[Withano]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

He talks of having to refuse to marry underage girls, being bribed not to speak out, being against genital mutilation, amongst other things, today in Australia. This suggests,like here, these practices are still common place in more than a tiny minority of people.

Lets not act as if the average ultright-winger wouldnt lump this bloke with this group if they saw him on the street. This is the issue, people blindly categorising others based on preconceptions. If a person chooses to preconceive, and live their life hating others because they presume 'more than a tiny minority' want these laws in place then they're the problem. They live a life of hatred, and these people are more evil than the average Muslim.

There are evil non-religious people too, can you imagine what the IQ of a person that believes all non-religious people must be evil based on this fact must be. Thats a great leap of logic, and their opinion of non-religious people was probably swayed by an equally evil person of power that also lives a life of hatred.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Withano

Lets not act as if the average ultright-winger wouldnt lump this bloke with this group if they saw him on the street. This is the issue, people blindly categorising others based on preconceptions. If a person chooses to preconceive, and live their life hating others because they presume 'more than a tiny minority' want these laws in place then they're the problem. They live a life of hatred, and these people are more evil than the average Muslim.

There are evil non-religious people too, can you imagine what the IQ of a person that believes all non-religious people must be evil based on this fact must be. Thats a great leap of logic, and their opinion of non-religious people was probably swayed by an equally evil person of power that also lives a life of hatred.

I lean slightly right when it comes to mass immigration of religions that refuse to integrate into countries they choose to live in. We see this happening right across the West. No one is expecting people to abandon their religous beliefs just those that represent views and practices that go against the belief systems of the countries they choose to live in.

There has to be some give and take when expecting the host country to offer you all the same privilidges it offers its natural citizens. All we seem to get presented with in return is an arrogance and sense of entitlement that it's their right to carry on as if they still lived in the Middle East. They take but they don't give back. From what I see such disprespect is pretty hateful in itself. This constant sticking two-fingers up at our beliefs and way of life, whilst at the same time enjoying all the benefits of it. Why are you so surprised at the result?

Most reasonable people would expect to assimilate into a country they choose to live and respect their way of life, and, if necessary, adjust certain behaviours at odds with that way of life. It isn't rocket science just commonsense and respect. Respect works both ways. Why do some constantly make exceptions for certain religions? Negative actions tend to get negative results.

In my opinion this man in courageous, honourable and respectful, and therefore worthy of respect, and I believe most would welcome this type of Muslim. It is not the West that are the unreasonable ones here.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I lean slightly right when it comes to mass immigration of religions that refuse to integrate into countries they choose to live in. We see this happening right across the West. No one is expecting people to abandon their religous beliefs just those that represent views and practices that go against the belief systems of the countries they choose to live in.

Sorry, I dont see the relevance. Like sorry, I dont care.

Originally Posted by Brillopad

There has to be some give and take when expecting the host country to offer you all the same privilidges it offers its natural citizens. All we seem to get presented with in return is an arrogance and sense of entitlement that it's their right to carry on as if they still lived in the Middle East. They take but they don't give back. From what I see such disprespect is pretty hateful in itself. This constant sticking two-fingers up at our beliefs and way of life, whilst at the same time enjoying all the benefits of it. Why are you so surprised at the result?

Thats a problem with the media you read, if I only received my news updates from 'I hate ponies magazine', I'd probably feel as if they were a larger issue that they are, and would probably make sweeping generalisations about them all.

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Most reasonable people would expect to assimilate into a country they choose to live and respect their way of life, and, if necessary, adjust certain behaviours at odds with that way of life. It isn't rocket science just commonsense and respect. Respect works both ways. Why do some constantly make exceptions for certain religions? Negative actions tend to get negative results.

True, and most do. But you dont pay attention to the millions when theres a few that do not do this. Which is odd. You should work on this.

Originally Posted by Brillopad

In my opinion this man in courageous, honourable and respectful, and therefore worthy of respect, and I believe most would welcome this type of Muslim.

Agreed

Originally Posted by Brillopad

It is not the West that are the unreasonable ones here.

Bit hard to believe you dont at least think there are some unreasonable people of the west after this rant.

None of this is really relevant to the point I was making, its odd that you would quote me in it.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Withano

Sorry, I dont see the relevance. Like sorry, I dont care.


Thats a problem with the media you read, if I only received my news updates from 'I hate ponies magazine', I'd probably feel as if they were a larger issue that they are, and would probably make sweeping generalisations about them all.


True, and most do. But you dont pay attention to the millions when theres a few that do not do this. Which is odd. You should work on this.


Agreed


Bit hard to believe you dont at least think there are some unreasonable people of the west after this rant.

None of this is really relevant to the point I was making

Oops, did I get so engrossed in my own rant I overlooked yours.

Point being I think is that most of the unreasonable ones in the West are created by the unreasonable from the ME who just expect it to be a one-way street - theirs.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Oops, did I get so engrossed in my own rant I overlooked yours.

Point being I think is that most of the unreasonable ones in the West are created by the unreasonable from the ME who just expect it to be a one-way street - theirs.

Thats cool, I disagree, but this isnt relevant to the OP or any posts that I made so I'm not sure why youre quoting me and telling me this here

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I lean slightly right when it comes to mass immigration of religions that refuse to integrate into countries they choose to live in. We see this happening right across the West. No one is expecting people to abandon their religous beliefs just those that represent views and practices that go against the belief systems of the countries they choose to live in.

There has to be some give and take when expecting the host country to offer you all the same privilidges it offers its natural citizens. All we seem to get presented with in return is an arrogance and sense of entitlement that it's their right to carry on as if they still lived in the Middle East. They take but they don't give back. From what I see such disprespect is pretty hateful in itself. This constant sticking two-fingers up at our beliefs and way of life, whilst at the same time enjoying all the benefits of it. Why are you so surprised at the result?

Most reasonable people would expect to assimilate into a country they choose to live and respect their way of life, and, if necessary, adjust certain behaviours at odds with that way of life. It isn't rocket science just commonsense and respect. Respect works both ways. Why do some constantly make exceptions for certain religions? Negative actions tend to get negative results.

In my opinion this man in courageous, honourable and respectful, and therefore worthy of respect, and I believe most would welcome this type of Muslim. It is not the West that are the unreasonable ones here.

You don't know much about our recent colonial/ missionary past do you?

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

You don't know much about our recent colonial/ missionary past do you?

I'm not so much interested in historical events as the here and now. We can't change the past.

Neither am I so insecure that I believe we should forever feel apologetic about the alleged actions of past generations and certainly not to the point of the destruction of our own identity and way of life - that fragile belief didn't get the Germans very far did it?

[Parmy]

Bin laden lives!!

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I'm not so much interested in historical events as the here and now. We can't change the past.

Neither am I so insecure that I believe we should forever feel apologetic about the alleged actions of past generations and certainly not to the point of the destruction of our own identity and way of life - that fragile belief didn't get the Germans very far did it?

How very convenient for you to ignore our past as murdering immigrants.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by Kizzy

How very convenient for you to ignore our past as murdering immigrants.

Is that how you see yourself? It certainly isn't how I see myself. I fail to see what that has to do with current issues.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

Is that how you see yourself? It certainly isn't how I see myself. I fail to see what that has to do with current issues.

No, you have blocked that right out haven't you? It wasn't that long ago, think South Africa, Ireland the gulf and Libya it could be forgiven if we didn't keep doing it.

You brought up assimilating into other cultures... Have we ever done that?

[DemolitionRed]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

I'm not so much interested in historical events as the here and now. We can't change the past.

Neither am I so insecure that I believe we should forever feel apologetic about the alleged actions of past generations and certainly not to the point of the destruction of our own identity and way of life - that fragile belief didn't get the Germans very far did it?

How can you say you don’t care about history when the history we are talking about is so recent? If history doesn’t matter, then does 9/11 not matter? Before 9/11 there was relative peace in the Middle East and the countries that are now in chaos were stable regions with long term leaders and relatively good economies. For the past 14 years we have played our hand in the upheaval and the deaths of millions of Muslims and we are now seeing the consequences of that involvement.

Its fundamentally important to understand what these repercussions are about because if we don’t, we may as well just fall down the rabbit hole where we can wallow in our own fear and ignorance.

You recently tried to deal me a low blow by suggesting, (tongue in cheek) that I was a terrorist sympathiser. Those words told me two things, 1) that you don't know or don't care about the atrocities we have committed and 2) Unlike me, who's sympathies lie with both the innocent westerners and Middle East civilians who get caught up in the political backlash, you have little sympathy for the later.

[Withano]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

How can you say you don’t care about history when the history we are talking about is so recent? If history doesn’t matter, then does 9/11 not matter? Before 9/11 there was relative peace in the Middle East and the countries that are now in chaos were stable regions with long term leaders and relatively good economies. For the past 14 years we have played our hand in the upheaval and the deaths of millions of Muslims and we are now seeing the consequences of that involvement.

Its fundamentally important to understand what these repercussions are about because if we don’t, we may as well just fall down the rabbit hole where we can wallow in our own fear and ignorance.

You recently tried to deal me a low blow by suggesting, (tongue in cheek) that I was a terrorist sympathiser. Those words told me two things, 1) that you don't know or don't care about the atrocities we have committed and 2) Unlike me, who's sympathies lie with both the innocent westerners and Middle East civilians who get caught up in the political backlash, you have little sympathy for the later.

[Brillopad]

Originally Posted by DemolitionRed

How can you say you don’t care about history when the history we are talking about is so recent? If history doesn’t matter, then does 9/11 not matter? Before 9/11 there was relative peace in the Middle East and the countries that are now in chaos were stable regions with long term leaders and relatively good economies. For the past 14 years we have played our hand in the upheaval and the deaths of millions of Muslims and we are now seeing the consequences of that involvement.

Its fundamentally important to understand what these repercussions are about because if we don’t, we may as well just fall down the rabbit hole where we can wallow in our own fear and ignorance.

You recently tried to deal me a low blow by suggesting, (tongue in cheek) that I was a terrorist sympathiser. Those words told me two things, 1) that you don't know or don't care about the atrocities we have committed and 2) Unlike me, who's sympathies lie with both the innocent westerners and Middle East civilians who get caught up in the political backlash, you have little sympathy for the later.

If you read the post properly you will see that the poster talks of our past 'as murdering immigrants' which clearly refers to historical events of long ago.

As for more recent events, what I don't believe is that we can ignore or fail to act when terrorist acts such as 9/11 take place on Western soil for fear of future reprisals - do you suggest we just allow terrorists to 'win', hope they will just go away or just give in. If we do many more people will die in the long-term.

Mass Immigration is not any kind of solution as it only serves to allow more terrorists access to the West creating more danger for all of us us as we then have to fear attack from home grown terrorists - the enemy within - as well.

The West has every right to protect itself from terrorism.

[Kizzy]

Originally Posted by Brillopad

If you read the post properly you will see that the poster talks of our past 'as murdering immigrants' which clearly refers to historical events of long ago.

It doesn't you've chosen to look at it that way as it gives you an excuse to keep those blinkers firmly affixed.