals but manage to get McDonalds or Chinese takeaways 3 nights a week. There are those 'poor and vulnerable' who go out and get pi**ed every friday and/or Saturday, who smoke 20 fags a day.
While all the while the 'better off' are getting squeezed tighter and tighter by the government to pay more and more. Well if they carry on there will only be the few very rich and the rest will be all poor so there will be no one to squeeze and no pot to take from and then what the hell will happen

[Tom]

Originally Posted by rhino

Yes cutbacks do have to be made and a national debt does have to be repaid and in Camerons own words everyone will have to contribute accordingly. But this isn't everyone this is just the so called better off. Well some of them are but not all of them not by a long way. There are people who are absolutely vulnerable and they need these allowances to put food on the table and nobody can deny that - but there are others who 'cant afford' to buy their kids school uniforms but can afford £90 trainers because the child wants them, 'cant afford to pay for their child to go on school trips to broaden their minds but can afford DS consoles, is eligable for free school meals but manage to get McDonalds or Chinese takeaways 3 nights a week. There are those 'poor and vulnerable' who go out and get pi**ed every friday and/or Saturday, who smoke 20 fags a day.
While all the while the 'better off' are getting squeezed tighter and tighter by the government to pay more and more. Well if they carry on there will only be the few very rich and the rest will be all poor so there will be no one to squeeze and no pot to take from and then what the hell will happen

You're making one hell of a generalisation there. Its like saying all people who live on council estates are filthy chavs or alcoholics with no jobs or intentions of getting one when it couldn't be further from the truth in some areas

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Tom

You're making one hell of a generalisation there. Its like saying all people who live on council estates are filthy chavs or alcoholics with no jobs or intentions of getting one when it couldn't be further from the truth in some areas

No I'm not making any generalisations more than anybody else who assumes an income of 44k is a high income full stop. It is in some cases but it also depends on whether you live in an expensive area and have a large morgage. As always the government opt out of any means test because its easier, quicker and cheaper to go for the easy target. And I'm not generalising about all 'poor and vulnerable' families - of course there are families who desperately need allowances and benefits and of course they should be supported but I also know through my contact with lots of families with varying different circumstances that there's a lot more so called poor and vulnerable who have a lot more material possessions than the so called well off. Why shouldn't I comment on that when it is assumed that 'well off' people shouldn't be in debt, that its all their own fault cos they earn a fortune dont they so why should they just not be so greedy and stop spending and live within their means. Well why does that not apply to people on benefits who's kids come into school and say 'can you look after my DS for me till hometime'. Your assuming I'm saying that everyone on benefits is not entitled or squanders money or are scamming the system or are smoking or drinking it away or whatever. I'M NOT - I'm saying it about the ones who do and they do!!!! It is complicated to means test yes but that doesn't mean to say it isn't the only or right fair way - It has to be seen to be fair otherwise it wont be

[Tom4784]

I generally agree with Tom here, I like the idea that Higher Earning familes really shouldn't get as much benefits as they really don't need it, My parents don't earn £44,000 a year yet they live comfortably. As long as the people who do need it get it then I'm fine with the cuts to people who can live without.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Dezzy

I generally agree with Tom here, I like the idea that Higher Earning familes really shouldn't get as much benefits as they really don't need it, My parents don't earn £44,000 a year yet they live comfortably. As long as the people who do need it get it then I'm fine with the cuts to people who can live without.

hmmm problem is we all have things we could live without - people on benefits included - not all but some. I watch this thing on BBC1 on Mondays called Saints and Sinners and they're are some really lovely people out there who havn't had a great deal of the cards and deserve any help they're given but unfortunately they're are also people who claim everything and anything even when they arn't entitled and they abuse the system. It has to be seen to be fair and unfortunately its not when I am witness to such bad examples constantly. And it is on balance because I am not denying the genuinly deserving cases

[MTVN]

Considering the drastic cuts that the Conservatives are having to make, I can't see how people are kicking up a fuss over this.

They should count themselves lucky, they're in a lot better position than most and this will hit them far less hard than a lot of the people who will be affected by the forthcoming government cuts.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by rhino

No I'm not making any generalisations more than anybody else who assumes an income of 44k is a high income full stop. It is in some cases but it also depends on whether you live in an expensive area and have a large morgage. As always the government opt out of any means test because its easier, quicker and cheaper to go for the easy target. And I'm not generalising about all 'poor and vulnerable' families - of course there are families who desperately need allowances and benefits and of course they should be supported but I also know through my contact with lots of families with varying different circumstances that there's a lot more so called poor and vulnerable who have a lot more material possessions than the so called well off. Why shouldn't I comment on that when it is assumed that 'well off' people shouldn't be in debt, that its all their own fault cos they earn a fortune dont they so why should they just not be so greedy and stop spending and live within their means. Well why does that not apply to people on benefits who's kids come into school and say 'can you look after my DS for me till hometime'. Your assuming I'm saying that everyone on benefits is not entitled or squanders money or are scamming the system or are smoking or drinking it away or whatever. I'M NOT - I'm saying it about the ones who do and they do!!!! It is complicated to means test yes but that doesn't mean to say it isn't the only or right fair way - It has to be seen to be fair otherwise it wont be

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, more that you're making it sound like everyone is doing that. You're also missing the point that some poorer families have more material posessions to make themselves feel more well off. Its an ego boost if anything.

[arista]

[Angus]

Anyone who voted to keep Labour in power for 13 miserable years, has no right to be bleating and whingeing about the cuts that are having to be made now. Labour did what they have always done, blithely borrowing with no thoughts as to how we are supposed to pay it all back. The government has no choice but to implement severe cuts in public spending and we're ALL going to feel the pain, but let's put the blame where it richly deserves to be, on the incompetent and feckless useless Labour Party, finally kicked out before they could inflict any further damage on our country.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by angus58

Anyone who voted to keep Labour in power for 13 miserable years, has no right to be bleating and whingeing about the cuts that are having to be made now. Labour did what they have always done, blithely borrowing with no thoughts as to how we are supposed to pay it all back. The government has no choice but to implement severe cuts in public spending and we're ALL going to feel the pain, but let's put the blame where it richly deserves to be, on the incompetent and feckless useless Labour Party, finally kicked out before they could inflict any further damage on our country.

Your totally right but all the criticism will go to the elected party now and before long the labours will get back in because to have been elected is a lose lose situation. It will be this is what the Conservative/Lib Dems have done - not this is what labour done and have always done whenever they have been elected - they always leave the country in a complete mess and I hope the blame is where it should be and that people have long memories. Its a clean up situation and all of it is down to the last lousy government

[Angus]

Originally Posted by rhino

Your totally right but all the criticism will go to the elected party now and before long the labours will get back in because to have been elected is a lose lose situation. It will be this is what the Conservative/Lib Dems have done - not this is what labour done and have always done whenever they have been elected - they always leave the country in a complete mess and I hope the blame is where it should be and that people have long memories. Its a clean up situation and all of it is down to the last lousy government

Yep, it has always been Labour's modus operandi - grind the country into the ground, get kicked out, have the incoming government clean up their mess causing said government to become massively unpopular, then blithely be re-elected to do it all over again by a moronic electorate who have the memory of a goldfish. Thus the cycle is perpetuated

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by Tom

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, more that you're making it sound like everyone is doing that. You're also missing the point that some poorer families have more material posessions to make themselves feel more well off. Its an ego boost if anything.

I'm not saying that in fact I've repeated that it doesn't apply to everyone so I'm not generalising. I know some very hard working families that I absolutely think deserve extra help and they struggle to get a break in life sometimes. But I also know (and actually quite a lot) of people who refuse to do anything to try and change their situation because it would affect their entitlements (thats their description - entitled!!) And they appear to have much more than I do - so can you blame me. I don't think anyone entitled. It may be more complicated and expensive but means testing is a fairer way and you cant always just take the easiest route. I wouldn't deny that most people should have some material possessions but no one needs them more than someone else and (and I am only talking about people on benefits who appear to have every gadget going) how am I supposed to feel when I cant afford these things and I work and pay my taxes and always have. I cant afford lots of luxories yet am being told I'm better off. Don't forget the 44k plus also gets nearly 50% of their income taken away in tax and insurance before they start. And they dont get Family Credits that other do. Like I said things have to BE SEEN to be fair. There are people with low incomes that absolutely deserve to get more and there are people with higher incomes who I think deserve it too. And if they just put it away for their kide Uni fees I'm fine with that too because thats our future.

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by Tom

Sorry but should people whos household income is at least £44,000 really be whinging about not getting an extra £50 a week? They need to look at the bigger picture, there are people out there living off child benefits altogether with no extra income

They should not be complaining. It is A LOT of money to earn that per year. I know there are people out there.. who probably do work long long hours and get very stressed and deserve the amount of money they are getting but things need to change. The richer and getting richer. The poor are getting poorer It needs to be balanced out a bit!

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by Iceman

Do what I heard suggested today, Women who just sit at home and have 5-6 kids, well only let them get benefits for only two children.

If you can't afford to have more than 2 kids then you shouldn't have them. Why the f uck do I have to work and pay for other people's sprogs?? Disgusting.

I do feel sorry for people who genuinely out of a job though and are desperately looking for another one. I have been in that position too! Once you get a job.. you feel ever so grateful!

[Beastie]

Originally Posted by Lucy.

Well maybe if you ever know someone who earns over 44k and isn't in the picture perfect idea everyone seems to have that their loaded you'll think differently.

I know people who earn a lot of money and are stupid with their money.. they have to get the latest this.. the latest "designer gear" this that and the other.. people having loans on bloody sofa's!! If you can't afford something.. you should not have it alltogether!!!!

[Angus]

The government need to sort out the anomaly of a two parent working family where mum and dad earn, say £40,000 per year each - total income £80,000 and are still entitled to receive child benefit,and a one parent family earning £45,000 and no child benefit. If they're going to do this it needs to be done fairly.

[NettoSuperstar!]

Originally Posted by angus58

Anyone who voted to keep Labour in power for 13 miserable years, has no right to be bleating and whingeing about the cuts that are having to be made now. Labour did what they have always done, blithely borrowing with no thoughts as to how we are supposed to pay it all back. The government has no choice but to implement severe cuts in public spending and we're ALL going to feel the pain, but let's put the blame where it richly deserves to be, on the incompetent and feckless useless Labour Party, finally kicked out before they could inflict any further damage on our country.

Any idiot knows it was the banks that got us into this mess, if anything Labour are to blame for adopting Tory policy and allowing the financial sector to go unregulated...The main problem with the child benefit cuts is a family earning over 80 K will still be entitled to it but a family earning 44 k will lose out....I wouldnt trust Osbourne to do my 6 year olds maths homework

[Angus]

Originally Posted by NettoSuperstar!

Any idiot knows it was the banks that got us into this mess, if anything Labour are to blame for adopting Tory policy and allowing the financial sector to go unregulated...The main problem with the child benefit cuts is a family earning over 80 K will still be entitled to it but a family earning 44 k will lose out....I wouldnt trust Osbourne to do my 6 year olds maths homework

Spin it however you want, any IDIOT knows it was LABOUR that left this country in the worst economic mess it has ever been in - THEY were the ones in charge for 13 years so why try to apportion blame elsewhere? Labour couldn't organise a piss up at a brewery.

As regards child benefit it should be means tested and only the very poorest families should receive it, I would say with an income under £30k, and then only for the first two to stop feckless parents having kids they can't afford to look after. All child benefits should be scrapped for economic migrant's children NOT living in the UK. At least this government is making a start, but they need to implement much more savage cuts, especially in the bloated public sector.

It's time to pay the piper after 13 years of Labour profligacy.

[lostalex]

People should have to pay taxes to the government for having kids, not getting tax BREAKS for having kids. This is a step in the right direction.

For every child you have, you should be forced to pay exponentially more taxes, after all how much of our tax dollars/pounds go towards schools and education? How much of our tax money is spend on roads, hospitals etc. It's the people having more kids that puts more people on the roads, schools, hospitals.

People having kids should pay more tax because they are putting more burden on the system.

It's the childless people that should get the tax breaks, we are the ones being responsible.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by angus58

Spin it however you want, any IDIOT knows it was LABOUR that left this country in the worst economic mess it has ever been in - THEY were the ones in charge for 13 years so why try to apportion blame elsewhere? Labour couldn't organise a piss up at a brewery.

As regards child benefit it should be means tested and only the very poorest families should receive it, I would say with an income under £30k, and then only for the first two to stop feckless parents having kids they can't afford to look after. All child benefits should be scrapped for economic migrant's children NOT living in the UK. At least this government is making a start, but they need to implement much more savage cuts, especially in the bloated public sector.

It's time to pay the piper after 13 years of Labour profligacy.

Such sense - I'll vote for you Angus 58 - the banks got us into it did they - it was Labour Governmet who bailed the banks out and did they specify where the cash had to go to NO they effing didnt so what did the banks do - they gave it to the staff in bonuses that was our taxes and Labour just handed it over without any conditions then tried to say it was amoral when millions of pounds where put into Cheif executives pockets - Labour gave it to them - MORONS

[Tom]

Originally Posted by lostalex

People should have to pay taxes to the government for having kids, not getting tax BREAKS for having kids. This is a step in the right direction.

For every child you have, you should be forced to pay exponentially more taxes, after all how much of our tax dollars/pounds go towards schools and education? How much of our tax money is spend on roads, hospitals etc. It's the people having more kids that puts more people on the roads, schools, hospitals.

People having kids should pay more tax because they are putting more burden on the system.

It's the childless people that should get the tax breaks, we are the ones being responsible.

They'd save a lot of money by axing child tax credits, people solely on benefits can even claim tax credits and they don't work!! the benefits system is so messed up