[DemolitionRed]

I have Hunts co-authored book "Direct Democracy" but its not presently available on Amazon or Waterstones. I have however managed to find some relevant sections here though https://whatwouldvirchowdo.files.wor...odel_party.pdf

Here are a few snippets:

The problem with the NHS is not one of resources. Rather, it is that the system remains a centrally run, state monopoly, designed over half a century ago.
We should fund patients, either through the tax system or by way of universal insurance, to purchase health care from the provider of their choice.

Rather than a lack of resources, the reason for the NHS's poor performance lies in its structure. The NHS designed over half a century ago, at a time of rationing and deep poverty. It was, and remains, a child of its time, conceived on the principle that the benefit state should be a monopoly provider.

Our ambitions should be to break down the barriers between private and public provision, in effect denationalising the provision of health care in Britain, so extending to all the choices currently available only to the minority who opt for private provision.


This book is worth buying if you can eventually get hold of it, though don't take much notice of statistics because they come without an ounce of evidence. What is concerning is the lengthy talks about Conservative ideas to privatize state schools Because what is being suggested in this book is exactly what is going on in our new 'academies' in our present times.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

I have Hunts co-authored book "Direct Democracy" but its not presently available on Amazon or Waterstones. I have however managed to find some relevant sections here though https://whatwouldvirchowdo.files.wor...odel_party.pdf

Here are a few snippets:

The problem with the NHS is not one of resources. Rather, it is that the system remains a centrally run, state monopoly, designed over half a century ago.
We should fund patients, either through the tax system or by way of universal insurance, to purchase health care from the provider of their choice.

Rather than a lack of resources, the reason for the NHS's poor performance lies in its structure. The NHS designed over half a century ago, at a time of rationing and deep poverty. It was, and remains, a child of its time, conceived on the principle that the benefit state should be a monopoly provider.

Our ambitions should be to break down the barriers between private and public provision, in effect denationalising the provision of health care in Britain, so extending to all the choices currently available only to the minority who opt for private provision.


This book is worth buying if you can eventually get hold of it, though don't take much notice of statistics because they come without an ounce of evidence. What is concerning is the lengthy talks about Conservative ideas to privatize state schools Because what is being suggested in this book is exactly what is going on in our new 'academies' in our present times.

Thankyou so much for that DR, so interesting and terrifying at the same time :/
There is too I'd say a drive to deprofessionalise teaching, as it's impossible to do that with health provision the alternative is to get rid.
By 2020 there will be nothing left, nothing.

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

Thankyou so much for that DR, so interesting and terrifying at the same time :/
There is too I'd say a drive to deprofessionalise teaching, as it's impossible to do that with health provision the alternative is to get rid.
By 2020 there will be nothing left, nothing.

They are certainly trying to deprofessionalize a lot of the health care departments Kizzy. My GP now has one doctor on duty at any one time and they tend to be newly qualified GP's; the rest are nurse practitioners.

A friend of mine who has FM had been referred to a pain clinic in Leeds and waited a staggering three months to be seen, became suspicious that the man who was asking her to go through her symptoms whilst he busily typed up her notes on a computer, wasn't a doctor. It turned out he wasn't even a qualified nurse but someone who had been trained to say all the right things. To make a comparison, I used a pain clinic in London a few years ago and I was seen by a doctor and offered a whole load of options (medicine wise). All my friend was offered was a therapy group to talk about her pain.

This is what happens when you have medicine for profit business. Less and less will become available to us and eventually we will be expected, just like our American friends, to have insurance cover or get the barest minimum.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

They are certainly trying to deprofessionalize a lot of the health care departments Kizzy. My GP now has one doctor on duty at any one time and they tend to be newly qualified GP's; the rest are nurse practitioners.

A friend of mine who has FM had been referred to a pain clinic in Leeds and waited a staggering three months to be seen, became suspicious that the man who was asking her to go through her symptoms whilst he busily typed up her notes on a computer, wasn't a doctor. It turned out he wasn't even a qualified nurse but someone who had been trained to say all the right things. To make a comparison, I used a pain clinic in London a few years ago and I was seen by a doctor and offered a whole load of options (medicine wise). All my friend was offered was a therapy group to talk about her pain.

This is what happens when you have medicine for profit business. Less and less will become available to us and eventually we will be expected, just like our American friends, to have insurance cover or get the barest minimum.

Actually you're right my sister is an ANP and she is constantly reminding practice managers that are constantly 'suggesting' things ...Like ANPs doing care home visits, most complex care issues are way out of her competency. Now you would think they would be happy for her to point this out and save embarrassment should it be discovered? Not so.
She is taking her ANP training and going back to the minor injuries unit she left to take a the position in GP practice.
I'm glad your friend found out when she did, it's the norm now to be placed with ANP if you don't specify you require a doctors appointment. Has your friend joined any FM support groups? they are a great place to find out about available treatments.
I am seriously considering getting some health insurance, my son has a congenital heart condition and I'm just not as confident as I'd like to be. He was due a 2yr check last november, I've chased it up but he's still not been sent for!

[user104658]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

I am seriously considering getting some health insurance, my son has a congenital heart condition and I'm just not as confident as I'd like to be. He was due a 2yr check last november, I've chased it up but he's still not been sent for!

Sad to say we'll be going private as soon as we can afford a good level of cover. I hate the idea of the UK going private like the US and I know that the more people who jump ship, the more likely that is, but when it comes to your family's health what choice is there but to be selfish?

My father-in-law had a heart attack and required a triple bypass 18 months ago... he was under NHS care for the first few weeks after his heart attack before looking into his work contract and realising that he had significant health cover through his work, at which point he immediately switched to private. The difference in the service these days is staggering. The NHS is being deliberately drained of funds and the level of patient care is starting to falter badly.

This is IN NO WAY the fault of the doctors, nurses, or any of the other front-line staff. It is 100% political.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Toy Soldier

Sad to say we'll be going private as soon as we can afford a good level of cover. I hate the idea of the UK going private like the US and I know that the more people who jump ship, the more likely that is, but when it comes to your family's health what choice is there but to be selfish?

My father-in-law had a heart attack and required a triple bypass 18 months ago... he was under NHS care for the first few weeks after his heart attack before looking into his work contract and realising that he had significant health cover through his work, at which point he immediately switched to private. The difference in the service these days is staggering. The NHS is being deliberately drained of funds and the level of patient care is starting to falter badly.

This is IN NO WAY the fault of the doctors, nurses, or any of the other front-line staff. It is 100% political.

Agree with all that TS, they kind of have us with complex care needs over a barrel, haven't even looked into costing but what other option is there with the waiting times? I also feel it is 100% funding and not care that is the issue.