[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

Picking up from where I left off, I would like to now compare the two societies I have lived in USA and the UK. Both societies, where Black is a minority.

They both have their problems of racism, and inequalities, but the difference is, the steps taken to rectify or help the situation. I have lived in both places, and I can tell you this, I feel a lot more welcome, and integrated in the US, than in the UK! Black people mix a lot more with other races in the US than they do here. I am not saying they dont have racism and stuff there, they do, very much so. But the point is, they have taken the steps to make a change. I have always felt like Black people in the UK were not oppressed, but suppressed. Like a lot of them dont feel like they should have the same opportunities as the white people. Affirmative action was used in teh US, to help minorities get more jobs, and it actually worked. It gets a lot of criticism, but it worked. a black person growing up in the us know that if they get an education, they have a great chance of belonging to the elite in the society. Not so much here. Of course, its still a work in progress, but the point is, the steps were taken. I feel like the UK is at the same point as the US was back in the 80s, during the LA riots. I could never see something like that ever happening again, because people dont feel that desperate anymore.

The point of this post is that, it seems like people in this country do not want to see anything change. They are happy with the status quo. And I dont see the Black people themselves doing anything to change that. Again, probably because they dont feel entitled.

So to me a big problem is, in the UK, people dont want to hear it! Period.

Seriously? I mean, I've never lived there of course, but racial divisions in the USA seem far more prominent than here in the UK. Those figures I quoted up above were about the USA from here http://www.apa.org/pi/ses/resources/...sheet-erm.aspx and it really doesn't look to me like the US is some beacon of racial progressiveness

And the South. There's so much racism in the South, they even still have the Confederacy flag flying above the Louisiana State Courthouse

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Seriously? I mean, I've never lived there of course, but racial divisions in the USA seem far more prominent than here in the UK. Those figures I quoted up above were about the USA from here http://www.apa.org/pi/ses/resources/...sheet-erm.aspx and it really doesn't look to me like the US is some beacon of racial progressiveness

And the South. There's so much racism in the South, they even still have the Confederacy flag flying above the Louisiana State Courthouse

See, this is why its always dangerous to listen to what the numbers tell you, or what TV shows you. I have lived, there, and I tell you from experience.

If you have a college degree in the US, an go try to get a job, I believe you have the same chance as anyone to get that job. The thing is, its gonna take some time to change the mentality, that you can only succeed through sport, or entertainment. BUt its getting there.
Affirmative action was that if you have a company that doesnt have a cetain amount of minority working for you, and you have a choice between hiring a white or minority with the same qualification, you had to hire the minority. It was well criticized, but people followed them, or they were heavily penalized financially!

As for the mix of society its a lot more than it is here.
And its not just with white and black, in the UK (london at least), its with everyone. People all live seperately, its like unoficial apartheid!

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by Wildcat!

See, this is why its always dangerous to listen to what the numbers tell you, or what TV shows you. I have lived, there, and I tell you from experience.

If you have a college degree in the US, an go try to get a job, I believe you have the same chance as anyone to get that job. The thing is, its gonna take some time to change the mentality, that you can only succeed through sport, or entertainment. BUt its getting there.

As for the mix of society its a lot more than it is here.
And its not just with white and black, in the UK (london at least), its with everyone. People all live seperately, its like unoficial apartheid!

Because there's no black ghettos in the US? Come on, the country's well known for racially segregated neighbourhoods in a lot of places. Personally I find statistics more reliable than anecdotal evidence which doesn't really offer a wide perspective

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Because there's no black ghettos in the US? Come on, the country's well known for racially segregated neighbourhoods in a lot of places. Personally I find statistics more reliable than anecdotal evidence which doesn't really offer a wide perspective

Of course there are black ghettos. But you cant just use the example of big city ghettos, you have to look a the whole country. I have family everywhere in the US, and I know that there is a lot more racial harmony!

And its not like I am american, I am not here talking up my country, I am telling you from what I have seen. From talking to black people here. Their state of minds, their goals for the future etc. I just feel like a lot of black people here feel like they have no hope. ANd hte worst part, they seem to accept it!

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Because there's no black ghettos in the US? Come on, the country's well known for racially segregated neighbourhoods in a lot of places. Personally I find statistics more reliable than anecdotal evidence which doesn't really offer a wide perspective

Are you serious? Umm, America is by far the most racially diverse country in the world,. OF course when you have more diversity, you have more racial conflicts. It's stupid to compare the Uk to America, when America has only 52% white population, but UK has 80% white population.

Obviously, the less diversity you have, the less racial conflict you have. Does that mean that LESS diversity is a GOOD thing????

Wow, countries with less races have less racism... who would have thunk it?? DUH!!! lol

FUnny how China has very little racism against blacks.. gee, maybe because they have almost NO black people living there!!!

[MTVN]

Originally Posted by lostalex

Are you serious? Umm, America is by far the most racially diverse country in the world,. OF course when you have more diversity, you have more racial conflicts. It's stupid to compare the Uk to America, when America has only 52% white population, but UK has 80% white population.

Obviously, the less diversity you have, the less racial conflict you have. Does that mean that LESS diversity is a GOOD thing????

Wow, countries with less races have less racism... who would have thunk it?? DUH!!! lol

FUnny how China has very little racism against blacks.. gee, maybe because they have almost NO black people living there!!!

What an awful straw man that is, do you actually follow the thread and the discussion or do you just pull out some quotes out of context and proceed with a bizarre rant?

Racial segregation is not an inevitable consequence of racial diversity like you seem to think it is

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by MTVN

What an awful straw man that is, do you actually follow the thread and the discussion or do you just pull out some quotes out of context and proceed with a bizarre rant?

Racial segregation is not an inevitable consequence of racial diversity like you seem to think it is

so show me then this african country that does racial diversity so much better than the US? South Africa maybe? where they round up Zimbawean immigrants and set them on fire?

That's black south africans setting black zimbaweans on fire, because to south africans, zimbaweans are a different race to them.

But you wanna talk about race relations in America?? seriously?

[ElProximo]

Originally Posted by lostalex

FUnny how China has very little racism against blacks.. gee, maybe because they have almost NO black people living there!!!

China has serious problems with Blacks where they do live. Africans living in China overstay their visas and to be perfectly honest have been causing plenty of trouble in China.
As usual, when Chinese authorities simply try and apply the laws (and actually LESS strictly than they do on their own people) there are near riots in the streets.

Youtube video

Keep in mind his African mates decided, rather than immediately rush him to a hospital, decide to dance his dying body.

China has serious and horrifying 'race riots' which, surprise surprise, involve 'Turks' (Muslims).
I can post the LEAST horrifying videos and in a way this is a huge lesson to those thinking they have it bad because police in the UK may shoot you if you try and shoot them:
Here they storm streets murdering and beating Han Chinese (girls, men whatever):

Youtube video

I have personally been pulled from crowds after Muslims attempted to cajole and aggravate the crowd into racist taunts and trouble at me.
I've also met and shaken hands with Muslims in China happy to meet a westerner for the first time.
I have also been subjected to all kinds of racist slurs, mocking my physical appearance (skin colour, native british facial features etc) by Han Chinese.

Chinese have all manner of racist incidents as broadly as 'Cantonese versus Mandarin' kinds of pointless nonsense,
or,
all kinds of various incidents between some 50 different ethnicities around China which can go as far as 'race riots' to murders.

In the broader spectrum - the racism between Japanese, Koreans and Chinese would BLOW YOUR MIND.
It is a level so FAR BEYOND anything you see in the highly over-sensitive UK as to become downright comical.
Someone on TV mentions 'nappy hair' in the USA and you would think a nation mourns in self-shame.
In China there are words for Japanese (and vice-versa) that make '******' seem like a compliment.

On the bright side. They could care less if someone calls them 'chink' or some adorable funny endearing word compared to what they consider 'real racism'.
They have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA why someone on UK television is 'apologizing to India' for a bad impersonation.

..which reminds me. we don't have time to get into the most outrageous racism between Indians and Chinese.

Anyways, not really disagreeing with you but just thought I'd share.

[lostalex]

Originally Posted by ElProximo

Anyways, not really disagreeing with you but just thought I'd share.

Very enlightening.

[letmein]

America is by far more racially progressive and aware. The country has a black man as President for god's sake! That would never happen in Europe -- at least not anytime soon. Yes, the US has a problem with racism, just like every other country in the world. However, the problems are more out in the open and discussed, and minority groups are protected. America is the only country that is officially a melting pot. It's amazing that the place didn't implode due to having so many different cultures all living under the same roof. Europe is a million times more racist than America. What flies in Europe, would never fly in the US. The US has had to deal with race relations because everyone is so diverse. In Europe, racism is more easily swept under the carpet, and the population is more ignorant when it comes to people who are not of the same background as themselves. Look at Germany. They still believe that the Jews have too much influence. Some things never change. In America, speech is protected, even hate speech. With this taken into account, minorities have still been able to survive since the public has been forcibly educated on ethnic differences. Europe is having problems adapting to the melting pot model. Its countries are not used to diversity. One only has to look towards America to see how it can actually work and be beneficial. America, which is a much younger country, is light years ahead of the rest of the world, which is light years older. It's extraordinary.

[Wildcat!]

Originally Posted by MTVN

Seriously? I mean, I've never lived there of course, but racial divisions in the USA seem far more prominent than here in the UK. Those figures I quoted up above were about the USA from here http://www.apa.org/pi/ses/resources/...sheet-erm.aspx and it really doesn't look to me like the US is some beacon of racial progressiveness

And the South. There's so much racism in the South, they even still have the Confederacy flag flying above the Louisiana State Courthouse

And racists are gonna be racists. My point is how much society gives you a chance. Even if someone has a business, and they are racist, they have to follow the law. So those racists had to hire some black people or they were fined!

Like I said, I am not saying there arent racists, just that people fought for their rights, and got at least a fighting chance.