[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by The Baby Jesus

Not for the first time in this thread, you have completely missed the point. Why wonder at my reluctance to acknowledge what a dreadful freakishly event this was, when I've actually referenced a number of times how dreadful this crime was? So wonder no more.

My only issue, is the completely abhorrent revenge killing/torture being called for in this thread. That's it. I'm not excusing the killing, I'm not ignoring it, and I'm certainly not giving cover to Islamic terrorism.

Murder and torture are equally wrong, whether committed by a so-called soldier of Allah, or whether it's done on my behalf by a government, for the sole purpose of revenge. That this should be so controversial is completely incomprehensible to me.

Punish these men for their crimes within the legal framework that exists. Nothing more, nothing less.

in a nut shell, good people have to kill bad people to keep the rest of the good people safe.

bad people kill good people and good people kill good people without wanting to,

all this eye for an eye making the whole world blind is utter nonsense.

the human race has survived for thousands of years killing each other, it can be with a gun or a knife, or starvation.

[Kyle]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

in a nut shell, good people have to kill bad people to keep the rest of the good people safe.

bad people kill good people and good people kill good people without wanting to,

all this eye for an eye making the whole world blind is utter nonsense.

the human race has survived for thousands of years killing each other, it can be with a gun or a knife, or starvation.

I don't quite agree with you Sheriff we aren't savages anymore we shouldn't live by those standards.

The fact is these people were given trial and sentenced within the system of our law and that's good enough for me.

Making examples of these people will turn them into martyrs and that's exactly what they want. Sentence them like you would sentence any British citizen and let them rot away without ever gaining any more publicity.

[Candy Annie Cane]

Originally Posted by ChristMASS EFFECT

I don't quite agree with you Sheriff we aren't savages anymore we shouldn't live by those standards.

The fact is these people were given trial and sentenced within the system of our law and that's good enough for me.

Making examples of these people will turn them into martyrs and that's exactly what they want. Sentence them like you would sentence any British citizen and let them rot away without ever gaining any more publicity.

Agreed

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

in a nut shell, good people have to kill bad people to keep the rest of the good people safe.

bad people kill good people and good people kill good people without wanting to,

all this eye for an eye making the whole world blind is utter nonsense.

the human race has survived for thousands of years killing each other, it can be with a gun or a knife, or starvation.

I think we'll all be pretty safe if they're locked up in prison, so anything extra to that is purely for revenge, and not punishment.

It's not utter nonsense at all, and if you claim it is, then you need to expand on your reasons for it. We have laws in place to deal with criminals, that don't include murder.

The last point doesn't make any sense to me, because it treats the starting point and conclusion as the same, regardless of what happens in the middle. We know better now, and our morality has demonstrably evolved.

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by The Baby Jesus

I think we'll all be pretty safe if they're locked up in prison, so anything extra to that is purely for revenge, and not punishment.

It's not utter nonsense at all, and if you claim it is, then you need to expand on your reasons for it. We have laws in place to deal with criminals, that don't include murder.

The last point doesn't make any sense to me, because it treats the starting point and conclusion as the same, regardless of what happens in the middle. We know better now, and our morality has demonstrably evolved.

i think you using jesus as your user name as gone to your head!, eye for an eye making the whole world blind is such an unrealistic frame of mind, in the world we live in today.

if you set out to take another life you should lose the right to keep yours.

i dont want these men tortured but a quick end to their lifes would not go against my mind set.

[Ammi]

..nothing is going to change the fact that Lee is dead or the horrific way he was killed for his family or take away that pain...those are nightmares that they will live with forever, no matter whether his murderers are alive or dead..there will be no 'closure' to this for them...but they wanted to be shot down by the police, they wanted a quick death and not to face what they did..why should they have what they wanted...they don't deserve that, too many people who do terrible things, don't live to face their crimes..if it was a loved one of mine, I would not want him dead at all, I would not feel they deserved that and that would be something else that would haunt my life...

[thesheriff443]

Originally Posted by Ammi

..nothing is going to change the fact that Lee is dead or the horrific way he was killed for his family or take away that pain...those are nightmares that they will live with forever, no matter whether his murderers are alive or dead..there will be no 'closure' to this for them...but they wanted to be shot down by the police, they wanted a quick death and not to face what they did..why should they have what they wanted...they don't deserve that, too many people who do terrible things, don't live to face their crimes..if it was a loved one of mine, I would not want him dead at all, I would not feel they deserved that and that would be something else that would haunt my life...

how do you know what will bring closure for lee's family?, you dont.
what you want and others want is very different.

you should go and ask the victims familes of rapists and murderers that have been thru the prison sytem only to murderand rape again, what their view is.

[Ammi]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

how do you know what will bring closure for lee's family?, you dont.
what you want and others want is very different.

you should go and ask the victims familes of rapists and murderers that have been thru the prison sytem only to murderand rape again, what their view is.

..no, I could never know how they feel, I can't imagine it and would never want to...no one who hasn't been where they are right now could...so I, like anyone else can just go with what we feel and which is also based on our own personal experiences as well and I have had a close member of my family who was the victim of a violent crime..that's something that we all live with and will continue to because emotional scars don't heal so quickly as any physical ones do...but what I do know is that I could never wish on the mother of the person who did it, the same thing to have to live with ...and it would only make me feel worse to know that someone else felt the same emotional pain..I know that with complete certainty....so I would never, ever wish death or physical harm on anyone....and it would also make me no better than they are...

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

i think you using jesus as your user name as gone to your head!, eye for an eye making the whole world blind is such an unrealistic frame of mind, in the world we live in today.

if you set out to take another life you should lose the right to keep yours.

i dont want these men tortured but a quick end to their lifes would not go against my mind set.

Being against murder, doesn't make me a hippy. The world we live in today is considerably less violent than the world that existed in biblical times.

I just don't understand (and I hopefully never will) how a civilised society can say the punishment for murdering someone should be murder.

[sassysocks]

Originally Posted by thesheriff443

i think you using jesus as your user name as gone to your head!, eye for an eye making the whole world blind is such an unrealistic frame of mind, in the world we live in today.

if you set out to take another life you should lose the right to keep yours.

i dont want these men tortured but a quick end to their lifes would not go against my mind set.

The whole world knows them for what they are - cowards and savages. One hell of a thing to be famous for. I don't see why taxpayers should pay for them to be fed and watered for years to come - sometimes the word 'civilized' leaves a nasty taste in the mouth. I hope karma gets the creeps.

Originally Posted by sassysocks

The whole world knows them for what they are - cowards and savages. One hell of a thing to be famous for. I don't see why taxpayers should pay for them to be fed and watered for years to come - sometimes the word 'civilized' leaves a nasty taste in the mouth. I hope karma gets the creeps.

When you reduce people down like this it makes it easier to avoid thinking.

[sassysocks]

Originally Posted by The Baby Jesus

When you reduce people down like this it makes it easier to avoid thinking.

Where does over-thinking get us? A civilized country where un-civilized cowards can come and brutally murder our brave young men, and then be given food, water and shelter for the rest of their miserable, worthless lives.

Originally Posted by sassysocks

Where does over-thinking get us? A civilized country where un-civilized cowards can come and brutally murder our brave young men, and then be given food, water and shelter for the rest of their miserable lives.

Yeah - you're right. Just out of interest, how many terrorist attacks like this happen every year?

When one side believes they have the power of the almighty on their side, then meeting them force to force isn't going to do anything, but deprogramming can and does happen regularly.

[sassysocks]

Originally Posted by The Baby Jesus

I think we'll all be pretty safe if they're locked up in prison, so anything extra to that is purely for revenge, and not punishment.

It's not utter nonsense at all, and if you claim it is, then you need to expand on your reasons for it. We have laws in place to deal with criminals, that don't include murder.

The last point doesn't make any sense to me, because it treats the starting point and conclusion as the same, regardless of what happens in the middle. We know better now, and our morality has demonstrably evolved.

Isn't the problem that the morality of some has not evolved - it is as primiative as biblical times. Such cretins hide behind banners such as Allah to attempt to make heroes of themselves, because they are far from it, the only way they will ever make their names known in the big wide world. Two sad losers who only actually succeeded in making a martyr of someone who represented something they claim to hate so much. The only hero here was Lee Rigby who unfortunately paid the price for their inadequacies.