[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

Ah so the packaging - if it is ever found - could implicate an innocent person too - someone who was keeping the residents bin area clean and clear of rubbish like the good landlord Mr Jefferies would do.

yes.

Originally Posted by JobsForTheBoys

The pizza box and the door will have vital pieces of the killers DNA on them.

The pizza box will have been disposed of for one reason only and thats because the killers DNA will have been on or inside the box. It will have been slightly harder to dispose of the front door in the same way as the pizza box and thats why the police have taken it away to be painstakenly scrutinised.

Yes there will be loads of fingerprints on it from delivery men and postmen etc. But what they are trying to find are fingerprints with pizza on them which can be matched to the pizza she bought. I think they can date fingerprints to within 6 hours.

One point to ponder on is that it seems highly likely she knew the killer to let him share her pizza because a random killer coming in off the street would not bother about sitting down and cooking or eating someones pizza after he has just killed somebody. And its unlikely she would have offered him a piece beforehand. So why would a stranger bother about taking a pizza box???

I have referred to the killer as a "he" because I dont think its a "she"

'The missing pizza box and your assumption that it has been disposed of because it holds vital DNA clues' - is precisely that. An assumption. It could have been disposed of by Joanna herself, innocently and into the bin outside. There is no 'one reason only' about it. It is however the only lame thing the police appear to have.

The front door is 'slightly harder to dispose of than a pizza box' (wtte). Feck me... no **** Sherlock !! Sorry.. but come on..... that type of comment just cannot be taken seriously.

They are trying to find prints that match prints with pizza on them and the type of pizza Jo bought? Now I would say that really sounds like a real pie in the sky idea but if some expert out there cares to explain, I'm open to consideration. I think I get what you mean but I really do think that's fairy tale stuff. (but hey, you could be right... I just happen to think it sounds too bizarre to be real).

The missing pizza box is a complete red herring imo. But we shall wait and see.

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

Well put Jobsfortheboys - I consider the packaging (inner) to hold vital dna as it would have only been handled by Joanna and the culprit - if the culprit swept the apartment clean as to leave no evidence as what had taken place on the evening of the 17th - probably no need for wearing marigolds etc to clean up - person must have been mighty relieved that the bins had been emptied on the Tuesday especially once the police had made a link with the timeline of the purchase of the pizza and Joanna's murder.

Well put my bum. You couldn't answer the question yourself but had to get someone else to try pick up the pieces mrscolumbo. I'll ask you again: what vital DNA do you think the inner packaging will hold apart from possible fingerprints? What DNA exactly?

As for the rest (no need for marigolds).

Every good killer keeps a fresh unused supply of Marigolds in their inner jacket pocket, didn't you know?

[Fetch The Bolt Cutters]

did mrscolumbo join tibb just to solve this mystery

[mrscolumbo]

No Pyramid thats news to me about the marigolds lol - however as I said early if the (inner) packaging has fingerprints of someone who claim they were else where after the purchase then case closed.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Well put my bum. You couldn't answer the question yourself but had to get someone else to try pick up the pieces mrscolumbo. I'll ask you again: what vital DNA do you think the inner packaging will hold apart from possible fingerprints? What DNA exactly?

The killers DNA. Licking their fingers then grabbing another piece of pizza.

And another thing. I dont think she walked from the pub and around all those shops either.

[Pyramid*]

Oh.... one small point to consider.

Given external temperatures on the weekend in question: it's not beyond reasonable doubt that the killer was wearing gloves to keep their little handies warm..... and if so, could very well blow the fingerprint theories on boxes / doors / inner pizza wrappings etc right out of the window.

[mrscolumbo]

yeah I often cook and eat in my sheepskin mits lol.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Oh.... one small point to consider.

Given external temperatures on the weekend in question: it's not beyond reasonable doubt that the killer was wearing gloves to keep their little handies warm..... and if so, could very well blow the fingerprint theories on boxes / doors / inner pizza wrappings etc right out of the window.

Who eats pizza with gloves on?????????????

[Zippy]

Bloody hell. Everybodies a detective!

Im sure the police and forensic scientists are two steps ahead of any of you lot.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

yeah I often cook and eat in my sheepskin mits lol.

I think she's been on the pop.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by Scott

did mrscolumbo join tibb just to solve this mystery

It would appear so. Not that so far, any great headway has been made.

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

No Pyramid thats news to me about the marigolds lol - however as I said early if the (inner) packaging has fingerprints of someone who claim they were else where after the purchase then case closed.

Nope: you didnt say that. You've changed your slant on the story - previously you were discussing the box.

Originally Posted by JobsForTheBoys

The killers DNA. Licking their fingers then grabbing another piece of pizza.

I thought the killer didn't have the time nor inclination to cook and eat pizza??

Oh... you mean because she shared that same pizza. Then went out walkabout with the same person afterwards (bearing in mind that CJ said he saw what the thought to be Joanna and 2 others).

And another thing. I dont think she walked from the pub and around all those shops either.

I'm not entirely convinced that she walked all the way home from the pub/shops either though my mind tells me that if CJ was as nosey as he's been made out to be,that he'd have heard a car stopping to let her out, car doors being closed shut, see her walking down the path etc.....

[mrscolumbo]

Hang on jobsfortheboys hardly call Bollinger 'pop' - seriously though can't agree with your opinion that she wasn't on foot between shopping after leaving the pub - the route she took and the phone call to her best friend works out correct google earthed the direction she would have taken in cojunction with the timeline

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

yeah I often cook and eat in my sheepskin mits lol.

mrscolumbo - you are now inferring that the killer cooked ate the pizza. My my, this is getting funnier and funnier!

Originally Posted by JobsForTheBoys

Who eats pizza with gloves on?????????????

You are assuming that the killer ate the pizza. (with or without gloves on.... yes, I'm kidding about the last part).

Originally Posted by Zippy

Bloody hell. Everybodies a detective!

Im sure the police and forensic scientists are two steps ahead of any of you lot.

Actually no, people on here are discussing the what, if, hows, whys - it's called discussion on a very topicial subject.

I'd say the police and forensic scientists (you don't have to be a scientist to be linked to forensics.... just thought I'd tip you the nod) have as much clue as any of us. Given that they are the experts yet are still not in a position to confirm even WHERE Joanna was killed (which intimates that after so many days, they have still not been able to determine if she was killed at her property - in or out of it), whether she had ate the pizza or not etc. So you might want to reassess your last statement there !

N

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by JobsForTheBoys

I think she's been on the pop.

cheeky bugger!

Fraid not. Back to work tomorrow and driving. Nae booze allowed.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

You are assuming that the killer ate the pizza. (with or without gloves on.... yes, I'm kidding about the last part).

Yes, why else would he dispose of the box.

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by JobsForTheBoys

Yes, why else would he dispose of the box.

Who said he did?

Jo could have taken it out to the bin herself then the bins were emptied a few days later (before police realised) - she could have been doing precisely that having eaten the pizza herself - and that is where she met her killer - after she had put box in bin.

Feck... this is worse than Cluedo!!

[mrscolumbo]

Pyramid - no it is not my obsevation that the pizza was eaten by Joanna and company - have not made any comment about who eat the pizza if indeed the pizza had been consumed - but if you care for an opnion I reckon the pet cat had munched on it cos it had either been left out on the side uncooked - taken into account that the poor animal had been left alone and unfed since 17th Dec. - ready for going in the oven - or it had been taken out of the oven put on the side cooked but before it could be consumed Joanna met her death - simple!

[Zippy]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

So you might want to reassess your last statement there !

N

No, it needs no reassessment. Nothing you think up is gonna be new to them. Plus they have access to ALL the available info AND are probably learning more by the hour. So they certainly are two steps ahead of you. Sorry, they just are.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

Who said he did?

Jo could have taken it out to the bin herself then the bins were emptied a few days later (before police realised) - she could have been doing precisely that having eaten the pizza herself - and that is where she met her killer - after she had put box in bin.

Feck... this is worse than Cluedo!!

Hmmmmmm, I suppose so but what was the motive, and are you saying she was killed outside the flat?

[JobsForTheBoys]

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

Pyramid - no it is not my obsevation that the pizza was eaten by Joanna and company - have not made any comment about who eat the pizza if indeed the pizza had been consumed - but if you care for an opnion I reckon the pet cat had munched on it cos it had either been left out on the side uncooked - taken into account that the poor animal had been left alone and unfed since 17th Dec. - ready for going in the oven - or it had been taken out of the oven put on the side cooked but before it could be consumed Joanna met her death - simple!

So if the cat ate the pizza, what happened to the box????? Did it eat that as well?

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

Pyramid - no it is not my obsevation that the pizza was eaten by Joanna and company - have not made any comment about who eat the pizza if indeed the pizza had been consumed - but if you care for an opnion I reckon the pet cat had munched on it cos it had either been left out on the side uncooked - taken into account that the poor animal had been left alone and unfed since 17th Dec. - ready for going in the oven - or it had been taken out of the oven put on the side cooked but before it could be consumed Joanna met her death - simple!

Ah.....it was the cat who dunnit. Is that where you're coming from? Starving from 2 days of no grub, it spied the soggy pizza, and scoffed the lot. When it realised that it might get into trouble, it grabbed the box and the inner wrapping, nipped out the catflat, jumped up and snuck the empty box in the bin, knowing the binmen were due. And they say cats aren't clever!!

on a more serious note: I'd need to go check on this, but I am almost (almost) sure that no pizza was found? Can't be bothered going to check.

Originally Posted by Zippy

No, it needs no reassessment. Nothing you think up is gonna be new to them. Plus they have access to ALL the available info AND are probably learning more by the hour. So they certainly are two steps ahead of you. Sorry, they just are.

NOOOO !!!! Say it's not true.... Feck me, no flies on you eh!

None of which alters the fact that they admitted in the Press Conf today that they still cannot determine where she was killed, time of death etc..... and indeed, are not commenting on whether they are looking for 'a killer' or 'killers'.

Not that any of that should prevent me or anyone else on this thread having a discussion on what we think may or may not have happened. I don't believe there is a law against partaking in discussing the possibilities in an unsolved murder case - which is all we are doing.

Keeps us all off the streets and being killers, so it's not all bad.

[mrscolumbo]

jobsfortheboys - no the packaging was removed by the culprit IMHO several days later ie between the timeline 17th-19th during a clean-up process!

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by JobsForTheBoys

Hmmmmmm, I suppose so but what was the motive, and are you saying she was killed outside the flat?

I'm saying it's a possibilty - given that the party goer out having a smoke heard screams, the screams could have been connected - who knows!

Originally Posted by JobsForTheBoys

So if the cat ate the pizza, what happened to the box????? Did it eat that as well?

lol.... beat me to it (see my last reply) Now don't be acting dumb here...you know that cats are fastidiously tidy - it was clearing up after itself and took it out to the bin itself, bin men came.... you know the rest.

[JobsForTheBoys]

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

jobsfortheboys - no the packaging was removed by the culprit IMHO several days later ie between the timeline 17th-19th during a clean-up process!

Why would the culprit get rid of the pizza box if he didnt have any pizza?????

[Pyramid*]

Originally Posted by mrscolumbo

jobsfortheboys - no the packaging was removed by the culprit IMHO several days later ie between the timeline 17th-19th during a clean-up process!

Okay columbo. What happened to the pal of Jo's that was coming around on the Saturday to help Jo clean up the messy flat? (Actually...now I say that.... what indeed happened to that..... serious thought???) Did Jo cancel that arrangment? I can't actually recall reading / hearing anything about that. ?

[JobsForTheBoys]

Originally Posted by Pyramid*

lol.... beat me to it (see my last reply) Now don't be acting dumb here...you know that cats are fastidiously tidy - it was clearing up after itself and took it out to the bin itself, bin men came.... you know the rest.

I honestly dont think the pizza box went into the dustbin.